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Thread started 21 May 2013 (Tuesday) 15:33
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Trading a 7D for a Nikon D7100?!?!

 
mark2009
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May 22, 2013 16:24 as a reply to  @ post 15957657 |  #46

To the original OP, you stated the 7d is becoming old and obsolete. There are many many here still get fine photos with 5dc, 5dii, 20d/30d..etc..etc....t​o be honest I bet most of us get less than 50 percent of what these camera can do before we upgrade.
I am one of them, I sold my 50d, and some lens an anticipation for the new 70d, to what ever, and we all know where that stands. Did I need to upgrade, no, but I had the 50d for a few years and just wanted something else. I did what you are doing, starting looking at nikon and going jes, they offer a lot for the money on paper. I currently shoot mostly sports, and saw that the buffer was terriable on the d7000.....the d7100 did sound good, but when I went and handled it, it just felt kinda cheap..I had the money in hand to buy it, and it just did not feel right...just my personal take...plus I started thinking about menu systems, and what I know about canon lenses(somewhat anyway), and nothing about nikon, so I ended up buy a mint used 7d because everyone is on the full frame frenzie!. Anyway, I guess my point is we can all talk ourselves into or out of what we really need, vs want....I did talk to a lot of people when I was going to make the switch, to guys that did make the switch, canon to nikon, and they told me don't do it....I am not bashing nikon at all, I just think learn a system, and stick with it.




  
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Birdwatcher86
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May 22, 2013 16:59 |  #47

^^^ Yes, I did use the word "Obsolete" in my original posting, and in retrospect that probably was not the exact descriptor I should have used. I too know that I have not extracted even the tip of the iceberg of what this camera is capable of producing. In the end, I probably won't switch because I am invested both mentally (knowing the functions of the camera in particular) and financially in Canon. But it doesn't hurt to take a look at other options every once in awhile. Obviously I don't have to elaborate on this point because I see you too have been down this path.


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mark2009
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May 22, 2013 17:13 |  #48

Birdwatcher86 wrote in post #15957795 (external link)
^^^ Yes, I did use the word "Obsolete" in my original posting, and in retrospect that probably was not the exact descriptor I should have used. I too know that I have not extracted even the tip of the iceberg of what this camera is capable of producing. In the end, I probably won't switch because I am invested both mentally (knowing the functions of the camera in particular) and financially in Canon. But it doesn't hurt to take a look at other options every once in awhile. Obviously I don't have to elaborate on this point because I see you too have been down this path.

No, I understand where your coming from, like I said I just sold my 50d after a few years, loved it, but was itching for something else.....one thing I came close to do, is buy some used nikon stuff,,,,that way you could always sell it and not loss to much $$$, of course I don't if there is many d7100 used out there.....

Good luck in you search




  
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May 23, 2013 01:53 |  #49

shedberg wrote in post #15956982 (external link)
She had major AF issues with the D7000, she had to send it back to Nikon 2 or 3 times before they finally just replaced it. The new one is better, but still nowhere near as good as the 7D.

The D7100 had more noise at all ISO levels than the D7000, and the AF was no better.

I've seen numerous reviews and photos that do not support this contention at all.


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MikeWa
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May 23, 2013 12:28 |  #50

No doubt Nikon is making some fine cameras and equipment. But in the 7D you currently have one of the finest digital cameras ever made. If changing formats would be a financial burden then why would you ? Especially since in making this change you will only be trading features and accomplishing little in the way of improved photography. My guess is you would be better served spending your money on higher quality accessories. Getting your lens fixed or purchasing an upgrade lens would also be some options. On the other hand you can never go wrong buying a new camera.

Mike


Mike...G9; 7D; 7D Mark II; EF-S 10-22mm; EF-S 18-135mm IS STM; EF 28-300mm F3.5-5.6L; EF 70-300mm IS USM; EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS-II; EF 100-400mm f4.5-5.6L IS; EXT 1.4-II & 2.0-III; The more I learn the less I know.

  
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kcbrown
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May 23, 2013 20:56 |  #51

shedberg wrote in post #15956982 (external link)
The D7100 had more noise at all ISO levels than the D7000, and the AF was no better.

That's probably because they/you are looking at the noise in the wrong way. The D7000 has a 16 megapixel sensor, whilst the D7100 has a 24 megapixel sensor. If you're looking at noise at 100%, the D7100 can show higher levels of noise even when the total noise signature in the frame is lower.

The proper way to compare the noise for the things that matter, namely printing and web use of the resulting images, is to downsize the larger image to match the smaller image's resolution and then compare the noise. I think you'll find, in that case, that the D7100's noise signature will be lower.


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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kcbrown
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May 23, 2013 21:28 |  #52

Birdwatcher86 wrote in post #15953993 (external link)
Well, to start off let me just say, I really like Canon! I have enjoyed my 7D, and it has treated me well these past couple of years. I mostly do nature photography, and more specifically Bird shots. This is something that the 7D definitely excels at!

So for your use case, the 7D is essentially a perfect fit.

Now, to talk about my current dilemma. A few weeks ago, my 100-400L malfunctioned. It was nothing major, just an adjustment issue with the focal length ring. It is no longer able to fully secure the lens at any given length. It doesn't affect the quality of the photos or adjusting the length of the lens. It is just a bit more of a pain holding it in place if it needs to be tilted, which makes the zoom creep backwards or forwards on the body of the lens. So, to make a long story short, I decided to sell the lens and acquire a 400mm 5.6 prime instead. That way I would never have to worry about this issue in the future. Also, the prime is of course an excellent birding lens and slightly sharper overall.

I started looking on the web for some camera gadgets (not a good idea for the pocket book) and ran across some of the new cameras that are starting to come out. I have not been in the market at all for something in a long time so I really have been in the dark as to what is out there now. So, I start seeing some stuff that Nikon has developed, such as the D7100 for sub $1k price range. It has these incredible sounding performance features, but yes they are just numbers and not evidence of a superior quality product. But, is it?

Well, let's suppose it is better than the 7D. The real question is: is the amount by which it is better sufficient to warrant switching to it?

Answering that requires that a couple of additional questions be asked:

  • In what way do you feel limited by your current gear?
  • How much of an improvement would be necessary to induce you to switch, and in what areas?



I mean, I imagine it probably IS a better camera than the 7D; I realize this body is aging a bit and the mark II is probably coming out soon.

That a camera is "old" doesn't mean it's any less good. The way I see it is this: you have a certain set of needs that you want fulfilled. From that point of view, what matters is whether or not the camera body you're holding in your hands fulfills that set of needs. If it does, there's really no need to be looking any further. If it doesn't, then you need to identify why and how it fails to meet your needs, so you can go looking for something that specifically does.

But you need to be careful: that your current camera may not meet a specific need of yours as well as you'd like doesn't imply that it doesn't do so for your other needs. Which is to say, when considering a different camera body, you need to consider both whether it will meet the specific need that is currently being unaddressed as well as the needs you have that are currently being addressed.

No camera body is perfect, not even the top of the line. Let me give you an example:

The 7D shows pattern noise in the deep shadows at ISO 100. If you push your shadows hard, you'll tend to see that a lot. Most people don't push their images that way, so they tend not to see that particular issue. If you do push your shadows that way, you can run a postprocessing action with Nik DFine to nearly eliminate the banding, so it's possible to postprocess it away for the most part. Even the 1DX shows this to some degree, though not nearly to the degree the 7D does.

But if you crank the ISO up on the 7D, the noise signature it produces is wonderfully random and film-like, and the end result is that high ISO shots from the 7D are fantastic, even if the level of noise is somewhat high. Random luminance noise has a pleasing, film-like look. We know that it's pleasing because many postprocessing programs include the ability to add that kind of noise.


The Nikon D600, on the other hand, is gloriously free of noise at low ISOs, and you can push its low ISO shadows all day long. The dynamic range at low ISOs is the stuff of legends, a landscaper's dream. But when you're shooting the D600 at very high ISOs, you get a horizontal banding pattern much like what you'd get from the 50D and earlier Canon cameras. This doesn't begin to show itself until around ISO 6400. It's easily visible at ISO 12800 and up at 100%. It tends to disappear with downsizing, and you really need large areas of near-black for it to become really obvious. As with the low ISO banding of the 7D, this, too, can be cleaned up in postprocessing for the most part. But it's there, and it's an imperfection.

I fully expect the D7100 to exhibit the same horizontal banding at very high ISOs (ISO 6400 and up). That means the D7100 will have some imperfections.


Another upside of the 7D that the D7100 is lacking: cross-type autofocus points throughout the frame. The D7100's cross-type points are in the 3 vertical columns in the center and that's it. The 7D's autofocus points are all cross-type.

Maybe I'm just over-reacting, but I need some advice here from some fellow Canon users. I don't want this to become a bashing Nikon thread, I just want some honest comparisons and some pros and cons.

Thanks ahead of time :),
Michael

My advice to you, frankly, is to not go off chasing gear. That way lies the ruin of your pocketbook. :lol:

Rather, ask yourself if you are unsatisfied with the camera body you have. If you're not, then keep shooting with it! If you are, then identify exactly why, and try to identify camera bodies that fill that gap and which won't leave any gaps that will matter to you. In other words, be looking for real improvement that truly matters to you.

And only when you've identified such bodies (if doing so is even necessary) should you look at their price. If their price is too high, stick with what you've got. If they're not, then and only then should you really rent them to see if they really will meet your needs.


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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Birdwatcher86
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May 23, 2013 22:06 |  #53

^^^ fantastic response! :)

I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head with all of your points and I'll use this advice. The main gist of it all is that I AM pleased with my current setup. So, it would probably be wise to stay where I'm at rather than go chasing gear like you say. I think if I did switch that I would be pleased with the Nikon too, but why go through the trouble if I currently like what I have and the results I obtain. I may end up renting it just to see what its all about, but for now I think I'll just purchase the 400mm prime and enjoy the heck out of the results.

Again thanks for taking the time to respond with that detailed writing :)


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Birdwatcher86
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May 23, 2013 22:09 |  #54

MikeWa wrote in post #15960076 (external link)
No doubt Nikon is making some fine cameras and equipment. But in the 7D you currently have one of the finest digital cameras ever made. If changing formats would be a financial burden then why would you ? Especially since in making this change you will only be trading features and accomplishing little in the way of improved photography. My guess is you would be better served spending your money on higher quality accessories. Getting your lens fixed or purchasing an upgrade lens would also be some options. On the other hand you can never go wrong buying a new camera.

Mike

I agree with you! I've decided to stick with my setup and purchase the 400mm prime as originally planned. I might rent the D7100 to see what it's all about, but the financial switch would be pretty heavy set...eventhough the camera is a cheaper body, the lenses are more expensive for obtaining a Canon equivalent lens (not including they don't carry anything like the Canon 400mm prime).

Cheers


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May 23, 2013 22:24 |  #55

Birdwatcher86 wrote in post #15961799 (external link)
I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head with all of your points and I'll use this advice. The main gist of it all is that I AM pleased with my current setup. So, it would probably be wise to stay where I'm at rather than go chasing gear like you say. I think if I did switch that I would be pleased with the Nikon too, but why go through the trouble if I currently like what I have and the results I obtain. I may end up renting it just to see what its all about, but for now I think I'll just purchase the 400mm prime and enjoy the heck out of the results.

There's most certainly nothing wrong with renting other equipment from time to time just for the fun of it. I mean, life's too short to hold back from such things. Go for it!

If you like the 7D enough, then at whatever point yours breaks (sadly, breakage is more or less inevitable after enough time), it may be worth picking up a second one. Hopefully, by that time, they'll be dirt cheap. I don't know that I would do that before hand if you're budget limited. I picked up a second 7D because I like mine enough that I felt it was worth doing and it didn't impact my finances too much (got a refurbished unit).

Of course, not long after that, my very good friend gave me a D600. :)


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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May 23, 2013 22:33 |  #56

Here are my thoughts.. sure it is great to pick up a new magazine or go through the forums to read everything impressive about the new cameras being introduced. newer technology is better for sure and it excites the hell out of people including myself... it is always "I want" or "Must Have" kind of feeling. the truth is looking back through the years you realize that it is not so much the camera you use, but the images you take with them.

If you sell your 7D and enjoyed every bit of it and decide to buy a D7100 because of its newer features and great IQ.. in the next few months, Canon will announce the 7DII which so far is being dubbed the "Mini 1DX" now I suppose that a switch back from the D7100 to the 7DII will seem to be the more better option.

Invest in the Glass and replace bodies as you need. other than that, its a world where technology is forever changing and even the newer bodies will be replaced by newer bodies...




  
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May 24, 2013 11:26 |  #57

Birdwatcher86 wrote in post #15961799 (external link)
^^^ fantastic response! :)

I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head with all of your points and I'll use this advice. The main gist of it all is that I AM pleased with my current setup. So, it would probably be wise to stay where I'm at rather than go chasing gear like you say. I think if I did switch that I would be pleased with the Nikon too, but why go through the trouble if I currently like what I have and the results I obtain. I may end up renting it just to see what its all about, but for now I think I'll just purchase the 400mm prime and enjoy the heck out of the results.

Again thanks for taking the time to respond with that detailed writing :)

The grass is always greener... or is it :lol:


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May 24, 2013 15:11 |  #58

elrey2375 wrote in post #15963212 (external link)
The grass is always greener... or is it :lol:

LOL! You are very right my friend. It always looks greener...

That's why I prefer to rent something for a couple of days rather than go by what a hundred strangers say is awesome or crap from their POV.

I've rented a 6d, an EM5, Tamron 70-200VC, XE1, and getting an SL1 next weekend. What I've learned from each rental and how it suits what I need has been well worth every penny... and fun :)


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May 24, 2013 19:42 |  #59

BrickR wrote in post #15963927 (external link)
LOL! You are very right my friend. It always looks greener...

That's why I prefer to rent something for a couple of days rather than go by what a hundred strangers say is awesome or crap from their POV.

I've rented a 6d, an EM5, Tamron 70-200VC, XE1, and getting an SL1 next weekend. What I've learned from each rental and how it suits what I need has been well worth every penny... and fun :)

This is the only way to go and it's truly great for us as consumers that we have several reputable rental places to choose from. I've got an X100s and a X-E1 coming from Lensrentals for a month to check them out and see which I want. You can read all you want but you need to live with the camera to see how you get along. If I buy the camera and don't like it and sell it in a few months, I'm going to lose the money that I paid to rent it anyway so I might as well rent it and find out.


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May 24, 2013 20:28 |  #60

you might want to consider first the price of Nikon lenses. they don't have a 100-400mm but they do have a 200-400 which is very expensive.

im a 7D owner + 400mm f5.6 for birding. I have never complained about my 7D, yet I just complained of the low aperture of my 400mm f5.6. AF wise, the 7D is stunning as long as you know the technique.


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Trading a 7D for a Nikon D7100?!?!
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