When ETTL is really necessary?

Hello,
I wish to have a setup with 2 (or 3) Speedlight 430 EX II with the relative umbrellas.. softbox etc.

Initially my first thought was to have a ST-E2 commanding those Speedlights.
But I discovered that infrared transmission is not so perfect and I discarded this idea.


Searching more info I now know that there is the "pocket wizard" technology that offers reliable radio transmission.. keeping all the ETTL features.

This solution has 2 problems.
- pocket wizards toys are not so cheap
- if I decide someday to switch to Nikon/Sony/Pentax i would have thrown away lot of money
- if I wish to share my flashes with a friend that is not a Canon user, he will not get all the benefit from Pocket Wizards dedicated to Canon.

So...
I'm wondering when ETTL is really necessary and when it is not.

When it is necessary... I think:
- A wedding.. a main photographer holding on camera flash and an assistant holding a second flash.. they move around and in this situation ETTL and automatic flash power can be really useful!

When it is not necessary.. I think:
a classic pose shoot.. the model sitting somewhere, and the speedlights are places in fixed place and I've all the time to decide how much light each of them should flash..

I think that a radio solution without ETTL might be:
- cheaper (and I can invest the saving in a 3rd speedlight or diffusers.. and so on
- can be even used on a different brand from Canon


What do you think? Which are the real world example when an automatic ETTL solution is absolutely useful?

Thank you!

ETTL, as you noted, is useful --essential-- when the subject is mobile relative to the light source.
When the light can be placed and maintained at a consistent distance from the subject, then manual is useful and certainly less costly to implement.

If you are shooting with a Canon camera and compatible speedlites another option for ETTL is the YN-622c. There is a lengthly thread on this forum describing how they work and user experiences.

A third option, although more costly initially, is the new Canon 600EX-RT. If you plan to grow with Canon that is a reasonable option since it includes flash units and radio transmission capabilities in a single unit.

I exclude Canon 600.. it doesn't give the opportunity to buy cheaper speedlites supporting Radio triggering...

Have you some other real-life example of the use of Flashes with moving subject?
I am very newbie.. and just thought about a wedding...

Basically I wish mostly to improve in portraiture (where probably ETTL is not so necessary) but I'm trying to figure out if I am missing some fields where ETTL would be very useful for me.

ETTL is useful any time the distance between the subject(s) and flash(es) is changing during the shoot, especially when it's changing quickly. I second the suggestion that you take a look at Yongnuo's YN-622C transceivers; they're relatively cheap (around 85 to 90 US$ for a pair) and apparently work very well. Here's the YN-622C thread dmward mentioned above - https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1212530

Buy the 622c's, they are an excellent value, and you'll be needing triggers anyway.

zulutown wrote in post #15241081
So...
I'm wondering when ETTL is really necessary and when it is not.

ETTL is never really necessary.

In the "olden days", we typically used flash units with fixed output and dialed the aperture ring to a value based on a calculation based on camera-subject distance and a "guide number".

I had various filters for my Honeywell Strobonar flash unit that would widen the beam (using fresnel lens techniques), change the color of the beam (like a colored gel), and reduce the intensity of the beam (neutral density filters).

I never felt that I needed today's ETTL magic to produce excellent flash photos either indoors or out. I shot track-side photos at many a night-time drag race with my Strobonar doing the primary illumination.

SkipD wrote in post #15241737
ETTL is never really necessary.

In the "olden days", we typically used flash units with fixed output and dialed the aperture ring to a value based on a calculation based on camera-subject distance and a "guide number".

I had various filters for my Honeywell Strobonar flash unit that would widen the beam (using fresnel lens techniques), change the color of the beam (like a colored gel), and reduce the intensity of the beam (neutral density filters).

I never felt that I needed today's ETTL magic to produce excellent flash photos either indoors or out. I shot track-side photos at many a night-time drag race with my Strobonar doing the primary illumination.

Skip, when I started doing commercial photography and weddings there weren't even light meters in the camera. We had to actually decide what f stop and shutter speed to use. And the big graphflex strobe and its 9 volt batteries weight several times what the camera weighed.

That was then this is now -- I love ETTL and modern cameras. No desire to relive the past.

For the OP, if the subject is moving relative to the light source ETTL will be beneficial. If the subject is static relative to the light source ETTL offers no advantage over manual and is likely to deliver variable exposures as the subject moves around on the stool or T reference.

(In case you haven't seen the term before T reference is the T one puts on the floor, with gaffers tape, at the point where the lighting is aimed so the talent knows where to stand.)

dmward wrote in post #15241818
That was then this is now -- I love ETTL and modern cameras. No desire to relive the past.

I didn't say above that I don't like ETTL. It's definitely a time-saver though one has to know how to control it at times. The question was, though, is ETTL really necessary. I still think the answer to that is "no".

I rarely use ETTL, I find it a bit hit and miss, especially with off camera flash.

SkipD wrote in post #15242297
I didn't say above that I don't like ETTL. It's definitely a time-saver though one has to know how to control it at times. The question was, though, is ETTL really necessary. I still think the answer to that is "no".

Agreed, not necessary.

But much easier for certain situations.

yogestee wrote in post #15242514
I rarely use ETTL, I find it a bit hit and miss, especially with off camera flash.

Using ETTL with off camera flash is an art. Well, at least I think so because I like it.

Takes some planning to get it just right.

I will go a step farther and say that there are a few times where not only is ETTL not necessary, but it can be an impediment. ETTL metering means you adjust for each shot, but when you need shot to shot consistency using ETTL can be a problem. A slight bit of movement of a white or black element within a frame can cause ETTL to change exposure even though the lighting of the scene hasnt changed. ETTL is a great tool and sometimes its handy for off camera work but other times its not worth the hassle.

I can't imagine not having ettl for event work. Sure, you can set the flash on manual and adjust the aperture on the fly, but in my experience, I get more keepers using ettl. ettl doesn't always get it right, or sometimes it gets fooled, but the number of shots that I dump because of that is pretty low.

gonzogolf wrote in post #15243148
I will go a step farther and say that there are few times where not only is ETTL not necessary, but it can be an impediment. ETTL metering means you adjust for each shot, but when you need shot to shot consistency using ETTL can be a problem. A slight bit of movement of a white or black element within a frame can cause ETTL to change exposure even though the lighting of the scene hasnt changed. ETTL is a great tool and sometimes its handy for off camera work but other times its not worth the hassle.

Given the pace of a wedding, even the "portrait session" or whatever one calls the artsy shots of bride and groom, ETTL whether on camera or off makes things so much easier.

Here are two shots from a recent wedding. I had a 600EX-RT on a light stand so turned off the flash on the 600EX-RT that was on camera and fired away. Used EC to get the ambient where I wanted it, used FEC to get the flash where I wanted it. The whole series took 25 minutes, included about 6 different sets with bride or bride and groom at 4 different locations. This is the first and last images from the series.

All off camera flash, all ETTL.

dmward wrote in post #15243126
Using ETTL with off camera flash is an art. Well, at least I think so because I like it.

Takes some planning to get it just right.

So does off camera flash with both flash and camera set to manual. Just the "art" of exposure reading with flash on manual takes a lot of planning and the use of the organ between one's ears.