Flash advice for wedding reception

Right...

Well, this seems like an opportunity wasted to some respect. I could have multiple off camera flashes, but would have to rely on the flash power settings alone. Oh, and plus my second flash is the 420EZ that shuts off every 30 seconds of inactivity. Ok, so I guess on camera is where I'll be.

samueli wrote in post #15739856
Right...

Well, this seems like an opportunity wasted to some respect. I could have multiple off camera flashes, but would have to rely on the flash power settings alone. Oh, and plus my second flash is the 420EZ that shuts off every 30 seconds of inactivity. Ok, so I guess on camera is where I'll be.

The key problem is here that this is no time to experiment. Using on-camera bounce you will be certain to get some good images for the couple. By overly complicating things that you aren't yet comfortable with you risk missing something good in search of something great.

this is what i did, 580 on the hotshoe bounced, 430 on modified flash bracket with 30x20 cm softbox

IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/xashx/853898292​5/

kasparov_ksa wrote in post #15739864
this is what i did, 580 on the hotshoe bounced, 430 on modified flash bracket with 30x20 cm softbox

That's a very nice outcome; I won't be able to get that together in time though.

My contraption I mentioned before is a bounce card so to speak at about 7x9. I also have an 8" softbox for speedlite, but I've never really used it since it's so cheese to me. Hmm...

Kasparov, this is not about the topic, but about the subjects in your photo. Is there a difference in why some people are wearing the head wear and others are not? I have seen many pictures and never understood the reason for the differences in some wearing head wear while others are not. I am just trying to understand the different cultural things. What is this particular head wear called? Thank you for your response.

samueli wrote in post #15740346
That's a very nice outcome; I won't be able to get that together in time though.

My contraption I mentioned before is a bounce card so to speak at about 7x9. I also have an 8" softbox for speedlite, but I've never really used it since it's so cheese to me. Hmm...

I would keep the flash on camera on ettl, if its dark the focus assist will help you. Know your surroundings so you can bounce the flash from different surfaces. Don't be afraid to use high iso, your camera can handle it. I know on camera softbox looks so cheesy, but it is better than nothing if its not possible to bounce the flash.

sirquack wrote in post #15740487
Kasparov, this is not about the topic, but about the subjects in your photo. Is there a difference in why some people are wearing the head wear and others are not? I have seen many pictures and never understood the reason for the differences in some wearing head wear while others are not. I am just trying to understand the different cultural things. What is this particular head wear called? Thank you for your response.

The red one is called Shemagh and the white one is called Ghutra, the rounded black thingy is called Ogal. At weddings and events, almost everyone who wear traditional cloths does wear a headwear. It is like wearing a tie vs not.

Hi Samuel,

I think before you get into the technical aspect, camera settings, flash power, lighting position, you need to take a step back and set some expectations with yourself and with the bride and groom. It's a slow work day so I'll try to help you best I can, feel free to PM me if you want to take this off the general board. Ok, so first I would advise that you take a deep breath and realize that the assignment you have volunteered for is one of the most difficult photographic aspects at any wedding. I will describe my typical reception strategy and thought process. From that I think you need to distill it down to a subset and be comfortable with that subset. If you try to do too much without the right experience or practice, it'll all go to hell.

A typical wedding reception includes the following types of pictures:
1. Group pictures 2 - 8 people dancing/partying
2. Bride/Groom/Daughter/F​ather/Mother/Son dancing
3. Cake cutting
4. Candids
5. Speeches/bouquet toss/floor events
6. details (food, cake, arrangements)

From people sitting down to eat until they are sloshed and dancing like a fiend, you're gonna run that gamut. In order to capture all those scenarios in a dark room, I employ the following strategies:

0. Generally lighting is provided by two off camera flashes on light stands that is triggered by an on camera trigger or strobe. This provides background lighting, accent lighting, hair lighting, and sometimes direct lighting when I want shadows.

1. Group pictures from 3ft - 10ft away are handled via on camera flash with bounce card set to TTL and adjusted as necessary. TTL will be thrown off constantly because of black suits and dresses. More advance flash users will know that x distance requires x power. I typically start at f5.6 ISO 800, 1/8th power. Take a pic, check it and then dial it up or down as needed. I know this is effective between 3ft and 8ft. Any further and I need to dial power up, any closer and i need to dial it down. Don't off camera flash it with flash in hand even if you have good experience. The results won't be THAT much better and you'll be holding your camera with one hand and flash in the other. 1. you'll have no stability. 2. it looks awkward 3. it looks awkward. Gary Fong Sphere does not work between 3 ft, 5 people, and 10ft ceilings.

2. Dancing pictures are done the same way. You want to freeze action but you will typically be far away. Nothing wrong with a little motion blur when dancing. Two camera bodies and two lens, one long, one wide. When taking wide shots, you take a test shot and decide how much ambient you want. Start with shutter and set it to 1/125th for example, aperture can be wide open if there are two people, I typically go f4, then set my ISO until I get the desire lighting level for the ambient. Now, if the place is bright, maybe my that's good enough. But if not, I then dial my on camera flash with bounce card until my couple is lit. When shooting long for tight shots, I go same strategy but a higher shutter to avoid camera shake. 1/200th, f4, iso to ambient flash to fill.

3. Cake cutting, same as 1.

4. Candids, same as 1, or 2 with the long lens

5. Same as 2.

So as you can see, regardless of the situation the strategy is the same, you have to have a wide game, and a long game. Start with shutter for motion, aperture for DOF, iso to whatever matches ambient, flash to fill. Those are the basics. You have a 5DM3 so don't be afraid to push that sucker all the way to ISO 6400 or beyond.

Ok, so that's the strategy and you're not a wedding photographer so that means maybe you don't have two camera bodies, wide and long lens, off camera flashes with triggers. But you do so you can technically do everything I said above except for the off camera part. Whether you want to comes down to whether you want to keep things simple or not.

At the most basic you have a 5DM3, flash, and normal lens. So you're good to go on

Group shots, wide dancing shots, cake cutting, and candids. Keep it simple, on camera flash and bounce card and you'll get 85 percent. Things you wont get: long tight cropped shots. Good background lighting. But as long as you're ok with that then that's the way to go.

You've never shot a wedding reception so your stuff isn't going to be amazing but keep to what you know. Set expectations with the bride and groom. Tell them that the picture of Uncle George giving a speech is going to be wide and Uncle George will be lit with flash but everyone in the background will be dark. That's ok.

and hey, if you have good glass then shoot candid stuff wide open. I always do.

Things to remember:
1. don't Try to do too much
2. don't try to achieve a particular style or look that you have no experience with
3. don't Beat yourself up. Just cause you're a great photographer doesn't mean you're a great wedding photographer.
4. don't Stress too much about the technical aspects. Remember the basics. There is no magic combination that always works. But if you make it so that you only have one adjustment point (flash power), then it's easy to adjust.
5. don't shoot groups wide open. People always stagger and some will be out of focus. You don't need f8, f5.6 - 6.3 is usually good for at least 4ft deep. If you don't know this, then you need to read up on how dof works.
6. You don't need off camera lighting at a wedding reception unless it's accent, background, and achieving a particular style.
7. don't call yourself a natural light photographer. In photography circles it just means you never learned how to use a flash. It is not possible to shoot in the dark when you are a natural light photographer and tons of great photography work is done in the dark.


I'm going to say this one more time just in case you forgot. Set expectations with yourself and the bride and groom so there is no confusion when there are no brightly little first dance pictures. They need to know what they are getting and you need to know your limitations. Hope this helps. Sorry, a little preachy.

Obsidian,

Thanks for the elaborate tutorial. I'm pretty solid on the basics, I just hope I have a moment to get flash working into it.

Can I just do a simple bounce card rubber banded to my flash? My contraption is in bad shape, and probably won't give me any more benefit than a piece of craft board taped to my flash. I'm hoping the ceilings will be low and white, and flash aimed at the ceiling/walls with bounce card, or maybe some chances to shoot the flash up and behind will be nice.

I'd love to do the off camera thing, and I may still bring my stuff, but I have trigger and two flashes - which eliminates anything on camera. I could set this up for the special dances. Or I could just bounce (with or without card) and be comfortable. I should've purchased a few more items, since my flashes and triggers where purchased with portrait work in mind.

If I choose to use two cameras, which I'd rather not, how should I go? I have the 5d3, 50d, 70-200L and 50/1.4. I also have an 11-16, but that's not a people lens from my perspective, and a 90mm but that is moot with the 70-200. I'd personally rather switch lenses as needed and benefit from the 5d3 ISO. - I do have a belt and pouch, and I originally intended to switch off during different situations like I've always had to with just one camera.

I've never used TTL and I haven't shot anything other than manual in a very long time, so I think I'll need to be happy using the flash power settings, unless I'm going to be at a severe disadvantage. My experience tells me I can manage several different setting combinations manually, it's just adding the flash that is new.

I always shoot high ISO unless I'm on a tripod, so 6400+ even on the 50D is not uncomfortable.

If I can do better than an iphone, then mission accomplished; but iphones in the right hands can make some pretty fabulous pictures...

Thanks again for the great advice and giving me the chance to think this through out loud so to speak. There really aren't any expectations other than my own, but I am pretty hard on myself. I will be reviewing all the advice until review time is over.

And all you pros reading this, please don't cringe. There wasn't going to be a photographer; I just happen to have a kit and the desire to at least get some shots.

Very timely thread as im trying to cram all this flash lark in for a wedding in May.
Im fine at home with bounced flash but ive never shot in a club or reception environment, so all this info is good for me as well.

Good luck samueli.

kasparov_ksa wrote in post #15740645
I would keep the flash on camera on ettl, if its dark the focus assist will help you. Know your surroundings so you can bounce the flash from different surfaces. Don't be afraid to use high iso, your camera can handle it. I know on camera softbox looks so cheesy, but it is better than nothing if its not possible to bounce the flash.

The red one is called Shemagh and the white one is called Ghutra, the rounded black thingy is called Ogal. At weddings and events, almost everyone who wear traditional cloths does wear a headwear. It is like wearing a tie vs not.

Thanks for the information. I really enjoy learning about cultural differences.

Great thread, much needed info (THANK YOU, OBSIDIAN!) as I get ready to embark on my first full-on wedding season. Usually I shoot as a 2nd Shooter, but in two weeks, for the first time I will be commanding my own mission!

The most important lesson I've learned so far as a 2nd Shooter: the lighting ALWAYS sucks. Count on the walls always being too far away or are black, so bouncing usually is a limited option. Bring your own and know how to use it. I'm still overcoming this hurdle! My goal before this upcoming wedding is to scout the location and devise a plan for my lighting... that way, on the big day, I won't be as stressed.

Next important thing: I now know (and appreciate) why f/2.8 zooms are vital. Complain all you want about how awfully over-priced the 24-70ii and 70-200ii are... they aren't.

Another important thing, and I'm sure I'll hear disparaging "that suits YOUR style" remarks, but: shooting wide-open, small DOF is cool for a few shots, but not for the main shots. I made that mistake when I first started by "bringing my hobby to a business event" (so to speak). Blurry backgrounds and razor DOF is fun in your backyard or your personal shots, but for the first dance, cake cutting, and other important shots, you don't want blurred, soft photos. As boring as shooting at f/4-f/8 is (but, but, I bought this awesome 35L for teh 1.4!), getting a clear, sharp, in-focus shot is generally good business. Get your lighting figured out so you don't need to risk shooting wide open for the whole event. Sometimes though, if you can't get your lights figured out and you feel like you'll miss shots otherwise, bust that prime wide open and just get it done! **

Finally: have fun, you're at a celebration! The people around you will notice, and your shots will reflect that energy.

**Obviously there's a time and place for the thin DOF shots, and if it's your "style", then take my words with a big grain of salt**

samueli wrote in post #15741865
Obsidian,

Thanks for the elaborate tutorial.

+1

I'm also doing my first wedding as lead shooter next weekend.

samueli wrote in post #15741865
Can I just do a simple bounce card rubber banded to my flash? My contraption is in bad shape, and probably won't give me any more benefit than a piece of craft board taped to my flash. I'm hoping the ceilings will be low and white, and flash aimed at the ceiling/walls with bounce card, or maybe some chances to shoot the flash up and behind will be nice.

check out http://abetterbounceca​rd.com/ and then go to MIchaels' or Joanne's, buy 2mm craft foam (Black and white), elmers white glue, and velcro, cut the right shape, glue together, and make your own. Don't rubber band anything if you want to look more professional. Here's a bad pic of me shooting a reception with my D3s, Flash, and Bounce.

You can setup one flash on a lightstand and use it for accent/hair lighting or one flash on each body.

Here's a shot where I am bouncing from the front with a light behind them

If you choose to go with two cameras, I would have a 70-200 on one and the 11-16 on the other. You'll probably be better off on with the 5D3, switching lens, and having the 50D as backup. 11-16 is not a people lens. You will need something in the 24 - 50 range. Rent something. A 24-70 will cost your 30 dollars/weekend if you live in a metro area with good rental places. $50 if you do it online via borrowlenses. A 35 would also work. 11-16 is too wide and you'll get a lot of distortion.

I generally shoot manual because black suits and dresses tens to throw off the TTL measurements. Unless I'm shooting something static, I also adjust power on the fly.

Good luck!

Just to illustrate how three lights work together, along with high ISO.

First shot is Maid of Honer with 85 F1.2L was on dance floor. One 600EX-RT on camera with foamie thing bouncing to ceiling and forward. Two 600EX-RTs on opposite sides of the room. With the 600EX-RTs on the 5DIII I have each in a different group in Gr mode. Each is in ETTL and I use the FEC setting per group for different kicker configurations.

Second shot is Bride and MoH dancing at end of reception. I was surprised how much the two off camera lights lit up the room.

The room was DARK! Ambient was like 1/10, ISO6400, F2.8 or less.

No noise reduction on the shot of the MoH. Shot at ISO 3200 The shot of the Bride and MoH was given a bit of grittiness in Lightroom using Clarity and Shadow sliders. No Noise reduction there either. Shot at ISO 6400.

dmward wrote in post #15743636
The shot of the Bride and MoH was given a bit of grittiness in Lightroom using Clarity and Shadow sliders. No Noise reduction there either. Shot at ISO 6400.

How did they feel about the grittiness? I was on a grittiness kick for a while and recently switched back to softening. General opinion from brides were they would rather see less detail.