Canon is still working on the foveon sensor!

Alex_Venom wrote in post #15962966
I don't see it quite that way.
Canon improved a LOT from 5D2 to 5D3 on the areas people most complained about: AF, weather sealing, ergonomics (aka dedicated buttons).
And still managed to focus on new lenses and flash that just leave the competition drolling: 70-200II, 24-70II and 600RT.

The sensor was left behind. OK. But if you consider the 5D3 as a wedding/news camera, then the DR and resolution advantage of the D800/D800E goes down the water. No in-field news shooter will want a gazillion megabytes file just so can crop the hell out of it, and DR is important but they can live without it. Same for wedding shooters.

Now, if you consider Landscape and Studio shooters, then OK, the D800/D800E is the route to go definitely.

A few years back Canon had the junk because of its pitty AF.
Now Canon has the junk because of resolution and DR.
If they fix it on the 5D4, I am sure someone will show up and say "Oh, but this camera stinks! The D900 has a popup flash!"

News people probably wouldn't be shooting RAW, so file size is considerably smaller. Wedding shooters don't want DR and an extremely detailed image? First I'm hearing of this

As for holding Canon accountable, none of the issues that have been mentioned are a 'popup flash' as you put it. They are real issues that affect users.

elrey2375 wrote in post #15963495
News people probably wouldn't be shooting RAW, so file size is considerably smaller. Wedding shooters don't want DR and an extremely detailed image? First I'm hearing of this

I bet better AF and faster frame rate are more important for both kinds of shooters than DR and MP count. And the fact that the 5D3 outsells the D800 on the stores at a ratio of 3 to 1 might indicate that more people need its features more (anyone still have the link to that? I couldn't find it )

elrey2375 wrote in post #15963495
As for holding Canon accountable, none of the issues that have been mentioned are a 'popup flash' as you put it. They are real issues that affect users.

They ARE reall issues and AFFECT people. Thing is: it does NOT affect everyone and there ARE people willing to live with a smaller DR and MP count in benefit of a truly great AF and faster frame rate. I myself went 5D3 because of the AF alone. I couldn´t care less for DR and MP. Of course it would be good to have it, but for my kind of shooting it is not mandatory, only desireable.

Todd Lambert wrote in post #15957238
Because other than online penis wavers, most of Canon's customers don't care about the slight differences between Canon and Nikon.

haha, that made me laugh out loud. I've never even looked at Nikon or any other brand once I had Canon gear. Not gonna jump ship because one is a bit faster with what ever new thing than the other. Maybe if Nikon would make cameras that also brew beer, but other than that I'm perfectly happy with shooting a Canon

Ginga wrote in post #15959138
Uhm.. That is only on the higher ISO-levels.

On base ISO, Nikon destroys Canon.

"Destroys" is an over statement, IMO. Better, yes, but not that much.

Alex_Venom wrote in post #15963541
I bet better AF and faster frame rate are more important for both kinds of shooters than DR and MP count. And the fact that the 5D3 outsells the D800 on the stores at a ratio of 3 to 1 might indicate that more people need its features more (anyone still have the link to that? I couldn't find it )

...

Frame rate and AF are going to be important to news shooters; DR much less so, since half-tone printing loses so much any way.

But I doubt faster frame rate is much of an issue to wedding shooters; 3-5 fps is likely plenty, though good AF in poor light is important. I would almost guarantee you that they would like as much DR as they can get; the black tux next to the white dress is tough...

archer1960 wrote in post #15963658
Frame rate and AF are going to be important to news shooters; DR much less so, since half-tone printing loses so much any way.

But I doubt faster frame rate is much of an issue to wedding shooters; 3-5 fps is likely plenty, though good AF in poor light is important. I would almost guarantee you that they would like as much DR as they can get; the black tux next to the white dress is tough...

True, but the 5D3 and even 5D2 have already DR enough to expose for the dress and still pull the tux with no problem if you shoot RAW. I´ve done it and I´m no Wedding Photog.

jdizzle wrote in post #15960996
The D800/E has been compared to Phase One's IQ180.

Well, yeah, my point is that Canon isn't even comparable, in that sense, to Nikon in terms of resolution. Okay, you want to say that the 5D3 is a wedding/PJ camera that doesn't then need high-MPs, but guess where people will go for a high-res camera? Nikon, because Canon doesn't have high-res cameras anymore (it's 2013, Nikon has 6.5 cameras with more megapixels than anything Canon has). I know there's more than just MP, and that that may be a detriment in more than one way, but if you need resolution, one company is unlike the other.

archer1960 wrote in post #15963642
"Destroys" is an over statement, IMO. Better, yes, but not that much.

So you've actually done DR tests with the D800? I had the 5D3 and it just couldn't pull shadows like the D600/D800/E.

CAL Imagery wrote in post #15963786
Well, yeah, my point is that Canon isn't even comparable, in that sense, to Nikon in terms of resolution. Okay, you want to say that the 5D3 is a wedding/PJ camera that doesn't then need high-MPs, but guess where people will go for a high-res camera? Nikon, because Canon doesn't have high-res cameras anymore (it's 2013, Nikon has 6.5 cameras with more megapixels than anything Canon has). I know there's more than just MP, and that that may be a detriment in more than one way, but if you need resolution, one company is unlike the other.

Just sayin' of course. Even my D4s have better DR than the 1DX.

Alex_Venom wrote in post #15963707
True, but the 5D3 and even 5D2 have already DR enough to expose for the dress and still pull the tux with no problem if you shoot RAW. I´ve done it and I´m no Wedding Photog.

Nice! Highlight tone priority works!

jdizzle wrote in post #15964062
Just sayin' of course. Even my D4s have better DR than the 1DX.

I had little doubt.

jdizzle wrote in post #15962729
Hehe! I'm not sure if you updated your firmware but, I can certainly tell you that the LV, WB, and AF( quicker) have been improved.

I must get around to that, thanks

jdizzle wrote in post #15964062
Just sayin' of course. Even my D4s have better DR than the 1DX.

If only they made a D800 with an EF mount.

The PC-E 24 is quite inferior (no independently-adjustable axes, less shift, more CA, not as sharp) and there's no 17mm version.

Shadowblade wrote in post #15967581
If only they made a D800 with an EF mount.

The PC-E 24 is quite inferior (no independently-adjustable axes, less shift, more CA, not as sharp) and there's no 17mm version.

I know. That's why I went with a tech cam. My Rodenstock Digaron blows away those Canon TS-E lenses.

jdizzle wrote in post #15969117
I know. That's why I went with a tech cam. My Rodenstock Digaron blows away those Canon TS-E lenses.

Blasphemy


You are quite right. Not to mention the perspective conrol you get from that kind of camera There's a lot of glass out there that blows away Canons especially weak are their wide angle lenses and their normal 50mm lenses. Yes, even their Ls.