What would you charge for this package

Nightstalker wrote in post #15393566
Jeez, printing in the US is expensive.

I've just tallied up the print costs via the UK lab I use and it comes to £150 ($245) plus you can buy 250 3 inch buttons for $50 so call it $300 tops or less than $3 per person.


Based on my recent pricing I would be charging in the region of $50 per person but if it is guaranteed sales to all 115 I'd discount this further - probably down to around $30 - $35.

That's what I was thinking reading the previous printing cost breakdowns!
I'd put that package together for under $3 per person with the 11x14's costed in. It's not a big package on what I'd usually offer so I'd only put about $25 on it.


I thought the yanks had all that cheaper. I know here in Oz we used to import stuff from the states and be Pissed how much cheaper gear was over there but now the tides are turned and it's cheaper here. Not by a lot but the difference is reversed at least.

As for fuel, Don't get me started. I'm into an alternate fuels thing so run my car literally for about 1C/L but the way Americans have a spit and just about riot when the price of their fuel gets anywhere near ours makes me laugh.
They always **** the price is too high and they should do something to bring the price lower but never do you see anyone saying they should use less.

If you suggest that, you get avalanched with a bunch of people going off why They HAVE to have and can't live without an F150 in the driveway even if they live in the middle of a city.

Americans are very tunnel visioned in a lot of ways. They maintain they can't fit in cars that are sold around the world and everyone else gets by with just fine because they are too small. They are ready to riot when their fuel prices get UP to about 1/3rd of what most of europe ( that's the other big country where some other people live that's not Canada or Mexico :lol would think is a bargain!

glumpy wrote in post #15394995
That's what I was thinking reading the previous printing cost breakdowns!
I'd put that package together for under $3 per person with the 11x14's costed in. It's not a big package on what I'd usually offer so I'd only put about $25 on it.


I thought the yanks had all that cheaper. I know here in Oz we used to import stuff from the states and be Pissed how much cheaper gear was over there but now the tides are turned and it's cheaper here. Not by a lot but the difference is reversed at least.

As for fuel, Don't get me started. I'm into an alternate fuels thing so run my car literally for about 1C/L but the way Americans have a spit and just about riot when the price of their fuel gets anywhere near ours makes me laugh.
They always **** the price is too high and they should do something to bring the price lower but never do you see anyone saying they should use less.

If you suggest that, you get avalanched with a bunch of people going off why They HAVE to have and can't live without an F150 in the driveway even if they live in the middle of a city.

Americans are very tunnel visioned in a lot of ways. They maintain they can't fit in cars that are sold around the world and everyone else gets by with just fine because they are too small. They are ready to riot when their fuel prices get UP to about 1/3rd of what most of europe ( that's the other big country where some other people live that's not Canada or Mexico :lol would think is a bargain!

Don't hear me whining when gas prices are up......beats walking any day. So don't say they.

I will gladly pay the higher print costs as well as gear prices and stay here with my F250's and SUV's.

glumpy wrote in post #15394995
That's what I was thinking reading the previous printing cost breakdowns!
I'd put that package together for under $3 per person with the 11x14's costed in. It's not a big package on what I'd usually offer so I'd only put about $25 on it.


I thought the yanks had all that cheaper. I know here in Oz we used to import stuff from the states and be Pissed how much cheaper gear was over there but now the tides are turned and it's cheaper here. Not by a lot but the difference is reversed at least.

As for fuel, Don't get me started. I'm into an alternate fuels thing so run my car literally for about 1C/L but the way Americans have a spit and just about riot when the price of their fuel gets anywhere near ours makes me laugh.
They always **** the price is too high and they should do something to bring the price lower but never do you see anyone saying they should use less.

If you suggest that, you get avalanched with a bunch of people going off why They HAVE to have and can't live without an F150 in the driveway even if they live in the middle of a city.

Americans are very tunnel visioned in a lot of ways. They maintain they can't fit in cars that are sold around the world and everyone else gets by with just fine because they are too small. They are ready to riot when their fuel prices get UP to about 1/3rd of what most of europe ( that's the other big country where some other people live that's not Canada or Mexico :lol would think is a bargain!

This is turning around. We're starting to buy more and more small wimpy cars.

The problem though is we can't really use less gas. Some of us can do with less driving but many of us cannot. The United States is a big ass country and even simple things like fetching groceries can require a four wheel drive vehicle and several gallons of gas depending where you live.

Very few people in truly large cities have cars when public transport is actually a viable alternative. NYC springs to mind. Sure there are a lot of vehicles there, but it's a small number relative to the massive population and hardly anyone has a big truck they don't need.

Oh and sometimes it's not as simple as buying a new car that gets better mileage. The bank account doesn't always see the benefit, since those cars fetch a premium price and the overall savings goes right out the window.

cdifoto wrote in post #15396418
This is turning around. We're starting to buy more and more small wimpy cars.

The problem though is we can't really use less gas. Some of us can do with less driving but many of us cannot. The United States is a big ass country and even simple things like fetching groceries can require a four wheel drive vehicle and several gallons of gas depending where you live.

Very few people in truly large cities have cars when public transport is actually a viable alternative. NYC springs to mind. Sure there are a lot of vehicles there, but it's a small number relative to the massive population and hardly anyone has a big truck they don't need.

Oh and sometimes it's not as simple as buying a new car that gets better mileage. The bank account doesn't always see the benefit, since those cars fetch a premium price and the overall savings goes right out the window.

This is where I am in this whole deal. I live in Big Bear and work in Hollywood. That is a 125 mile commute but I stay in Burbank when I'm working. For the commute, I drive a 2010 VW TDI and get a solid 46MPG on most fill ups. But since my house is at 7000ft elevation. we get tons of snow and that is what my big F350 Diesel is for... And my wife drives an Expedition. Both are 4x4 because we need it but I will say there are a lot of people that drive big trucks and SUV's because they are cool and can afford to own one.


Back on topic....

I am really thinking about finding something else other than Smugmug. Although it is easy to use, the cost is looking like far less of a deal. Zenfolio is not an option for me. The look of their site is worse than SM IMHO....

So doing a little digging, I have found something that just pissed me off in a big way. I use Bay Photo through my SM account for all my printing. Check this out...

x115 - Bay Photo My SM
8 wallets - 1.99 - 2.99
5x7 - 1.15 - 1.15
8x10 - 1.79 - 2.49
total= - 4.93 - 6.63
For a total cost of $1.70/person x 115= $195!!!!!!

x20
11x14 - 3.99 - 6.25
So for this I am spending an extra $45.20 just for these 20 prints!


So with the fact that I am paying $240 more to use my site for printing instead of going straight to Bay photo makes me mad. WTF is up with SM??? I'm done with them.

mattymx wrote in post #15396804
So with the fact that I am paying $240 more to use my site for printing instead of going straight to Bay photo makes me mad. WTF is up with SM??? I'm done with them.

It's simple - SmugMug are a business and a business is run for profit.

The sad thing though is that they probably get a big discount from Bat Photo as well because of the volume they are bringing.

Nightstalker wrote in post #15396907
It's simple - SmugMug are a business and a business is run for profit.

The sad thing though is that they probably get a big discount from Bat Photo as well because of the volume they are bringing.

I hear ya. But I'm not cool with paying more than the average person for prints. The same price would be fine. Paying more is no good.

mattymx wrote in post #15396914
I hear ya. But I'm not cool with paying more than the average person for prints. The same price would be fine. Paying more is no good.

If I used your same logic in my business I would only charge my clients what what it cost me for prints and believe me I don't sell prints at cost - no photographer would if they are in business.

When I get someone to do something for me then I expect to pay for their time and effort. If you ask Smugmug to print your photos surely you should expect them to operate on a cost+ business model.

I agree with you thogh that I don;t like paying any more than I need to for anything and this is why I host my own gallery sites and take a few hours to put any large orders together and upload only the files that I want printed to my lab rather than use something like SmugMug.

Nightstalker wrote in post #15397490
If I used your same logic in my business I would only charge my clients what what it cost me for prints and believe me I don't sell prints at cost - no photographer would if they are in business.

When I get someone to do something for me then I expect to pay for their time and effort. If you ask Smugmug to print your photos surely you should expect them to operate on a cost+ business model.

I agree with you thogh that I don;t like paying any more than I need to for anything and this is why I host my own gallery sites and take a few hours to put any large orders together and upload only the files that I want printed to my lab rather than use something like SmugMug.

You do have a valid point for sure and I'm all for what you are saying. It's just that with the 50% hike in monthly fees out of the blue on top of the other fees is making me rethink who I will do business with. Bay photo does an amazing job with my printing needs. Their quality is great. I wish I had the skill to build my own site.

I never use SmugMug to do my printing. I submit everything myself to either BayPhoto, WHCC or Black River. For a little extra time on your part to submit it makes you more profit, even w/ the added time.

DagoImaging wrote in post #15397660
I never use SmugMug to do my printing. I submit everything myself to either BayPhoto, WHCC or Black River. For a little extra time on your part to submit it makes you more profit, even w/ the added time.

The culture and difference in thinking is interesting. I don't know of anyone that would order their prints through a site like smug mut. Here we have labs where we can upload the images and order them online at their normal ( cheaper) prices.

Most people for larger orders however just drop what they want on disk and mail them or drop them off.

I Guess that is as strange a thought to some there as using an online service like SM would be here.

glumpy wrote in post #15397734
The culture and difference in thinking is interesting. I don't know of anyone that would order their prints through a site like smug mut. Here we have labs where we can upload the images and order them online at their normal ( cheaper) prices.

Most people for larger orders however just drop what they want on disk and mail them or drop them off.

I Guess that is as strange a thought to some there as using an online service like SM would be here.

Not everything is U.S.A. vs. the World, so maybe we can stop that portion of the discussion. It gets old very quickly.

Most prints in the US are done exactly the way you describe. SmugMug provides a service. Some use it and some do not. Although SM hosts my photos, I do not use them for fulfillment because of reasons others have stated, but also because they charge 15% of whatever your markup is. I disagree with SM getting money through their discounts with Bay, my annual fee, AND a cut of my profits. No way. So when someone orders something from my site, I order it myself through Bay, because I feel as though I'm already paying enough for SM's service.

glumpy wrote in post #15397734
The culture and difference in thinking is interesting. I don't know of anyone that would order their prints through a site like smug mut. Here we have labs where we can upload the images and order them online at their normal ( cheaper) prices.

Most people for larger orders however just drop what they want on disk and mail them or drop them off.

I Guess that is as strange a thought to some there as using an online service like SM would be here.

I wouldn't order through Smugmug myself either, as a photographer. I don't think that's the primary purpose of the service though. The idea is for the photographer to send his customers to Smugmug galleries and let them (Smugmug) take care of payment processing and order fulfillment, thereby making it a completely hands-off process for the photographer. That is indeed worth a small premium if the orders tend to be small in quantity/price and high volume... ie a constant influx of a couple prints at a time.

Where it is NOT worthwhile is when you have a small number of large orders on a sporadic basis and fulfill them yourself. We do have the same labs you describe. It's just a different model.

CraigPatterson wrote in post #15397765
Not everything is U.S.A. vs. the World, so maybe we can stop that portion of the discussion. It gets old very quickly.

I was making a comparison of the way things are done, not an accusation.
Overly defensive people get old even quicker.

glumpy wrote in post #15397825
I was making a comparison of the way things are done, not an accusation.

I guess you missed my point then, which was that you cannot make national comparisons based on something one person says, hoping to extrapolate it into an entire nationality. Your comparison was invalid on its face, so I pointed out the inaccuracy. I'm sorry that you're so offended that you need to lash out. That's exactly what I'm trying to avoid, so I apologize for the offense.