speedlite or monolight for background

Never considered using my 430EX as a background light instead of one of my four Genesis 200 lights. Would this give me any advantage considering my studio is in my basement and relatively cramped?

I think that any speedlight is inherently disadvantaged for background lighting, as it forces you to shoot and chimp many times during placement, so that you can SEE how it falls in position relative to your subject. I think that anyone learning lighting is seriously disadvantaged with speedlights simply because you cannot immediately SEE the effect, you have to shoot and chimp a lot.

coeng wrote in post #15389243
Never considered using my 430EX as a background light instead of one of my four Genesis 200 lights. Would this give me any advantage considering my studio is in my basement and relatively cramped?

Wilt wrote in post #15389382
I think that any speedlight is inherently disadvantaged for background lighting, as it forces you to shoot and chimp many times during placement, so that you can SEE how it falls in position relative to your subject. I think that anyone learning lighting is seriously disadvantaged with speedlights simply because you cannot immediately SEE the effect, you have to shoot and chimp a lot.

All of Wilt's comments plus:
If you've got 'em, then use 'em. It is far more productive to use something where you can see the effect/intensity/posit​ioning immediately rather than 'chimping' in a studio situation. With experience, you can 'get away' with speedlights in many situations but they are never going to be as easy/instantly accurate as monolights, especially if you don't have/don't use a meter - why make life difficult for yourself?

Wilt wrote in post #15389382
I think that any speedlight is inherently disadvantaged for background lighting, as it forces you to shoot and chimp many times during placement, so that you can SEE how it falls in position relative to your subject. I think that anyone learning lighting is seriously disadvantaged with speedlights simply because you cannot immediately SEE the effect, you have to shoot and chimp a lot.

Reason I am asking is because I just saw a video (link below) of a guy working in a small space like I am, and he complemented his main light (monolight) with a speedlite (with gel) for the background. I imagine that there is less light spill with a speedlite aimed that closely at a background than a monolight with grid even at the lowest power setting.

https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=SeppRvCcpJU

The flip side of the argument: If you don't have the crutch of a studio light with a modeling light, you're forced to think hard about where your light and shadows are gonna go, learn quickly so you don't have to struggle with it in the future, and take notes on your successes so you can repeat them easily in the future.

One of these days I'll have nice studio lights. For now I'm getting by with one 430EXII and two $60 Yongnuo YN-560s; when I want to blow out a white background I'll use both Yongnuos for the BG and the 430EXII and a reflector for the subject. If I pull out my notes I can get it right with only one or two test shots. If I go by memory it takes two or three test shots. The first several times I did it, it took a fair amount of testing and chimping and learning from mistakes.

For portraiture, there are days when I really wish for modeling lights - not for the background, but to find the most flattering and pleasing shadows on the subject. For now, I make do with what I have, which involves a moderate amount of educated guessing and chimping.

I wouldn't try to light a full-length backdrop with a single Speedlight.

coeng wrote in post #15390081
Reason I am asking is because I just saw a video (link below) of a guy working in a small space like I am, and he complemented his main light (monolight) with a speedlite (with gel) for the background. I imagine that there is less light spill with a speedlite aimed that closely at a background than a monolight with grid even at the lowest power setting.

https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=SeppRvCcpJU

However, a monolight with snoot or with grid forms a nice circle of light which nicely frames the viewer's attention on the portraiture subject. A speedlight makes a somewhat rectangular patch of light...you would need to turn it 90 degrees to try to get a somewhat similar effect (with the lower part of the rectangle hidden by the portrait subject's body), but the upper part still has corners. This shot was taken to capture the effect of a speedlight not sufficiently filling a softbox...the photo rotated 90 degrees this also somewhat illustrates the effect of speedlight backlighting!

I routinely use an old flash unit for background lighting. Usually I gel it using a swatch from a Roscolux swatchbook. There's just no practical way to acquire that many gel colors in a large enough sheet to use on a studio strobe. I wait until the subject shows up, then pick a color to compliment his/her clothing.

After taping the gel on the flash unit, I slide on a homemade snoot to control the light.

It does require some trial and error, but with a little practice you can do it without consuming too much time. Since the flash unit is small and doesn't have cords, you can hide it easily.

Here I used a blue gel on a white backdrop for a subtle effect. The flash was hidden behind the big vase.

I use A speedlight with gels for a background light in a small studio also.
I also find it easy to hide behind the sujects because of it's small size.
It would be nice to have a bigger room but,you work where you have too .

I prefer to use all the same kind of lights, i.e. monolights together, or speedlites together.

All this talk about using modeling lights so you don't have to chimp is bogus in my opinion. With film we either used Polaroids or did lots of bracketing. And we were shooting with hot lights so we could see the light.

If a modeling light is such a big deal then either using the modeling light feature on the speedlite when setting it up, or tape a small flash light to the head.

In the video I took it that he was using speedlites because he only had the one monolight. That's a valid reason for mixing light sources.

If you have enough monolights, use them. It makes for an easy setup. The size of the light is not a big deal. And, a little experimenting and you'll find the perfect reflector/modifier to put on the monolight to use it for a background light.

dmward wrote in post #15391186
All this talk about using modeling lights so you don't have to chimp is bogus in my opinion. With film we either used Polaroids or did lots of bracketing. And we were shooting with hot lights so we could see the light.

I don't really understand the point you're trying to make with this "back in my day" example. Is it that you didn't need modeling lights because you were shooting with hot lights? Or are you trying to say that since hot lights don't need modeling lights, strobes also don't need modeling lights?

dmward wrote in post #15391186
If a modeling light is such a big deal then either using the modeling light feature on the speedlite when setting it up, or tape a small flash light to the head.

I don't have a flashlight with a beam wide enough or powerful enough to work as a modeling light inside the umbrella with my Speedlight. I have used little LED flashlights as modeling lights when shooting without modifiers.

What I was trying to get across is that, even with hot lights which are on all the time, it was necessary to use Polaroid test shots to make sure we had exactly the lighting we wanted for a shot. So, IMO, saying that speedlites should not be used because they don't have modeling lights isn't something that I think about.

I seldom use the "modeling light" feature with my speedlites. It's just as easy to fire a quick test shot.

My primary reason for preferring to use similar lights is primarily to have everything with approximately the same power range. And, thus similar recycle times, etc.

One approach isn't better than the other, just personal preference.

Curtis N wrote in post #15390576
Here I used a blue gel on a white backdrop for a subtle effect. The flash was hidden behind the big vase.

So size does matter but bigger isn't allways better. The small size of a speedlight is one of it's biggest advantages.

dmward wrote in post #15391186
All this talk about using modeling lights so you don't have to chimp is bogus in my opinion. With film we either used Polaroids or did lots of bracketing. And we were shooting with hot lights so we could see the light.

I disagree. Especially for background lights, light placement relative to the person being photographed might be critical and is highly dependent on the position of the photographer. To get everything lined up, I usually rely on my modelling lights.

Tobi