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Thread started 29 Nov 2012 (Thursday) 01:13
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I don't envy you school photographers

 
tfizzle
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Nov 29, 2012 01:13 |  #1

So I've been doing paid photography work for about 3 years now and it's been a joy. I absolutely love doing it. I just finished out my retake day for school photos and it's been the most draining photography experience I have had. I enjoyed making the money. I enjoyed the process of taking photos.

However, I don't enjoy the knit-pickiness of it all. As in the tons of orders to get ready, to prepare, to deliver, to retake, to refund, etc. Then there's always a few parents that blame the photographer if their kid doesn't look good (parents send them to school with messed up hair) and it ends up costing more printing/time/money. My batting average wasn't bad. Just 8 retakes and only 1 refund out of 200ish orders. But the weird reactions of parents is what makes me giggle cynically.

If 1 order gets messed up, the kid loses it, or fails on my end (wrong number down out of 200) then it seems to me that the automatic response from parents is, "I hate this. Are you trying to scam me!" etc. etc.

I got that email today with a mix-up with an order. They hadn't received their photos and their first email was that my company was scamming them. However, it was just a simple mistake of their order form sticking to the back of another one and being overlooked. Once I responded nicely, told them it was my fault, and that I'd give a refund they were actually cordial about it. I guess that's just human nature (thinking the worst).

Anyway, I don't envy you school photographers one bit. I'd rather shoot a full-day wedding than a full-day of school photos. Keep up the good work!




  
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Mr.Kenmuir
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Nov 29, 2012 02:57 |  #2

May I ask what are your packages/prices for School Photos?


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glumpy
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Nov 29, 2012 06:14 |  #3
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Schools are something I'd never do.
The numbers are too high, the attitudes and mentality is crazy, the schools are demanding pains in the arse to deal with and it's all just too big a scale for me to want to deal with.

I used to run the lab of a company that did a lot of school photos and it was just stupid. The competition was so high and the only think that justified their meagre profit ratio was the literally millions of kids they shot a year.
The company was still a bunch of penny pinching tightwads just like the clients.

I get a good enough taste of what you are going through right now.
MY phone company stuffed up and was not saving my messages. One company where I had shot their kids was trying to ring me and I never knew. The manager finally caught me in person and was carrying on like I had stolen the crown Jewels. All I heard when I asked her " Why didn't you just email me if you got no response after a week? " was crickets. She knows bloody well when I work and can't take calls because her centre runs the same hours as everyone elses in the industry!

Then I got grief over the 8 complaints out of 1400 kids we shot. When I got her to send me what " We hadn't delivered and the people paid for" I found I had indeed not fulfilled 3 orders. All Disks I somehow marked as done when they weren't. My fault, no question... except how the hell I stuffed them up?

The other 5 " Customers" had never placed an order or paid for anything at all!
I checked and rechecked the orders, checked the order numbers and they were all there so it was impossible we missed them. One client even said I promised her retouching which was ridiculous because when I saw the image and the request, it was not even remotely feasible and I certainly NEVER promise anything like major retouching of a kids Face!

I had one guy order a print and told me if it wasn't ready to pick up next week " he'd track me down to siberia" You'd never be able to find me in siberia, have you ever been there? He said grufly, " NO" I said " Never have I, I hate the cold and wouldn't go near the place".
I later found out he was an ex- politician that resigned in disgrace in 2007 to avoid a corruption investigation. :lol:

One woman recently complained my Photos made her Daughter look fat. Yeah well the kids about 3 times the weight she ought to be but on the bright side, Anexoria is not something you are going to have to worry about her suffering from in the forseeable future. :rolleyes:

I never cease to be amused at how picky some parents can be over nothing and others will buy crap pics where it was impossible to get the kids to look in the general direction of the camera let alone smile or look in any way life like!

I got this kiler shot of a kid last week in the most unreal pose a barely walking kid could be imagined doing. I was itching to show the mother what a legend shooter I was. There were 3 pics of her kid, 2 were nice enough but run of the mill and the killer, put on all my advertising, enter in the awards, make that my signature shot.
She loved the boring shots and was completely unfussed on the best one of all time.

Another parent came over to the sales table and I said to them, tell me which pic do you like best? I flicked through the first 2 then the killer shot. The woman obviously was impressed as hell with the last one but also caught the mothers I'm not sure I like it vibe. In the end there were 3 other mothers oohing and ahhing over the shot and asking "why didn't you get a shot of my kid like that" so the mother took it.
My girl told me when she picked it up, she looked at it and was still very ho hum but was beaming at the other 2.
Amazing.

On the upside, sometimes you get the parents that are just so over the top and thankful you feel a bit " Fake" in that you only took the good looking, co operative kids pic and put no effort into it at all compared to some, but they carry on like you just carried their kid out of a burning building that collapsed 10 sec later. :o

A little appreciation and thanks goes a long way though and offsets the whining ingrates.

I shoot an amout of 6 month olds up and some of them are just so incredibly cute and sweet, I think " It would be nice to have another kid."
I then think of the 2 teenagers I have at home and all those warm and fuzzy thoughts go right out the window and I wonder What the hell induced that momentary brain malfunction??

 :o


From RDKirk: First, let me check the forum heading...yes, it does say "Business of Photography" and not "Hobby of Photography." Okay. So we're talking about making money, not about hobbies. By "business" I am presuming activities that pay expenses and produce a profit over the long term.

  
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cdifoto
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Nov 29, 2012 06:25 |  #4

glumpy wrote in post #15303429 (external link)
Schools are something I'd never do.
The numbers are too high, the attitudes and mentality is crazy, the schools are demanding pains in the arse to deal with and it's all just too big a scale for me to want to deal with.

I used to run the lab of a company that did a lot of school photos and it was just stupid. The competition was so high and the only think that justified their meagre profit ratio was the literally millions of kids they shot a year.
The company was still a bunch of penny pinching tightwads just like the clients.

All this time I thought you were the Sultan of Scale and the Prince of Meager Profit Ratios. Go figure.

glumpy wrote in post #15303429 (external link)
Then I got grief over the 8 complaints out of 1400 kids we shot. When I got her to send me what " We hadn't delivered and the people paid for" I found I had indeed not fulfilled 3 orders. All Disks I somehow marked as done when they weren't. My fault, no question... except how the hell I stuffed them up?

So, wait. You ARE the Sultan of Scale?

Which is it, Glumpster, do you do insane volume or do you not?


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Paulstw
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Nov 29, 2012 06:26 as a reply to  @ glumpy's post |  #5

I actually work in a private school. I'm the IT guy, and they've just noticed I take pictures so i'm staying away from that one.

I do however sympathise with you. I've seen the totally unrealistic expectations teachers and parents have for anything that an outside company have to offer, and they are constantly pushing the boundary of what's an extra on top of what they have paid for.

I have to sink behind my desk sometimes when I hear what goes on. We get class photos done every year, and even that is a nightmare. We've gone through a different photographer every year and it's no wonder if this is the sort of thing you have to deal with.

Paul




  
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cdifoto
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Nov 29, 2012 06:32 |  #6

glumpy wrote in post #15303429 (external link)
I got this kiler shot of a kid last week in the most unreal pose a barely walking kid could be imagined doing. I was itching to show the mother what a legend shooter I was. There were 3 pics of her kid, 2 were nice enough but run of the mill and the killer, put on all my advertising, enter in the awards, make that my signature shot.
She loved the boring shots and was completely unfussed on the best one of all time.

Probably because that's not how she sees her kid every day and it was weird to her. It would be amazing to you because you accomplished something and you don't know the kid. It could be amazing for advertising because no one else sees the kid every day. To people who know the kid, it would be unnatural akin to liquifying 180lbs off of a 300lb customer.


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glumpy
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Nov 29, 2012 08:25 |  #7
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cdifoto wrote in post #15303441 (external link)
All this time I thought you were the Sultan of Scale and the Prince of Meager Profit Ratios. Go figure.

Hahaha! Meager profit ratios.

Who cares about Profits?
It's all about doing quality work and your reputation Right? :lol:

Which is it, Glumpster, do you do insane volume or do you not?

No, I don't do insane Volume.
I am able to handle it quite easily and with plenty of time to spare on what is allocated.


From RDKirk: First, let me check the forum heading...yes, it does say "Business of Photography" and not "Hobby of Photography." Okay. So we're talking about making money, not about hobbies. By "business" I am presuming activities that pay expenses and produce a profit over the long term.

  
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cdifoto
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Nov 29, 2012 08:28 |  #8

glumpy wrote in post #15303660 (external link)
Hahaha! Meager profit ratios.

Who cares about Profits? It's all about doing quality work and your reputation Right? :lol:

No, I don't do insane Volume.
I am able to handle it quite easily and with plenty of time to spare on what is allocated.

Missing orders doesn't sound like "quite easily and with plenty of time to spare" to me...


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HiepBuiPhotography
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Nov 29, 2012 08:39 |  #9

glumpy wrote in post #15303660 (external link)
No, I don't do insane Volume.
I am able to handle it quite easily and with plenty of time to spare on what is allocated.

Wait, I just want to clarify. The OP said that he shot 200 kids and you said something along the lines of "I don't shoot schools because there are too many kids" but turn around and say "I shot 1400 kids, etc etc."

Isn't that an "insane volume"? :D


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cdifoto
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Nov 29, 2012 09:08 |  #10

HiepBuiPhotography wrote in post #15303707 (external link)
Wait, I just want to clarify. The OP said that he shot 200 kids and you said something along the lines of "I don't shoot schools because there are too many kids" but turn around and say "I shot 1400 kids, etc etc."

Isn't that an "insane volume"? :D

Most BSers will out themselves when they keep talking. They can't keep their lies straight, forget the old ones, and slip up with contradictions.


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HiepBuiPhotography
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Nov 29, 2012 10:17 |  #11

cdifoto wrote in post #15303790 (external link)
Most BSers will out themselves when they keep talking. They can't keep their lies straight, forget the old ones, and slip up with contradictions.

Haha. I'm going to let him explain before I make any conclusions :D


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ssim
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Nov 29, 2012 12:32 as a reply to  @ HiepBuiPhotography's post |  #12

I've done many schools over the past several years and it is not one of the most enjoyable shoots but it has proved to be profitable. These are not supposed to portraits in the sense that many parents think they should be. It would be great if you could take some of the parents out of the process. Almost every school that I did I was warned by the school coordinator about certain parents that will always send the pictures back for retakes and make a big deal of it. It is one of those things that you simply have to accept in this. Some these parents were simply wanting to have two different set of prints to choose from (as they had done previously) but I made a point of telling them that if they send them back they are obligated to either accept the re-shoot or nothing. I found that with when you are dealing with large numbers like you do in school photography you have to have some very black and white policies and stick to them.


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huntersdad
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Nov 29, 2012 12:54 |  #13

My daughter's day care does shoots every 3 months or so. Thus far, she has been there for 2 - one a well known professional and the other a small, local studio (or so we'll call it). Her previous daycare did 2 while we were there too.

As of today, we haven't bought a single picture. For the professional shooter, his samples all cut some portion of her off - feet, hands, top of her head. His white BG wasn't nearly blown enough for the look he was going for either. But the biggest disappointment of the 2 was presentation. Never give a parent a sample with a bodt part cut off - immediate elimination.

The second shooter has my daughter so small in the picture that it looks more like a bunch of props with a kid in there than a kid with a bunch of props. Her BG was black and it doesn't look black and is extrememly low quality as you can see through it. In this case, IT'S ABOUT THE CHILD, NOT YOUR DAMN PROPS!!

They've asked me about doing some, but not sure I even want to go down that road. And, yes, I am the photographer who is gonna critique everything, but some things shouldn't be missed.

For you guys doing this for a living, I'll pray for you.


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HiepBuiPhotography
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Nov 29, 2012 13:26 |  #14

You should do one of your daughter for yourself personally, then show all the parents at the daycare and voila, business through the door :D


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Nov 29, 2012 13:31 |  #15

cdifoto wrote in post #15303441 (external link)
All this time I thought you were the Sultan of Scale and the Prince of Meager Profit Ratios. Go figure.


So, wait. You ARE the Sultan of Scale?

Which is it, Glumpster, do you do insane volume or do you not?

I can always count on your posts to brighten my day :lol:.


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I don't envy you school photographers
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