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Thread started 22 May 2013 (Wednesday) 07:23
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Why no business?

 
mike1812
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May 22, 2013 13:59 |  #46

huntersdad wrote in post #15957176 (external link)
Plenty of practice with them, but nothing I post on my website. I'm a little hesitant to put pics of my family up as examples of my work.

The following comments address upgrading your portfolio:

So don't post them, but PRACTICE with them. Experiment with using backdrops and such, rather than just the tree trunk. Experiment with instructing your wife on how to pose. Examine the effect of different lighting placements. Doing all this will help you discover YOUR look - what you have to uniquely offer your clients. And if your wife is skilled and willing, engage her as a MUA to style your clients (and TF models). If not, try to find and meet an aspiring or pro MUA who is willing to work with you on your shoots, either paid or TF in some way (a local beauty college is a great place to look).

And you've stated your limitations on who you know. So get out there and get to know those you DON'T know. You have to have a thick skin, be able to bounce back from a "no", and meet a number of people. Place a "casting call" ad in the local paper if you're not getting results from CL or Model Mayhem. Offer TF in exchange for portrait session. You gotta think outside the box and get outside your comfort zone.

Networking/generating leads:

Are you friends with any other local photogs? You should be. While you may be competitors, many of you will have different niches. A buddy of mine locally just posted on FB that he had a client looking for a wedding photog - something he doesn't do - so he was offering it up to his friends that do that line of work. You need to connect with everyone and everything. Word of mouth will do wonders. Do a good job with some of the TF shoots for your portfolio, and he/she will tell his/her friends.

Are there any major businesses there? You could contact their HR department and offer a limited time complimentary head-shot session with a minimum print/file purchase. There are lots of things you can do - you just have to be creative.


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mike1812
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May 22, 2013 14:12 |  #47

So I just had a chance to look at your website. I will say, how you describe the process and the phrases you use, well. . .they don't scream professional. And I don't mean that as in "professional photographer", I mean professional anything, period. It sounds like your talking to your best bud over a beer about what you will do. This is a BUSINESS WEBSITE, and you need to convey a serious tone that clearly states what the client can expect from a photo session with you.


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huntersdad
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May 22, 2013 14:45 |  #48

While all this conversation has gone one, I redid the website to address some of the issues brought up here.

- The wood background is gone, replaced with an all white background on each page
- I have disabled the pop-out boxes, so rather than a page for each type of photography to click, it's one page. I can reattach the pop-outs at a later time, if needed.
- About me has been moved down from the top to next to the bottom
- The Investment page will be standardized for all sessions since they were all the same anyway
- I'll rewrite all wording to give it a more professional tone.

Some good ideas coming out about finding some models. My wife can't do the MUA responsibilities, so I'll check into the local cosmo schools.


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May 22, 2013 15:18 as a reply to  @ huntersdad's post |  #49

Lots of good suggestions regarding branding and improvements on your website. However, a website will never (OK, no absolutes - probably never) bring you the $$$ you need to survive. You should be out in the community, networking, shooting anything you can, because work brings more work. Shoot civic organization meetings. Shoot real estate listings. Shoot ball games for youth of all ages. Call on law offices and medical clinics that use headshots for their websites. Do it constantly. This will bring you referrals, and 1 referral is worth 100 clicks on your website. Best of luck to you from a Pirate from the 60's.


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huntersdad
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May 22, 2013 15:21 |  #50

kjonnnn wrote in post #15957425 (external link)
On your website:

- Your Portfolio page is blank. It least when I click. Just changed it. It will be fixed tonight.
- Investments Page is incomplete? What's to go there? Do I really care? See above. It will be fixed tonight.
- Clients Page. It seems you post all of the photos of your clients. Maybe I dont want my photo posted publicly. Every client has the right to require a password. Some do, some don't. Anytime a child is involved, I generally password protect it.
- You say you're going for a niche market of 25-50 year old women, but you display wildlife, not subjects of your niche market. Not sure what I am going to do with that yet. Seems you guys want it removed but I do sell some of my wildlife work.
- The text on your contact page cannot be read ... I'd change to something with more contrast. That's getting fixed.

See above.


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tlzimmerman
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May 22, 2013 15:30 |  #51

huntersdad wrote in post #15957226 (external link)
I typed up a very professional email and sent it to the youth minister. She then sent it out to all seniors and upcoming seniors and their parents. The email specifically stated that the shoot would be free and all images would be edited and given to the student. Our YM vouched for me as, obviously, most people didn't know me. Neither she nor I got any response this was 4 months ago. She recently resent the email out to our upcoming seniors about 4 weeks ago. Again, nothing.

Hence why I volunteered to go out and do some work for them this weekend and will be doing a bigger event in a couple weeks.

This is your problem....you are trying to sell a personal connection and service without personally connecting with anyone. You have to sell yourself, in person, shake hands, kiss babies.


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May 22, 2013 15:42 |  #52

huntersdad wrote in post #15957226 (external link)
I typed up a very professional email and sent it to the youth minister. She then sent it out to all seniors and upcoming seniors and their parents. The email specifically stated that the shoot would be free and all images would be edited and given to the student. Our YM vouched for me as, obviously, most people didn't know me. Neither she nor I got any response this was 4 months ago. She recently resent the email out to our upcoming seniors about 4 weeks ago. Again, nothing.

Hence why I volunteered to go out and do some work for them this weekend and will be doing a bigger event in a couple weeks.

I'm just gonna take a stab and say that the reason you aren't getting any interest is because it's being offered for free. This is an important event in a young person's life and between your website and offering things for free, a feeling of desperation creeps in. It's basically like this; you need better shots in your portfolio. As for people to photograph, it's a matter of meeting people and shaking hands. I always have releases and business cards in my car. If you see someone who is photogenic, explain your story, offer them a free portrait session, nail the photos and build your portfolio. The worst they can say is no and you're no worse off. You have to be able to show prospective clients that you can make them look good and give them the kind of photos they want. The people in your photos look like nice, ordinary people but you've documented them exactly as they are. That's not what most people want.


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huntersdad
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May 22, 2013 15:46 |  #53

elrey2375 wrote in post #15957553 (external link)
I'm just gonna take a stab and say that the reason you aren't getting any interest is because it's being offered for free. This is an important event in a young person's life and between your website and offering things for free, a feeling of desperation creeps in. It's basically like this; you need better shots in your portfolio. As for people to photograph, it's a matter of meeting people and shaking hands. I always have releases and business cards in my car. If you see someone who is photogenic, explain your story, offer them a free portrait session, nail the photos and build your portfolio. The worst they can say is no and you're no worse off. You have to be able to show prospective clients that you can make them look good and give them the kind of photos they want. The people in your photos look like nice, ordinary people but you've documented them exactly as they are. That's not what most people want.

No offense to anyone else, but that may be the most interesting comment I have read yet. Very good point.


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May 22, 2013 15:55 |  #54

huntersdad wrote in post #15957572 (external link)
No offense to anyone else, but that may be the most interesting comment I have read yet. Very good point.

Even a blind hog finds an acorn every once in a while :lol:

Just keep at it if it's what you really want to do. At the end of the day, it's a struggle like any other job but at least it's something you love. Not everyone can say that. Find some photogenic (that means pretty) people and start building a better portfolio. You can have every other thing right but being able to showcase to clients what you can deliver to them is key to the entire thing being successful.


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May 22, 2013 15:59 |  #55

kjonnnn wrote in post #15957592 (external link)
^^ Just don't get tagged as that creepy guy offering free photos to young women ....

It's all in your approach and attitude. That's why people skills are just as important as anything else. You have to be able to put people at ease immediately. Being prepared and being professional goes a long way in that respect. Being that we're talking about models, people automatically go to young women but it can be anyone.


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May 22, 2013 17:08 |  #56

huntersdad wrote in post #15957226 (external link)
I typed up a very professional email and sent it to the youth minister. She then sent it out to all seniors and upcoming seniors and their parents. The email specifically stated that the shoot would be free and all images would be edited and given to the student. Our YM vouched for me as, obviously, most people didn't know me. Neither she nor I got any response this was 4 months ago. She recently resent the email out to our upcoming seniors about 4 weeks ago. Again, nothing.

Hence why I volunteered to go out and do some work for them this weekend and will be doing a bigger event in a couple weeks.

...I think everyone here has touched on great points. And I think that this one:

charro callado wrote:
In terms of the things most important for building a client base I would put the color of your website somewhere between the kind of pants you wear and your middle school math grades.

is both hilarious and most accurate. To just make his point clearer: he isn't saying your website and branding isn't important: it very much is. But ultimately its a symptom, not a cause of your problems. Your business is a rudderless ship: there is no clear direction and the state of your website simply reflects that. You could spend the next three months redesigning your website, rewriting your web copy, and making your website look spectacular but if no-one is visiting you still won't get any business.

My advice is to start at the end. Forget about what sort of photographer you are right now. Forget about the images you are currently producing. Take some time out to start planning your business. You started your business late last year and you have got no business: if you take a month or two off to prepare a business/marketing plan/shoot your portfolio it won't hurt your business at all. You are making money with your wildlife stuff: put resources into that for the time being while you rebuild your portrait business.

I'm just guessing here but I bet your in a rut right now. Before you start preparing your business plan you need to start changing your daily habits and shaking things up. Start a daily to-do list. Make weekly goals, set targets. Make everything time sensitive. Figure out ways to break up your routine. Come to the realization that what you are doing is not working: so its time to try something very different and to keep on doing different things until things start to come together.

Figure out your market. Who will buy your images? Make a "person" profile of the type of person that would buy your services. Look at where these people are currently spending their money. Go out and talk to them. Don't take this the wrong way but send your wife out to talk to them as well. Again forgive me for being blunt: but how big a supporter of your business is your wife? (Please don't answer that here in public) She needs to be your biggest champion. She needs to be in your corner. She needs to believe in you.

Forget comparing yourself to craigslist: if you want to be a professional photographer then you need to be looking at the professional photographers in your area. Look at how they present themselves. Look at their images. Count how many words are on their website. Look at their prices.

Figure out what sort of photographer you want to be and what kind of images you want to produce. Go look at websites and images you love and figure out what it is you like about them and figure out how they were shot. Note everything you like, look at the backgrounds, look at the lighting, look at the colours, look at the colour temperatures, look at the angles you are shooting. I'm not going to critique your work: but your images aren't "popping" for me. Go look at images that sell. Deconstruct them. Work backwards. Forget about who you are. Figure out who you want to be.

Get your current work critiqued in person. Find a photographer who isn't competition to you (maybe in another town or at a local photo school) and ask them to give you a formal critique. Listen to that critique, don't respond, take it on board, and work to fix it.

Come up with a plan to completely strip down all of your current work and replace it with new portfolio stuff. For example: after a year in business this year I did a re-assessment of what I did right and what I did wrong. One of the things I determined was that I needed to diversify my product range and needed to build from scratch a strong commercial portfolio. I started a new portfolio project: Project 50, teamed up with a model agency and am working with a prop company, and after eleven weeks of the project (and with 39 weeks to go) I've got enough images to build my commercial portfolio book and in a month I start to shop it around. Shoot with your portfolio in mind. Start with a goal of ten "show stopper" images of ten different people/groups. Plan how you are going to get these photos: be deliberate.

Talk to people. Lots of people. Do you have a comfort zone? Then get out of it.

If you haven't written a business plan already: then write one. If you have got one already then throw it out and start again because its clearly not doing you any favours. The business plan becomes your handbook on how to run your business. If circumstances change then update the handbook. (If you want to see mine: send me a PM, as long as you promise to keep it confidential.) Once you've got a plan in place the direction in which to take your business will be much, much clearer. Good luck.


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May 22, 2013 18:20 |  #57

Examples of identifying your best foot and putting it forward. Rebranding.

The Truth

I'm a wildlife photographer trying to get into portraiture because that's where the money is.

What to Tell the Public

Do you work with animals? Do you treat your pets like full members of your family? Would you like a professional-quality photograph of your child holding the new puppy? Let me bring my years of experience to the job of putting your domestic animals or livestock in the best light. The images I create, whether of your cherished pet, your prize bull, or your favorite saddle horse, will [etc.]

The Truth

I don't have a gazillion-dollar studio. They cost too much.

What to Tell the Public

A passion for the beauty of nature has led me to specialize in outdoor settings.

The Truth

I'm a flaming introvert and I don't know many individuals.

What to Tell the Public

Are you planning an organized event outdoors? My experience with photographing in natural light makes me your top choice for group pictures.

---------------

Note that some of these examples engage the reader by asking questions and by using a lot of personal pronouns, especially "you" and "your." Another word that research has consistently found effective in advertising is "new."

I probably went out on a limb here. These are just illustrations of one way you might go. I'm thinking you might do well by marketing to 4-H groups, garden clubs, gun clubs, rodeos, Scout groups, or whatever you have locally that does things outdoors.


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charro ­ callado
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May 22, 2013 19:30 |  #58

banquetbear wrote in post #15957820 (external link)
...I think everyone here has touched on great points. And I think that this one:

is both hilarious and most accurate. To just make his point clearer: he isn't saying your website and branding isn't important: it very much is. But ultimately its a symptom, not a cause of your problems. Your business is a rudderless ship: there is no clear direction and the state of your website simply reflects that. You could spend the next three months redesigning your website, rewriting your web copy, and making your website look spectacular but if no-one is visiting you still won't get any business.

My advice is to start at the end. Forget about what sort of photographer you are right now. Forget about the images you are currently producing. Take some time out to start planning your business. You started your business late last year and you have got no business: if you take a month or two off to prepare a business/marketing plan/shoot your portfolio it won't hurt your business at all. You are making money with your wildlife stuff: put resources into that for the time being while you rebuild your portrait business.

I'm just guessing here but I bet your in a rut right now. Before you start preparing your business plan you need to start changing your daily habits and shaking things up. Start a daily to-do list. Make weekly goals, set targets. Make everything time sensitive. Figure out ways to break up your routine. Come to the realization that what you are doing is not working: so its time to try something very different and to keep on doing different things until things start to come together.

Figure out your market. Who will buy your images? Make a "person" profile of the type of person that would buy your services. Look at where these people are currently spending their money. Go out and talk to them. Don't take this the wrong way but send your wife out to talk to them as well. Again forgive me for being blunt: but how big a supporter of your business is your wife? (Please don't answer that here in public) She needs to be your biggest champion. She needs to be in your corner. She needs to believe in you.

Forget comparing yourself to craigslist: if you want to be a professional photographer then you need to be looking at the professional photographers in your area. Look at how they present themselves. Look at their images. Count how many words are on their website. Look at their prices.

Figure out what sort of photographer you want to be and what kind of images you want to produce. Go look at websites and images you love and figure out what it is you like about them and figure out how they were shot. Note everything you like, look at the backgrounds, look at the lighting, look at the colours, look at the colour temperatures, look at the angles you are shooting. I'm not going to critique your work: but your images aren't "popping" for me. Go look at images that sell. Deconstruct them. Work backwards. Forget about who you are. Figure out who you want to be.

Get your current work critiqued in person. Find a photographer who isn't competition to you (maybe in another town or at a local photo school) and ask them to give you a formal critique. Listen to that critique, don't respond, take it on board, and work to fix it.

Come up with a plan to completely strip down all of your current work and replace it with new portfolio stuff. For example: after a year in business this year I did a re-assessment of what I did right and what I did wrong. One of the things I determined was that I needed to diversify my product range and needed to build from scratch a strong commercial portfolio. I started a new portfolio project: Project 50, teamed up with a model agency and am working with a prop company, and after eleven weeks of the project (and with 39 weeks to go) I've got enough images to build my commercial portfolio book and in a month I start to shop it around. Shoot with your portfolio in mind. Start with a goal of ten "show stopper" images of ten different people/groups. Plan how you are going to get these photos: be deliberate.

Talk to people. Lots of people. Do you have a comfort zone? Then get out of it.

If you haven't written a business plan already: then write one. If you have got one already then throw it out and start again because its clearly not doing you any favours. The business plan becomes your handbook on how to run your business. If circumstances change then update the handbook. (If you want to see mine: send me a PM, as long as you promise to keep it confidential.) Once you've got a plan in place the direction in which to take your business will be much, much clearer. Good luck.

This is sound advice, and I'm not just scratching his back.




  
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May 22, 2013 22:09 |  #59

huntersdad wrote in post #15956379 (external link)
For you guys having issues, what are you using when having issues - desktop/laptop/cell phone? I have had issues with my cell, but nothing else, so I am interested in hearing what you are using.

Desktop, WinXP, Firefox 20.0.1
I just checked again & it seems to work OK now.


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huntersdad
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May 23, 2013 07:18 |  #60

PhotosGuy wrote in post #15958592 (external link)
Desktop, WinXP, Firefox 20.0.1
I just checked again & it seems to work OK now.

Thanks Frank. Something about the pop-outs was screwy although they were tested extensively when implemented and never had a problem.


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