Handheld Metering?

Just a quick question. When using a hand held incident meter, do I just dial in the reading into my camera or do I need to take the reflectance of the subject into account like with the in-camera reflected meter? Put another way, if I use a handheld meter to measure the light falling on a black cat and then dial in the reading into my camera, will the cat be rendered black or gray? Thanks!

It should come out black.

Your camera meter should show at least a stop (maybe two) slower shutter or larger aperture to try and make a grey cat.

Handheld meters can measure both incident or reflective readings. If you take an incident reading by pointing it at the camera position, then your back cat should be fine using those settings from the meter. If you use the reflected light reading pointed at the cat, then it will need adjustment.

Usually there will be a separate attachment between incident and reflected light readings. Or as with mine, it has a separate button.

That's what I thought, thanks!

Your light meter would meter everything in 18% gray. Even black would be gray, the exposure needed to make it gray looking. That's why if metering off a black subject, you should underexpose a bit by 1 stop. White subject is +2 stops. Your light meter usefulness is limited without a spot degree attachment. Incident metering could only measure the ambient lighting. You would literally need to put your meter next to the subject to get an accurate reading. Reflective metering without a spot degree attachment is totally inaccurate. The metered area is too wide and may contain more highlights than shadows.

TooManyShots wrote in post #15410715
Your light meter would meter everything in 18% gray. Even black would be gray, the exposure needed to make it gray looking. That's why if metering off a black subject, you should underexpose a bit by 1 stop. White subject is +2 stops. Your light meter usefulness is limited without a spot degree attachment. Incident metering could only measure the ambient lighting. You would literally need to put your meter next to the subject to get an accurate reading. Reflective metering with a spot degree attachment is totally inaccurate. The metered area is too wide and may contain more highlights than shadows.

Ok now I'm confused. If I take an incident reading of the light falling on my subject you're saying I'd have to make the same exposure compensation as if I were using a reflected meter?

I think he was saying that incident light meter reflective reads are useless without a spot attachment, and that the attachment is not accurate because it reads too wide of the photo area.

I think spots are plenty accurate if you use the tool wisely. Not sure what type of meter you have, but I've had them start at 20 degrees, 5, 2 and 1.

He also stated that to be accurate with the incident meter, which most likely has a white globe, you must stand at the position of the subject and point towards the camera direction to be accurate.

Sorry for speaking for someone else, but just paraphrasing what was said.

Meters are tools that must be used correctly. They are as accurate as the person knowing what to do with the readings

LostArk wrote in post #15410742
Ok now I'm confused. If I take an incident reading of the light falling on my subject you're saying I'd have to make the same exposure compensation as if I were using a reflected meter?

No, only if you are metering off directly a black subject (such as using the meter in the reflective mode at a very narrow angle). Then, you need to underexpose the shot by 1 stop or more to make the black subject to look black, not gray.

In the incident metering, the color as well as the light intensity of the subject does not matter.

RandyMN wrote in post #15410761
I think he was saying that incident light meter reflective reads are useless without a spot attachment, and that the attachment is not accurate because it reads too wide of the photo area.

I think spots are plenty accurate if you use the tool wisely. Not sure what type of meter you have, but I've had them start at 20 degrees, 5, 2 and 1.

He also stated that to be accurate with the incident meter, which most likely has a white globe, you must stand at the position of the subject and point towards the camera direction to be accurate.

Sorry for speaking for someone else, but just paraphrasing what was said.

Meters are tools that must be used correctly. They are as accurate as the person knowing what to do with the readings

Thanks. Yeah, incident metering could only approximate the light falling on the subject. It can't not take into the account of the color as well as how reflective it is or whether or not the subject is reflecting any light at all. Reflective metering is more useful only if you can narrow the coverage.

Heheheh.....incident metering is basically metering the ambient light. Like an overhead light source or lamp. When you put the dome on, you are metering the incident light. The ambient value would change depending how close or how far you are from the light source. You don't point your lighter meter, in the incident mode, to the subject and to read off the exposure value. Instead, you point the dome to the light source and put it near the subject. This would determine the exposure value of the overhead light hitting the subject at the same distance. You are still not metering the light falling off from the subject at all. Incident metering would work if the subject's color is neutral.

If you want to meter the light falling off from the subject, you have to use the reflective mode, dome off. And to point directly at the subject, at a very close distance. Many light meter you can get a spot degree attachment. Right now, your light meter in the reflective mode is probably reading off the light falling off from the subject at 100 degree. The scope is too wide. You need to narrow that down to 10 or 5 degree. With a spot degree meter attachment, you can literally meter off the light falling off from the subject's hair.

RandyMN wrote in post #15410761
I think he was saying that incident light meter reflective reads are useless without a spot attachment, and that the attachment is not accurate because it reads too wide of the photo area.

Oh gawd, how to really confuse a guy by using two divergent terms, one modifying the other, and then mix in a third concept!!!

• Handheld meters are Incident or they are Reflective at any particular time, but they cannot be BOTH at the same time
  
• Incident meters NEVER use spot attachments; only REFLECTED light meters use spot attachments
  
  
  
• Handheld incident meters should be held at the subject position and face the camera lens (or in the same type of light that falls on the subject) and incident meters do not see different reflectivity of a subject in black vs. a subject in white, and incident readings do not need to be compensated.
  
• Handheld reflected light meters should be held to look AT the subject and reflected light meters do see different reflectivity of a subject in black vs. a subject in white, and reflected light readings DO need to be compensated.

LostArk wrote in post #15410642
Just a quick question. When using a hand held incident meter, do I just dial in the reading into my camera or do I need to take the reflectance of the subject into account like with the in-camera reflected meter? Put another way, if I use a handheld meter to measure the light falling on a black cat and then dial in the reading into my camera, will the cat be rendered black or gray? Thanks!

Incident-metered images with subjects of various brightness. The meter gave a result of 1/500 at f/2.8 and ISO 6400, a setting that was used in the camera.

Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

DCFan linked a couple already but here is another good article by Sekonic http://www.sekonic.com …Use-a-Handheld-Meter.aspx

Wilt wrote in post #15411338
Oh gawd, how to really confuse a guy by using two divergent terms, one modifying the other, and then mix in a third concept!!!

• Handheld meters are Incident or they are Reflective at any particular time, but they cannot be BOTH at the same time
  
• Incident meters NEVER use spot attachments; only REFLECTED light meters use spot attachments
  
  
  
• Handheld incident meters should be held at the subject position and face the camera lens (or in the same type of light that falls on the subject) and incident meters do not see different reflectivity of a subject in black vs. a subject in white, and incident readings do not need to be compensated.
  
• Handheld reflected light meters should be held to look AT the subject and reflected light meters do see different reflectivity of a subject in black vs. a subject in white, and reflected light readings DO need to be compensated.

Okay, so I failed... Next time I'll just stay silent.