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Thread started 18 Feb 2013 (Monday) 03:50
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DigitalRev busted selling used cameras sold as new

 
peepdeets
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Feb 18, 2013 18:01 |  #31
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DigitalSoCal wrote in post #15624961 (external link)
Here is their response. Seems more than fair to me...

The excuse isn't reasonable but the resolution is, IMHO.




  
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Feb 18, 2013 18:10 |  #32

A lot stores allow people to test their items and do videos on them in exchange for free publicity, such as Allen's Camera and Jared Polin. They sell those items as "new" even though he's taken test shots and does his sniff test on, he even mentions it in the video. Technically they're used but they still sell them as new.

I love Kai and the rest of the DRTV team but I'd be mad if I got a camera used in their videos. 40 shots indoors to test it out I'd have no problem with but if it got wet and such is not cool.


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Feb 18, 2013 18:32 |  #33

DigitalSoCal wrote in post #15624961 (external link)
Here is their response. Seems more than fair to me...

I think I would have led with the apology instead of holding it for the last paragraph. Seems they haven't heard of TMI.




  
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isoMorphic
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Feb 19, 2013 01:09 |  #34

Amazon sent me two used/broken lighting kits, used and possibly refurb blender (drop shipped so mfg was responsible) and after returning a defective blower fan they sent me a working yet clearly used replacement. I believe there is much more used being sold as new these days then most people realize. I don't think Amazon, DigRev or any other large retailer does this on purpose but rather people return things they damaged as undamaged or unused. If the item box appears sealed or the product appears new then it might easily get mislabled and tossed back in the wrong bin.




  
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Kolor-Pikker
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Feb 19, 2013 05:33 |  #35

To be honest, this kind of stuff happens semi-regularly, even with big retailers. This isn't about DRTV, it's just an especially publicized case of what can and does happen, every now and then.


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Submariner
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Feb 19, 2013 08:05 |  #36

pwm2 wrote in post #15622784 (external link)
The original link indicates that the people who have received these cameras will get them replaced with brand new cameras. You have any strong evidence that so isn't the case?

No - but these are only the lucky ones that discovered it, Ironically because they had a product issue/fault.
My disgust is based on the amount of effort these innocent buyers had to go to just to get a basic right i.e. the problem rectified.
And more importantly the damage done to the secondhand market place - by introducing unserviceable equipment (due to counterfeit serial numbers - canons description not mine)


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Submariner
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Feb 19, 2013 08:15 |  #37

GaryS1964 wrote in post #15624464 (external link)
I don't know how you can say that. They say they have a policy in place to prevent this sort of thing. Their internal investigation turned up three instances of this happening and it would appear that only one of the purchasers of these three cameras was aware of a problem yet the company contacted the other two unaware purchasers to offer them a replacement camera or a refund. I don't know what else they could do to show they care about their customers.

Seems to me I recall similar threads regarding B&H, Adorama, and other well known companies. These sorts of things happen to the best companies. It's what actions the company takes to remedy the situation and to prevent future occurrences that matters. Seems to me DigitalRev did it right.

Yeah but I'll bet you won't get fake serial numbers on the kit sold by B&H or Adorama, again and again - and if one did slip though they wouldn't offer to send it back to the supplier to attach another fake serial number!


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Submariner
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Feb 19, 2013 08:24 |  #38

riotshield wrote in post #15624991 (external link)
Hate to say it but this is a common practice with most retailers in Asia. If they can get away with selling a used/returned/refurb item as new they will. There's no enforcement there like the FTC or Attorney General. When I lived in Seoul, I had experiences where the seller tried to sell me a refurb as new or swapped out the factory battery for a generic one.

Do anyone really think all the equipment Kai uses in his review are loaners or sold as used? I would not be surprised if Digitalrev repackages everything and sells it as new, but were just happened to get caught by someone who did his homework.

Plus one.
Just they have been caught too many times. Regarding the serial number issue which actually if far more serious they put Simon through hell to get his money back.
What we need is a name and shame sticky. Counterfiet serial numbers and used sold as new.
Then send an email to some other photography forums - offering to cross reference what they have discovered. Very quickly these dirty traders would either become very quickly squeaky clean or go bust. Simples!


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Submariner
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Feb 19, 2013 08:51 |  #39

GaryS1964 wrote in post #15624464 (external link)
I don't know how you can say that. They say they have a policy in place to prevent this sort of thing. Their internal investigation turned up three instances of this happening and it would appear that only one of the purchasers of these three cameras was aware of a problem yet the company contacted the other two unaware purchasers to offer them a replacement camera or a refund. I don't know what else they could do to show they care about their customers.

Seems to me I recall similar threads regarding B&H, Adorama, and other well known companies. These sorts of things happen to the best companies. It's what actions the company takes to remedy the situation and to prevent future occurrences that matters. Seems to me DigitalRev did it right.

Oh please look all all the other threads, especially about the serial nos issues; before spouting back their last "damage control exercise " They got caught more times than one could reasonably explain away, and a few smart people started to recognise the severity of the situation; and DRev have finally backtracked, to save face. Because even they realise, if they continue trying to ignore the customers as they did until now, then there would be a backlash (and well justified and long overdue) against them.


Canon EOS 5DS R, Canon EF 70-200 F2.8 L Mk II IS USM, Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6 L IS USM, EF 40mm F2.8 STM , RC6 Remote. Canon STE-3 Radio Flash Controller, Canon 600 EX RT x4 , YN 560 MkII x2 ; Bowens GM500PRO x4 , Bowens Remote Control. Bowens Pulsar TX, RX Radio Transmitter and Reciever Cards. Bowens Constant 530 Streamlights 600w x 4 Sold EOS 5D Mk III, 7D, EF 50mm F1.8, 430 EX Mk II, Bowens GM500Rs x4

  
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D. ­ Vance
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Feb 19, 2013 09:24 |  #40

Submariner wrote in post #15626950 (external link)
Plus one.
Just they have been caught too many times. Regarding the serial number issue which actually if far more serious they put Simon through hell to get his money back.
What we need is a name and shame sticky. Counterfiet serial numbers and used sold as new.
Then send an email to some other photography forums - offering to cross reference what they have discovered. Very quickly these dirty traders would either become very quickly squeaky clean or go bust. Simples!

I can see a used item very easily getting sold as new; perhaps a new employee that wasn't paying attention. That doesn't bother me as long as the vendor makes it right. That's why I hate people posting their bad experiences on here; most of the time, people don't even contact the vendor first, but blast it across the forum instead.
That's what happens with Adorama; "I got a bad lens that was obviously a mistake! I must blast this across all the forums to shame them! Contacting them would be too easy!"

Then when Helen makes the situations more than right, she is still blasted for her company *Gasp* making a mistake.
Companies sometimes mess up; they're made up of many humans, and humans make mistakes. But people are so impatient that they often don't give the company a chance to make it right. If they would contact the company, I've never seen anything go unresolved when the complaining customer was legit.

(Helen, not trying to pick on you guys. You're just a good example of a great company who often gets blasted unfairly for simple things).


The serial numbers though... That is nasty.


I wonder if the video editors on The Titanic ever went, "Sorry, I can't right now. I'm busy synching the Titanic..."

  
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riotshield
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Feb 19, 2013 09:53 as a reply to  @ D. Vance's post |  #41

Someone else claims to have gotten a "pre-reviewed" D600 from Digitalrev:

JEFF WILSON - FEBRUARY 18, 2013 - 1:26 PM
Yep, they did the same thing to me with a Nikon D600. The first shot I took had an EXIF shutter count of 401. A week long ‘investigation’ followed, during which time they were perfectly polite, with DigitalRev finally offering me a £40 voucher if I spent more money with them; stick that. The camera checks out perfectly fine but their policy and honesty suck big time and I’ll not deal with them again. I’ve not checked the serial number yet but I’m now tempted to.

JEFF WILSON - FEBRUARY 19, 2013 - 11:25 AM
Yep, I checked the serial number of my D600 on the stolen camera website and sure enough it had been used previously in DR’s comparison review of the D600/D800/5DIII (http://www.flickr.com/​photos/digitalrev/8117​830602/ (external link)). The serial number is no longer present in the Flikr EXIF but stolen camera finder linked to this image, I assume through cached information, and I don’t believe it’s just coincidence. It certainly explains the Hong Kong timezone and 25600 ISO that was set when I pulled the camera out of the box. I was fully aware I was buying gray market when I bought from DR, but it does call into question their continued assertion that the camera could never have been used previously. It’s dishonest at best and potentially fraudulent at worst; if they are selling used equipment they should state that. I suppose I should look on the bright side, at least Kai doesn’t appear to stick his hand down his trousers this time.




  
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John
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Feb 19, 2013 12:59 |  #42

peepdeets wrote in post #15624999 (external link)
The excuse isn't reasonable but the resolution is, IMHO.

I was thinking the same thing.

I'm all about performance metrics but I don't understand how their "CED score" would have been better by selling used equipment as new.

Instead of putting so much emphasis on this internal "CED score" they should've just said something like: "our inventory system is screwed up but we're fixing it to prevent these issues". Because ultimately, they sold something that they didn't have in stock.


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Bazinga
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Feb 19, 2013 13:20 |  #43

Bad people get jobs at all organizations. Eventually they are weeded out. Not saying digitalrev is innocent but I won't let a few rogue employees bring down an organization.

With that said, I agree...who buys a camera from them with the others options out there?




  
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pwm2
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Feb 19, 2013 13:58 |  #44

aIpha wrote in post #15628105 (external link)
I was thinking the same thing.

I'm all about performance metrics but I don't understand how their "CED score" would have been better by selling used equipment as new.

Instead of putting so much emphasis on this internal "CED score" they should've just said something like: "our inventory system is screwed up but we're fixing it to prevent these issues". Because ultimately, they sold something that they didn't have in stock.

Their CED score counted time from order to shipping. No camera available to ship means long time. Locating a camera (already in the system but in this case shipped for review) means they got a fast shipment.

Normally shipment score systems are exponential. So an extra days delay gives lots of bad stats. Two days gives looots of bad stats. Three days gives huge amounts of bad stats - so much that it doesn't help if you then send out 10 or 100 cameras same day as you got the order.

Just that a order tracking system should only score orders where the article is in stock. So only a stock discrepancy should get the shipment guys into troubles how to fulfill an order where the camera should have already been available for shipping.


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Submariner
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Feb 20, 2013 12:43 |  #45

andrikos wrote in post #15623571 (external link)
It takes years to build reputation, mere moments to ruin it.

For the Ancient Greeks and Vikings one's reputation was far more important than earthly possessions or fancy titles.

Let's just say that the evidence is pointing to DigitalRev not caring that much about it. Funny review videos though...

Bazinga wrote in post #15628198 (external link)
Bad people get jobs at all organizations. Eventually they are weeded out. Not saying digitalrev is innocent but I won't let a few rogue employees bring down an organization.

With that said, I agree...who buys a camera from them with the others options out there?

Definitely not down to just a few bad employees, They Don't gain anything by this kind of practice. This is standard corporate practice governed by the top management.
If you know about the guys and still buy from them you bluntly must have a screw loose. If you are unaware of their practices then you have my condolences.


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DigitalRev busted selling used cameras sold as new
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