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Thread started 18 Nov 2012 (Sunday) 20:47
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5D3 in-camera crop cannot be undone in Lightroom?

 
ToddR
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Nov 18, 2012 20:47 |  #1

Earlier today, I was shooting some images on my 5D3 that I knew were destined for 4:5 (or 8:10) crop. I turned on the "Add cropping information: Aspect ratio 4:5" option in the camera.

This allowed me to review the images on the back of the camera with a line on both sides that represented what would initially need to be cropped away to change aspect ratios. I figured I would need to slide the crop box to one side or the other in post to get the desired framing, so I was really just using it as a reference.

When I brought the RAW images into Lightroom 4.2, to my great dismay :shock:, I could not see the pixels outside of the 4:5 bars. It was as if they were never there, and the image was 4:5 right out of the camera instead of the usual native 2:3. Look on the camera, and they're there. Lightroom, gone. This left me with numerous images with the edge of the subject cut off just a bit, ruining them. I was shooting from an awkward position, so framing was a challenge, and I intended to easily fix that by cropping in post along with cropping to the intended 4:5 ratio.

Fortunately, I was able to edit them in DPP and get what I wanted, but it was a pain because I haven't used that program in a few years. At least it let me "uncrop" to the camera's full image, and then I could place the actual 4:5 crop where I wanted it without anything being thrown overboard beforehand.

I did some searching but wasn't finding much. This problem renders that option completely useless if Lightroom throws out the data beyond the chosen crop aspect ratio.

Lightroom briefly displayed them with black bars, like a letterboxed movie, before cropping them to the in-camera option. A Develop Settings/Reset didn't revert it.

I hope someone will point out an obvious solution or workaround for this.


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FlyingPhotog
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Nov 18, 2012 20:52 |  #2

So in the develop module, when you click on the crop tool, there was nothing outside the 4:5 aspect and no option to Reset Crop?

And these were raw and not jpeg?


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ToddR
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Nov 18, 2012 21:03 |  #3

Yes, I was working with RAW files.

Entering the Crop tool on any of these images brings up the (what I know to be cropped) image with the drag frame/bounding bars matching the dimensions of the whole image. If I hit reset, nothing happens. "As Shot," "Original," or "4x5/8x10" still stays at the full dimensions. Normally, if you pulled up a regular image that didn't have this in-camera crop information in it, and chose, say, 4x5, the bars would immediately reflect those new, proposed proportions in a centered fashion, and one could drag and/or resize as desired.

Bring up the same image in DPP, and you will see the in-camera crop. However, the reset (or clear or whatever it was) will reinstate the pixels on the left and right sides that the in-camera crop tool declared as out of bounds. Can't see those pixels in Lightroom.


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FlyingPhotog
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Nov 18, 2012 21:07 |  #4

That's really odd. I have 4:5 bars enabled on both my 1DMkIVs and my 1DMkIII but that has zero effect on the actual shot.

Is there an actual menu setting for in-camera crop on the 5D3?


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ToddR
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Nov 18, 2012 22:40 |  #5

Yes, in C.Fn3.

It offers six ratios, and off.

Quoting from p. 320 in the user manual:

"When you take a picture, the aspect ratio information for cropping the image with the provided software will be appended to the image. (The image is recorded to the card without being cropped.) After the image is transferred to a personal computer, you can use Digital Photo Professional (provided software) to easily crop the image to the aspect ratio that was set."

So, DPP can recognize it, and one can ultimately revert to native ratio and do whatever with it, as would be expected.

Lightroom initially reacts to it, because it briefly shows things with black "letterbox" bars and then seems to "zoom in" as it (seemingly permanently) adopts presentation of the image with the aspect ratio chosen in-camera, with no apparent means to undo.


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Nov 18, 2012 23:19 |  #6

That sounds like the LR developers tried but messed up an attempt to adapt to the camera settings.

You could ask on a Lightroom forum, but if I were you I would file a bug report pronto:

http://feedback.photos​hop.com/ (external link)


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Nov 18, 2012 23:23 |  #7

Doubly Weird because LR isn't known to read camera settings like DPP does.

I think I'd contact Adobe and pick their collective brain on this one. ???


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Nov 18, 2012 23:26 |  #8

tonylong wrote in post #15262367 (external link)
That sounds like the LR developers tried but messed up an attempt to adapt to the camera settings.

You could ask on a Lightroom forum, but if I were you I would file a bug report pronto:

http://feedback.photos​hop.com/ (external link)


FOR SURE -- FILE THE BUG REPORT!

I meant to yell. :-) I've been tempted to use that "feature" on my 5DIIIs a couple of times. Thanks for saving me. :-) Good to know that at least the DPP will find the lost data. (Although I don't even have it loaded.)


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tonylong
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Nov 18, 2012 23:39 |  #9

FlyingPhotog wrote in post #15262376 (external link)
Doubly Weird because LR isn't known to read camera settings like DPP does.

Generally they ignore most settings -- they check the White Balance, and do a "so-so" job with Highlight Tone Priority, I'm not sure about other settings like Auto Lighting Optimizer. With HTP, the camera underexposes by a stop. Lightroom "reads" the setting and applies a curve "under the hood" to boost everything but the highlights. I prefer to handle the exposure myself!

But it sound like this problem is "unexplored territory"!

I think I'd contact Adobe and pick their collective brain on this one. ???

The forum is a good place because it's "inhabited" by some of the developers, but also the Bug Report would be a way of getting some attention!


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tzalman
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Nov 19, 2012 02:57 |  #10

This bug was reported some time ago and Adobe has already come up- with a temporary solution. No doubt a fix will be included in future updates, probably 4.3 when it is released in a couple weeks.
http://labsdownload.ad​obe.com …oomplugins_dngr​e_docs.pdf (external link)
http://labs.adobe.com …ologies/lightro​omplugins/ (external link)


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René ­ Damkot
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Nov 19, 2012 03:52 |  #11

Now that's a bug :eek:


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ToddR
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Nov 19, 2012 08:34 |  #12

tzalman wrote in post #15262753 (external link)
This bug was reported some time ago and Adobe has already come up- with a temporary solution. No doubt a fix will be included in future updates, probably 4.3 when it is released in a couple weeks.
http://labsdownload.ad​obe.com …oomplugins_dngr​e_docs.pdf (external link)
http://labs.adobe.com …ologies/lightro​omplugins/ (external link)

In light of this information, I'll make the assumption that they're properly aware of it and not file my own report.

I hope it's fixed in 4.3!

I was thinking the other day about shooting some square images of my son for this multi-panel wooden frame thing my mother has. Guess I won't be using the 1:1 in-camera crop, because I can't guarantee the square portion I'd want from the frame would be the exact center area the in-camera crop would use. ;)


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Nov 20, 2012 04:00 |  #13

This happened to me a few years ago when i got my Canon S95. It shoots natively at 4:3 but you could set the AR in camera to be 3:2 when shooting raw. This turned out to be the camera applying a crop to the full image, and when imported in to DPP this crop could be reversed or changed etc.
At the time LR wasnt fully supporting this camera so all image were 4:3. When LR did finally support the S95 it would honour the in camera crop, and it wasn't reversible, just as the OP is saying.


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5D3 in-camera crop cannot be undone in Lightroom?
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