A New Bare Bulb Flash Arrives

tetrode wrote in post #15539783
This is really key, David. As I've written in several PMs since yesterday, The CL-180 with an Apollo type modifier is truly a match made in heaven. While I do have the 120cm x 120cm Apollo clone, that modifier is quite large and requires some additional mounting hardware though it does work beautifully with the CL-180. I'm finding the CL-180 with its add-on umbrella mount along with the 90cm x 90cm softbox to be the most useful, most portable, and easiest to set up and take down combination. This is a typical configuration:

To give you an idea of what kind of performance the 90cm square + CL-180 pairing will yield, I performed a test this morning comparing output of two Nikon SB-800s in the 90x90 vs. one CL-180. At 60" from the front baffle, ISO 200, the two SB-800s metered f/8.3. The single CL-180 metered f/11.7.

Regarding thermal protection: Yes, the CL-180 has it. Originally it was fairly agressive kicking in after 50 full power flashes in rapid succession (meaning at 3-5 second intervals). This was felt to be a potential problem and was raised as an issue during beta testing with the manufacturer. In response, the limit was increased to 75 full power flashes in rapid succession before thermal protection kicks in. There's a thermometer icon on the flash LCD to indicate protection has been triggered. The flash can still be fired at that point but recycling is slowed to 10 seconds or so.

Dave, I like the offset adapter you crafted. The piece that fits on the lightstand and the cold shoe are easily recognizable. What is the metal offset? Something you crafted or a purchased item?

Looks like the tilt can be well past 45* with a bit of jiggling the shaft position in the holder on the CL-180.

Did you take the time to measure the evenness of the light across the face of the diffusion panel on the front of the box?

Three of these could be a really nice, portable, portrait setup.

Some additional thoughts about Godox High Speed Sync.
I spent a little time on eBay looking at descriptions of Godox Cells II triggers. They're the ones that look like a PW plus II with a hot shoe.

They also claim 1/8000 sync speed with Canon HSS "support".

The device has all the pins on its foot, so should be able to receive signals from camera related to early fire for HSS. The hotshoe that a remote flash would sit on only has a center fire pin.

This implies that Godox is using HSS to imply what Pocket Wizard calls "Hyper Sync" and what Yongnuo calls Super Sync" on the YN-622 when used with studio strobes.

Since Godox has hot shoe flash units that support TTL its possible that they have incorporated the circuitry required to do the strobing required for true HSS into the CL-180. We'll have to wait for confirmation from testing.

Wilt wrote in post #15539844
I see thermal protection does not kick in until over 2.5x the number of flashes of the lower output 580EXII. Nice.

As for output power, some comparative numbers (metered values, not computed per typical inflated manufacturer GN claims) -- admittedly not apples-to-apples comparison into an umbrella with metalized reflector as the CL-180 figures...

• Dynalite M500 500 w-s into Dynalite 1020 head with standard reflector (covers 140 degrees) nets GN 135 at ISO 200 or f/27 (vs. CL-180 f/11.7)
  
• Dynalite M500 in a 24"x36" softbox would yield f/16 at 4', or GN64. The softbox with white interior and diffusion panel was losing about -1.25EV
  
• The Metz 54MZ with zoom head 50mm lens coverage angle (which is only about 50 degrees) and Full power = GN70, f/11.6 at 6' or f/14 at 5'.
  

If you'd like another data point, the metered output of the CL-180 into a 43" Lastolite silver umbrella (using the CL-180's umbrella mount and umbrella reflector) at ISO 200, 5' is f/22.7.

tetrode wrote in post #15540013
If you'd like another data point, the metered output of the CL-180 into a 43" Lastolite silver umbrella (using the CL-180's umbrella mount and umbrella reflector) at ISO 200, 5' is f/22.7.

That's impressive.
Measured from the light or the face of the umbrella. I'm guessing the light.

Do you have a mid-sized soft silver PLM? I image that could offer some nice light.

I'm thinking about modding one of the PLM mounts with an S type adapter and using the Cheetah bracket. Or I guess I could use my Kacey bracket with the Elinchrom adapter on it with one of the Elinchrom PLM mounts I have. Should be able to get the bulb to just about the optimum point.

tetrode wrote in post #15540013
If you'd like another data point, the metered output of the CL-180 into a 43" Lastolite silver umbrella (using the CL-180's umbrella mount and umbrella reflector) at ISO 200, 5' is f/22.7.

Now I am puzzled about the difference from what you reported earlier, " At 60" from the front baffle, ISO 200, ... The single CL-180 metered f/11.7"

f/11.7 vs. f/22.7

120cm x 120cm Apollo clone vs. 43" silver Lastolite ?

Wilt wrote in post #15540192
Now I am puzzled about the difference from what you reported earlier, " At 60" from the front baffle, ISO 200, ... The single CL-180 metered f/11.7"

f/11.7 vs. f/22.7

I don't think it's all that puzzling, Wilt. The Lastolite umbrella is VERY reflective and there's' no front baffle. The interior of the 90cm x 90cm Apollo clone is more of a soft silver plus there's the light-eating front baffle.

I updated post 35...120cm x 120cm Apollo clone vs. 43" silver Lastolite...after re-reading your earlier posts.

dmward wrote in post #15540120
That's impressive.
Measured from the light or the face of the umbrella. I'm guessing the light.

Measured from the front edge of the umbrella, David.

No, David, I do not. I have the extreme silver 86" and 64" and the white 51". The 64" is just too heavy for the CL-180s on board umbrella mount. I have tested with a 60" Photek umbrella using the integral mount:

:p

Wilt wrote in post #15540239
I updated post 35...120cm x 120cm Apollo clone vs. 43" silver Lastolite...after re-reading your earlier posts.

Is that a request for me to meter the 120cm x 120cm or asking if that's what produced the f/11.7 reading?

tetrode: Could you please confirm the 75 full power pop with no over heating on the flash and the battery unit? : http://www.ebay.com …ashes&hash=item​4abfb34ec9

ramin.ma wrote in post #15540320
tetrode: Could you please confirm the 75 full power pop with no over heating on the flash and the battery unit? : http://www.ebay.com …ashes&hash=item​4abfb34ec9

I have tested (and confirmed) that multiple times. After 75 full power pops, the thermal protection feature triggers.

tetrode wrote in post #15540275
:p

Is that a request for me to meter the 120cm x 120cm or asking if that's what produced the f/11.7 reading?

asking confirmation of what produced the f/11.7 reading, as it sounded to me as if you used the 120x120, but then later you speak of a different size the 90x90.

dmward wrote in post #15539919
Dave, I like the offset adapter you crafted. The piece that fits on the lightstand and the cold shoe are easily recognizable. What is the metal offset? Something you crafted or a purchased item?

David, you made my day by noticing the offset adapter. Sometimes it's the little things

For those of you who hadn't noticed, this is what David is referring to:

There's no shortage of "solutions" for tilting Apollo-type softboxes (as you well know). I think I've tried them all. Even though it isn't the lightest of options, for me, by far the best and most flexible solution relies on a grip head and length of 5/8" aluminum rod. Here's my setup without the softbox:

No, I haven't. Heavily underexposed images of the front of the softbox look good with the only apparent anomaly being the shadow of the flash unit on the front baffle.

Wilt wrote in post #15540343
asking confirmation of what produced the f/11.7 reading, as it sounded to me as if you used the 120x120, but then later you speak of a different size the 90x90.

This is what I wrote in post #28:

"To give you an idea of what kind of performance the 90cm square + CL-180 pairing will yield, I performed a test this morning comparing output of two Nikon SB-800s in the 90x90 vs. one CL-180. At 60" from the front baffle, ISO 200, the two SB-800s metered f/8.3. The single CL-180 metered f/11.7."

It says "90cm square" right there.

dmward wrote in post #15539603
I had a Norman collapsible Octa for my QFlash that was essentially the same as the one offered by Godox. It was a nice modifier but its still only 19" which is marginal.

The Godox/Cheetah folding octa is indeed very similar to the ones available under the Norman, Quantum, and SP Studio Systems names: