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FORUMS Marketplace & Market Info Market Watch 
Thread started 24 Apr 2013 (Wednesday) 12:43
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GreenToe - Reverse Auction Photography Site

 
jjaenagle
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Dec 06, 2013 07:32 |  #421
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riotshield wrote in post #16505859 (external link)
I'm looking for a Sigma 35mm...has anyone bought one recently from Greentoe? Just wondering what the magic price is and who's fulfilling the order. Thanks

ive heard that other places are trying to compete for your orders as well.... ive gotten offers from different places. I always just bid low and let them comeback with a counteroffer :)



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Greg ­ M
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Dec 06, 2013 07:36 |  #422

I'll try that. I know the Tamron 70-200 VC has been sold through Amazon for $999 in Canada so I'll try that.




  
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jjaenagle
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Dec 06, 2013 07:51 |  #423
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Greg M wrote in post #16505872 (external link)
I'll try that. I know the Tamron 70-200 VC has been sold through Amazon for $999 in Canada so I'll try that.

the whole site is based on paying what you are willing to pay, so think about that. It cant hurt and the most you're doing is saving money.



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Down_Shift
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Dec 07, 2013 14:02 |  #424

the $100 coupon doesn't seem to be working. Anyone else try?




  
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jjaenagle
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Dec 07, 2013 15:43 |  #425
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Down_Shift wrote in post #16509089 (external link)
the $100 coupon doesn't seem to be working. Anyone else try?

its welcome100 and only works on orders of $2000 or more... i guess they could have stopped it.



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lance60031x
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Dec 07, 2013 20:45 |  #426

riotshield wrote in post #16505859 (external link)
I'm looking for a Sigma 35mm...has anyone bought one recently from Greentoe? Just wondering what the magic price is and who's fulfilling the order. Thanks

780 unique photo all went well


7d mii, 5d miii, 70-200 f2.8 ii, 17-40 f4, 24-70 f2.8 ii, 24-105 f4, 100 macro L, 300 f4 canon 50 1.4, canon 85 1.8, siggy 35 f1.4 siggy 50 1.4 A

  
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Dave ­ Weldon
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Dec 08, 2013 12:58 as a reply to  @ post 16510707 |  #427

Howdy All,

So far, I've purchased a lens and several B+W 82mm filters on 3 separate Greentoe bids over the last few months. I did have one expire and had to try with a higher yet still a good price for what I would have had to pay on my own. I will say that just because someone got price $xxx through Greentoe doesn't mean that you will have the same luck with that price when you try to get it :cry:. I guess these businesses aren't always hungry ;). But coming from shopping all over the place on Amazon, eBay, Adorama, B&H and elsewhere, where I'm not always successful trying to save 10-30% on various photography items, letting Greentoe take my bid and shop it at places like Adorama, B&H, Unique Photo, etc, has saved me cash. Thanks again goes to Andrew for working with me through probably a dozen emails while we chased the deals :D.




  
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TeamSpeed
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Dec 09, 2013 08:29 |  #428

Greg M wrote in post #16504337 (external link)
But it's true. Dishonest people make things harder on honest people. Those that play by the rules are always the ones that have to pay (or loose) for what the dishonest do.

If you read my post and responded to it then you must know that what you're doing is wrong. Do the right thing. Hey, nobody is perfect but when someone points out something that I'm doing that's not right then I need to try to make it right.

However, I was harsh and I apologize for that.

What makes this dishonest exactly? I am a bit curious. Rebates almost all work from mailing addresses, so if you have different mailing addresses, then you are within constraints of the rebate, nothing more. Also, if a person uses 3 family addresses they have at their disposal to get 3 rebates, how exactly does this hurt the program for you? Canon doesn't care if those 3 families actually placed independent orders or if 1 person did it across 3 addresses, they just limit the rebates by mailing addresses in their tracking software, and the legalese for this kind of rebate tracking is "One per address" or "One per household", nothing more.


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jjaenagle
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Dec 09, 2013 08:31 |  #429
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TeamSpeed wrote in post #16513045 (external link)
What makes this dishonest exactly? I am a bit curious. Rebates almost all work from mailing addresses, so if you have different mailing addresses, then you are within constraints of the rebate, nothing more. Also, if I use 3 family addresses I have at my disposal to get 3 rebates, how exactly does this hurt the program for you? Canon doesn't care if those 3 families actually placed independent orders or if 1 person did it across 3 addresses, they just limit the rebates by mailing addresses in their tracking software, and the legalese for this kind of rebate tracking is "One per address" or "One per household", nothing more.

not to mention they were all purchased through an authorized retailer...



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Greg ­ M
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Dec 09, 2013 08:47 |  #430

TeamSpeed wrote in post #16513045 (external link)
What makes this dishonest exactly? I am a bit curious. Rebates almost all work from mailing addresses, so if you have different mailing addresses, then you are within constraints of the rebate, nothing more. Also, if a person uses 3 family addresses they have at their disposal to get 3 rebates, how exactly does this hurt the program for you? Canon doesn't care if those 3 families actually placed independent orders or if 1 person did it across 3 addresses, they just limit the rebates by mailing addresses in their tracking software, and the legalese for this kind of rebate tracking is "One per address" or "One per household", nothing more.

Intent of Canon's rebate rules was to give everyone a rebate but not multiple rebates on the same product to the same person. Canon obviously does care if they've switched back to mail in rebates from instant rebates. Others abusing the rebate in the past made Canon go to the one per address rule. The same person buying the same lens 3 times and applying for the rebate under 3 different addresses is blatantly subverting the rules. It's fraudulent which makes it a crime although I doubt it would ever be prosecuted.

Anyone that can't see that is a person that has compromised their integrity a few too many times. Rationalization has been substituted for integrity. Of coarse everyone makes bad decisions so just because someone may have done this it doesn't automatically mean they have little or no integrity. However, anyone that is doing this and sees nothing wrong with it after being confronted about it has obviously compromised their integrity at some point in the past. That is a person that probably can't be trusted.




  
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Greg ­ M
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Dec 09, 2013 08:52 |  #431

Back on subject, I put in a low bid on that Tamron 70-200 VC and as I expected it expired. However, I never got an email from Andrew suggesting a higher price. All I got was a notification that my bid had expired and that I should submit a bid close to the Amazon price. The Amazon price is full retail!




  
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jjaenagle
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Dec 09, 2013 08:54 |  #432
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Greg M wrote in post #16513083 (external link)
Back on subject, I put in a low bid on that Tamron 70-200 VC and as I expected it expired. However, I never got an email from Andrew suggesting a higher price. All I got was a notification that my bid had expired and that I should submit a bid close to the Amazon price. The Amazon price is full retail!

im guessing andrew is a busy person lol... what was your bid for if you dont mind me asking?



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Dec 09, 2013 08:57 |  #433

Greg M wrote in post #16513075 (external link)
Intent of Canon's rebate rules was to give everyone a rebate but not multiple rebates on the same product to the same person. Canon obviously does care if they've switched back to mail in rebates from instant rebates. Others abusing the rebate in the past made Canon go to the one per address rule. The same person buying the same lens 3 times and applying for the rebate under 3 different addresses is blatantly subverting the rules. It's fraudulent which makes it a crime although I doubt it would ever be prosecuted.

Anyone that can't see that is a person that has compromised their integrity a few too many times. Rationalization has been substituted for integrity. Of coarse everyone makes bad decisions so just because someone may have done this it doesn't automatically mean they have little or no integrity. However, anyone that is doing this and sees nothing wrong with it after being confronted about it has obviously compromised their integrity at some point in the past. That is a person that probably can't be trusted.

No that is not the intent. They simply restrict rebates by a mailing address to reduce their exposure and to meet their rebate budgets, and the only tool they have available at the current time is a mailing address.

You are placing your own version of intent into this, as well as your perception of crime laws. ;)

As to the "back on subject", I believe you derailed it, but it's good that you would like to bow out of the discussion at this point and talk more about GreenToe.


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jbrackjr
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Dec 09, 2013 09:35 |  #434

[QUOTE=TeamSpeed;16513​093]No that is not the intent. They simply restrict rebates by a mailing address to reduce their exposure and to meet their rebate budgets, and the only tool they have available at the current time is a mailing address.

No, I don't buy that explanation. If a company wants to restrict rebates, they could simply announce we have X number of lens to sell and we have Y number of rebates available. First come first served, no limits. But they didn't. It is clear to me at least their intention was to ensure that everyone had a chance to obtain a lens with rebate.

However with that said, if you have multiple addresses available you can beat the system.


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Dec 09, 2013 10:16 |  #435

jbrackjr wrote in post #16513175 (external link)
No that is not the intent. They simply restrict rebates by a mailing address to reduce their exposure and to meet their rebate budgets, and the only tool they have available at the current time is a mailing address.

No, I don't buy that explanation. If a company wants to restrict rebates, they could simply announce we have X number of lens to sell and we have Y number of rebates available. First come first served, no limits. But they didn't. It is clear to me at least their intention was to ensure that everyone had a chance to obtain a lens with rebate.

However with that said, if you have multiple addresses available you can beat the system.

You can take it how you will, but I have been a consumer for many a decade and run some businesses of my own. We put a budget on discounts and rebates and limit it accordingly, and obviously we don't want resellers bulking up on inventory and selling them later once the rebate period has expired. The easiest way to curb this behavior and also make sure we have reasonable budgets (ie. reaching revenue goals through volume using discounts) being met for a rebate period is to flag an address in a customer database. One rebate, one address. Not one rebate, one person.

It is very easy to add one rebate serial program IDs, and flag it per customer address. If somebody has multiple addresses at their disposal, and purchase lenses accordingly across those addresses, it matters little that the same individual obtains those rebates, and just means that nobody else at that address can leverage the rebate. The only thing difficult in the code is to deal with all the variations in address, you have to run through USPS APIs to check address validity.

If Canon wanted to spread rebates around to individuals, then they would obviously find a different way, because in my house, we have 3 photographers. Canon has restricted my mailing address, not each individual. So I order against my business address for the wife, and one against our home address for me. Obviously not everyone has access to the rebates as you say, in these cases, so again, we are reading much in to the "intent" of the manufacturer vs meeting the exact requirements laid out in the rebate program.

Coupons at the stores have the same thing "one per customer per visit". So each family member gets a coupon and goes in to get items on sale, or one person goes through the line multiple times.... Again, within the program constraints, and not against perceived intent of a company, and certainly not illegal as previously alluded. What is the limiting agent for this type of rebate/coupon program? A person's time. For Canon and any other company, they limit a different resource, a physical mailing address.

In summary:
---------------
Ethics and morality discussions are always very interesting, especially when there is a business program involved with legal fine print calling out all the stipulations. In these cases, if you manage your own integrity against what you think the intent of a company is, then great. However, if that intent is not explicitly given, and all you have are the program directives as outlined in the fine print, then ethically, you are required to fulfill those requirements. Which trumps which: your perception of their intent based on the program requirements, or exact fulfillment to the program requirements?

This is what is being discussed here, meeting the exact stipulations vs meeting somebody's perceived intent of the stipulations.... That is what makes for interesting debate when these topics come up.


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