Time frame for making a detailed, full body selection of a single person....

Quick question for those of you well versed in the art of creating a PS selection. If you have a full body portrait of an individual against a rather nuetral backdrop....how long would it take you to create a detailed selection of that individual? Much will depend on the contrast between the person and backdrop so lets assume the backdrop is a mid-tone that creates edges of nice contrast in some areas but low contrast in others.

My reason for asking is that I've been creating quite a few composites lately for sports teams (seems to be the big request I've been getting lately) and I feel that I'm lacking on productivity when it comes to making detailed selections....but I'm not quite sure because I really have no idea about how long it takes others to do the same thing.
The best tool I've found that seems to always work is the magnetic lasso coupled with my Wacom tablet (and of course, refine edge afterwards).....but that takes me around 7-10 minutes to successfully make a good quality selection of an individual. To me, 7-10 minutes doesn't seem long but when you're talking 20 teams with 11-12 people on a team.....well now that 7-10 minutes per person becomes an eternity. I've watched/read many "selection" tutorials in hopes of finding a faster route but so many of them start with a rather ideal situation where there subject is already isolated quite well from the background.....and that's rarely the starting point I'm able to get.

So, back to my main question......How long does it take you to make a full body portrait selection of an individual in a mixed background/contrast situation? If you feel that you're above average when it comes to doing this, could you please relate any tips or tricks? Please keep in mind that the selection must be as flawless as possible and able to withstand enlargement to poster size while still looking good

All input is appreciated!

As you said there are many variables that can come into play when making a selection. If you are talking about a head to toe selection then I would think that 5 minutes would be average for me as long as there is decent contrast and there is no fly away hair. That can add a significant amount of time. I will sometimes start with one of the lassoo tools and then move onto the refine selection command which will normally finish things off nicely. For really tough selection I will do the selection using the channels method which for me is most exacting. If you are doing that many composites have you considered shooting the subject on a green screen which then makes selections much easier. There are so many different ways of doing selections and there isn't one that will suit all situations so it makes your question harder to answer.

The first thing that I thoughtt of was to shoot green (or some other suitable colour) screen. If you are being asked for this sort of product a lot then it seems that some sort of automated system is essential. The extra bit of time needed to do the green screen shots up front has got to outweigh the in excess of three hours per team that you are currently putting in to the PP.

Alan

If you choose your backdrop judiciously, then you can use a channel in the image to make your mask generation automatic - the time would be spent in cleaning up the channel mask - typically in brushing in black or white in overlay mode.

kirk

Full body sports figure...10 minutes sounds about right...the tricky part for me is getting the refine edge done correctly, ie, feather and decontaminate color settings.

Now, to totally hijack this thread...I've yet to figure out a quick way to do something like this...

IMAGE LINK: http://s329.photobucke​t.com …edia/selection-1.jpg.html

chauncey, what is it that you are trying to do? Just remove the reflection? If so, have you tried to use any of the clone stamp or content-aware tools?

Ahh...not exactly. I want to move all ten of the reflections to a more attractive background...with the associated birds that caused the reflections.

Selections: If you know you need to make them, adjust for that while shooting. (Don't shoot against dark gray if should be placed on white).
Then: 15 minutes or so if it's not too critical.
Alternatively (easier): green screen and maybe software made for the task.

chauncey: I'm assuming you've got an image you want to paste the birds into (and the birds are a cutout on a separate layer)? Why not create the (new) reflections? Flip, transform as needed, then displacement map & blend modes.
http://www.photoshopes​sentials.com …effects/water-reflection/

Thanks for the link Rene but I've tried that technique and it looks too artificial...back to your regularly scheduled programming.

chauncey wrote in post #15928484
Ahh...not exactly. I want to move all ten of the reflections to a more attractive background...with the associated birds that caused the reflections.

chauncey wrote in post #15930295
Thanks for the link Rene but I've tried that technique and it looks too artificial...back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Unfortunately, I think this is where the artists shine... and I'm not one of them.

My guess is that part of what makes it look artificial is that the water color alone may be different in your new image. So not only do you need the reflection in the new image, but probably a different color cast as well. The selection alone would be difficult if you wanted to move those exact ones... particularly since the brightness of the colors isn't much different. The best suggestion that I'd have would be to simply use a mask and have to paint them in. Then, I'd expect that you would have to apply a hue/saturation adjustment layer to account for the difference in water (but it's probably not quite that simple). Artists who really understand light, colors, shadows, etc. can do this sort of work without too much thought... and that's where I usually fall short

The Question that I have yet to answer is, do you shoot against a similar color background as your composite background, or is the chromakey that easy to lift your image? Then you have to deal with stray hairs.....

chauncey wrote in post #15930295
Thanks for the link Rene but I've tried that technique and it looks too artificial...

You need to use the actual waves in the water to create the displacement map, not a "squiggly lines" one. That's what makes it look fake