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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 11 Jun 2013 (Tuesday) 18:26
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Light Weight Battery for Speedlights...?

 
dmward
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Jul 02, 2013 21:42 |  #61

EmaginePixel wrote in post #16086007 (external link)
Forget the Din extension. Wouldn't it be easier to just fabricate an extension cable (female to male) of the 3 pin connection into the speedlite? Where's Lon (flashzebra) or Ed (Cheetahstand)?

QUOTED IMAGE

The reason for the DIN connection is to match the various high voltage battery connections ala Cheetah L4500, Quantum and the subject of this thread the PB3000.

They all share the DIN connector. That means that, hopefully, a cable intended for one battery will work with another battery. So, for example, my Cheetah Cx cable will work with the BP3000. And, the PB3000 cable will work with the L4500 on a Canon speedlite.


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EmaginePixel
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Jul 02, 2013 23:04 |  #62

True, but the DIN solution limits to the brands of battery packs as you mentioned. The 3 pin (straight through) cable allows usage for any and all battery packs. I could use it to extend my Pixel pack or any CP-E4 compatible packs just as well.


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elv
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Jul 02, 2013 23:24 as a reply to  @ EmaginePixel's post |  #63

Did you guys have a USB port in your PB3000 packs?

Mine has just arrived, and it has 2 flash ports instead!
.


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Whortleberry
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Jul 03, 2013 02:58 |  #64

EmaginePixel wrote in post #16086189 (external link)
True, but the DIN solution limits to the brands of battery packs as you mentioned. The 3 pin (straight through) cable allows usage for any and all battery packs. I could use it to extend my Pixel pack or any CP-E4 compatible packs just as well.

:D


  1. Try getting a loose 3-pin plug which fits any of the external power sockets on any flashgun. Rocking Horse Effluent (external link) and Hen's Teeth (external link) are easy by comparison. So how do you even start to make a "3 pin (straight through) cable"?
  2. The DIN solution, while far from perfect, at least maintains compatibility as much as possible with existing proprietary solutions. How many times have you read of, or experienced, something which is the right gear but just won't fit. OK, the DIN plug is a lousy solution - but it's the best lousy solution we've got at the moment.

elv wrote in post #16086217 (external link)
Did you guys have a USB port in your PB3000 packs?
Mine has just arrived, and it has 2 flash ports instead!

Haven't actually got one - hit the dreaded "Cannot ship to your location" for some reason. Don't really need one anyway so from my point-of-view this discussion is interesting but hypothetical.
BTW - Godox do make a DIN to USB cable, but whether it's available on it's own is debatable - I suppose someone would supply if you offered enough, but why bother? I would venture that the 2 flash port option is the better option for most purposes.


Phil ǁ Kershaw Soho Reflex: 4¼" Ross Xpres, 6½" Aldis, Super XX/ABC Pyro in 24 DDS, HP3/Meritol Metol in RFH, Johnson 'Scales' brand flash powder. Kodak Duo Six-20/Verichrome Pan. Other odd bits over the decades, simply to get the job done - not merely to polish and brag about cos I'm too mean to buy the polish!
FlickR (external link) ◄► "The Other Yongnuo User Guide v4.12" by Clive Bolton (external link) ◄► UK Railway Photographs 1906-79 (external link)

  
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dmward
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Jul 03, 2013 07:52 |  #65

elv wrote in post #16086217 (external link)
Did you guys have a USB port in your PB3000 packs?

Mine has just arrived, and it has 2 flash ports instead!
.

With the unplug problem I experienced when using on this past weekend, I can't think of a circumstance where I'd want to have two things plug into one pack.

Even so, that is an interesting change to the design.


David | Sharing my Insights, Knowledge & Experience (external link) | dmwfotos website (external link)

  
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tongki
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Jul 03, 2013 08:09 |  #66

Whortleberry wrote in post #16085329 (external link)
Hosted photo: posted by Whortleberry in
./showthread.php?p=160​85329&i=i148800442
forum: Flash and Studio Lighting


Red wire to pin 7, yellow wire to pin 1 and white wire to pin 5 (the pins are numbered inside the jack of good makes, right next to the pin solder point). The Lumberg SV81 from Farnell (external link) is a nice jack plug.
:

Hi Berry,
your Farnell link are very helpfull,
so, what is the name for the coneector of Cheetah AD-180 or Godox ?

I mean,
if I can built a better quality cable because the original is kinda ... u know


EOS 70D x 2 units + EOS 7D mark II x3 units
Newton FR3, Newton modified bracket, EF 17-40mm x4,EF 24-70mm f/2.8 x2, EF 70-200mm f/2.8 x2
Quantum Trio x2, T5D-R x1 + FW7Q x1, CoPilot x2, Godox AD-180 x5
Propac PB960 head x12, PB960 battery x10
sorry, no stupid speedlite from Canon !

  
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Whortleberry
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Jul 03, 2013 08:56 |  #67

tongki wrote in post #16086975 (external link)
Hi Berry,
your Farnell link are very helpfull,
so, what is the name for the coneector of Cheetah AD-180 or Godox ?

I mean,
if I can built a better quality cable because the original is kinda ... u know

Now that is the problem! The plugs which fit the Godox, Canon, Nikon, Sony and Metz flash units are all proprietary - peculiar to each individual maker. None of these makers want us messing about making things for ourselves - they won't even tell us what their "High Voltage" exactly means, just try to warn us off. I'm fairly certain (99.9%) that they are not available on the open market. There would be no call for them as far as the flash makers / patent holders are concerned as they will sell us exactly what they've decide we want (whether or not this really is exactly what we want :rolleyes:). Hence you would have to vandalise an existing lead to get the plug alone - not difficult to do but you are then reliant on at least a small part of the original cable.


Phil ǁ Kershaw Soho Reflex: 4¼" Ross Xpres, 6½" Aldis, Super XX/ABC Pyro in 24 DDS, HP3/Meritol Metol in RFH, Johnson 'Scales' brand flash powder. Kodak Duo Six-20/Verichrome Pan. Other odd bits over the decades, simply to get the job done - not merely to polish and brag about cos I'm too mean to buy the polish!
FlickR (external link) ◄► "The Other Yongnuo User Guide v4.12" by Clive Bolton (external link) ◄► UK Railway Photographs 1906-79 (external link)

  
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tongki
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Jul 03, 2013 13:05 |  #68

question is,
if they are not available on the open market,
how come manufacture like Pixel can make the same battery pack with "the right" plug to Canon flash ?

also others like Bolt, Godox, etc

I mean, you do believe that it is not a common plug of something ?

I search on the link you gave,
wow, really confusing, even after filter the search on specific, it still showing hundreds of

about the high voltage,
it can be measured, right ? I found out 328V and 8V for Quantum Trio


EOS 70D x 2 units + EOS 7D mark II x3 units
Newton FR3, Newton modified bracket, EF 17-40mm x4,EF 24-70mm f/2.8 x2, EF 70-200mm f/2.8 x2
Quantum Trio x2, T5D-R x1 + FW7Q x1, CoPilot x2, Godox AD-180 x5
Propac PB960 head x12, PB960 battery x10
sorry, no stupid speedlite from Canon !

  
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Whortleberry
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Jul 03, 2013 15:54 |  #69

The likelihood is that makers of flash packs all buy the leads from a common supplier with the plug ready moulded on. Given the volumes each are likely to use individually, it's unlikely that each company has made their own moulds and set up their own moulding line to produce a relatively small number of leads. It just wouldn't be economically viable. There is also a vast difference between buying in commercial quantities, usually on minimum order contract, and being able to get 'one-offs'.

It's not that I 'believe' it's not a common plug - I KNOW it's not a common plug. The only plug which fits the external power port of a Canon flashgun is this specific plug - it's an intentional design feature. No other will fit unless you start individual surgery / butchery on a similar plug. The nearest similar plug is the one which fits the Godox flashgun. Guess what? The same criteria apply to this variety also. This one only fits Godox flashes, only available ready moulded on the end of a cable.

The other end of the lead - in the case of Quantum, Godox, Bolt and Sky Eagle this terminates in a DIN 45326 plug - is intentionally compatible across a range of battery packs. To make this possible, they have to use a commonly available plug. The current favourite is the DIN 45326 which is actually an AUDIO plug and not even a power plug at all. Prior to this, there were a number of power packs available which used a 2-pin co-axial BNC bayonet-fix power plug but this didn't allow for the additional low voltage line needed by the latest types of flash - hence the need for a readily available plug with more than 2 pins. So we end up with a situation where the power pack has a circular DIN socket with 8 individual pin-sockets and a lead with plug using just 5 pins. The 5 pins will fit into a 5 pin socket or an 8 pin socket and no others. Using 8-pin sockets on the power pack socket gives a degree of 'future-proofing' and the flexibility to make changes without making all existing leads obsolete. It's not electronics, just ergonomics and marketing.

Voltage. Yes, we can measure the OUTPUT of the power pack. What is more difficult for us is measuring the input requirements of each type of flashgun. There is a degree of standardisation at present and a variety of power packs are able to power a variety of flash units, within specific limitations. There are also flash units which can, only after conversion of the power pack output, also use these same power packs. This is done with further voltage adjustment - usually in a little box part-way along the lead. If you research the Quantum leads for Metz flash units, you'll find a bewildering array of options. Lead "A" will only work with certain flashes, if you have a different flash then you might need Lead "B". This doesn't just apply to Metz flashes, it's just that this is the brand with which I'm the most familiar.

The final reason for the definite unavailability of the plug which fits the flash external power port is that, were they to be available readily, at some stage some idiot would couple up totally the wrong power source and harm themselves. "I wonder what happens if I couple this up to the mains supply" is very far from impossible to conceive.

A parallel example of the stupid things people do. A few years ago, a man using his power tool drilled through live cable. He died. His wife sued the power drill maker successfully because it didn't say on the drill "DO NOT DRILL THROUGH LIVE CABLE". Stupid and fatal thing to do which I would consider entirely his own fault. The Jury disagreed and awarded damages. Flashgun makers feel the need to avoid something similar happening to them, even though the voltages may not be lethal to a healthy person. What if that stupid person had a pacemaker fitted? Would the voltage be lethal then? Would you be prepared to take the risk? Damages, especially punitive damages, can be ruinous so the situation is avoided with 'unavailable' plugs.

All the preceding in addition to the need to protect commercial interests and hopefully steer buyers towards one make of product instead of another.

All-in-all, you're unbelievably unlikely to find one of the desired plugs on the open market. But if you do happen upon that one chance in millions, make sure you tell us all.


Phil ǁ Kershaw Soho Reflex: 4¼" Ross Xpres, 6½" Aldis, Super XX/ABC Pyro in 24 DDS, HP3/Meritol Metol in RFH, Johnson 'Scales' brand flash powder. Kodak Duo Six-20/Verichrome Pan. Other odd bits over the decades, simply to get the job done - not merely to polish and brag about cos I'm too mean to buy the polish!
FlickR (external link) ◄► "The Other Yongnuo User Guide v4.12" by Clive Bolton (external link) ◄► UK Railway Photographs 1906-79 (external link)

  
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tongki
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Jul 04, 2013 01:29 |  #70

Whortleberry wrote in post #16088434 (external link)
All-in-all, you're unbelievably unlikely to find one of the desired plugs on the open market. But if you do happen upon that one chance in millions, make sure you tell us all.

I like this part :D really :lol:

Godox and Canon flash cable looks similar only different in some little form

well,
if we can not find the socket, I suggest, we open the unit and soldered directly into

Quantum T5D-R also got direct cable connected


EOS 70D x 2 units + EOS 7D mark II x3 units
Newton FR3, Newton modified bracket, EF 17-40mm x4,EF 24-70mm f/2.8 x2, EF 70-200mm f/2.8 x2
Quantum Trio x2, T5D-R x1 + FW7Q x1, CoPilot x2, Godox AD-180 x5
Propac PB960 head x12, PB960 battery x10
sorry, no stupid speedlite from Canon !

  
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Whortleberry
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Jul 04, 2013 04:08 |  #71

tongki wrote in post #16089727 (external link)
I like this part :D really :lol:

Godox and Canon flash cable looks similar only different in some little form

well,
if we can not find the socket, I suggest, we open the unit and soldered directly into

Quantum T5D-R also got direct cable connected

Now that part I really do NOT like. Most people lack the locomotor skills to even attempt something like this. Additionally, there is considerable personal danger associated with the capacitors inside flashguns unless you are fully aware of the consequences and appropriate procedures. If you know these then yes, it's simple - but then, if you know these you don't need the warning anyway!

Many many years ago, I saw a colleague thrown maybe 10ft across a room simply by touching the capacitor in a SMALL flashgun. He spent 10 days in Coronary Care in Hospital. Fortunately, he was extremely fit and healthy and did recover. Not everyone would survive. I'd be EXTREMELY WARY of a blanket recommendation that "we open the unit and soldered directly into ....". For some, yes, it'd be perfectly safe and straightforward but for others it could potentially be the last thing they ever do.

Yes, I've twiddled about inside both battery and mains flash units extensively. Very carefully and taking considerable precautions. I certainly wouldn't suggest it to all and sundry as my conscience wouldn't stand the potential consequences for even just one person.

Let's just carry on looking for plugs and sockets instead - less stressful.


Phil ǁ Kershaw Soho Reflex: 4¼" Ross Xpres, 6½" Aldis, Super XX/ABC Pyro in 24 DDS, HP3/Meritol Metol in RFH, Johnson 'Scales' brand flash powder. Kodak Duo Six-20/Verichrome Pan. Other odd bits over the decades, simply to get the job done - not merely to polish and brag about cos I'm too mean to buy the polish!
FlickR (external link) ◄► "The Other Yongnuo User Guide v4.12" by Clive Bolton (external link) ◄► UK Railway Photographs 1906-79 (external link)

  
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dmward
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Jul 06, 2013 08:23 |  #72

Had a need to recharge my Sky Eagle BP3000 after the wedding shoot. It was on the charger overnight.
Only shows three blue lights. Which is what it showed when it came out of the box. I put the charger on it then and the light stayed green. So, it appears the 4 blue light indicator is really a three blue light indicator.

BTW, I used the velcro tie to keep the cable in place. Worked like a charm. When I got home one of the Paramount cables Dave suggested was waiting. Its about 50% longer than the original and much less stiff.
Should work well. although I think I'll still use the velcro ties.

Battery does deliver flashes.


David | Sharing my Insights, Knowledge & Experience (external link) | dmwfotos website (external link)

  
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Whortleberry
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Jul 06, 2013 15:57 |  #73

elv wrote in post #16086217 (external link)
Did you guys have a USB port in your PB3000 packs?

Mine has just arrived, and it has 2 flash ports instead!
.

In the pretence that this is to help Elv (the actuality being that he most likely knows already) but really for those people who absolutely cannot bear to be without their cellphone for one single nanosecond (poor souls), here's the cable (external link) to charge your devil-device from the Cheetah/Godox power pack.

Because of the slightly snide, tongue-firmly-in-cheek nature of the comments in the previous paragraph, it'll come as no surprise that I haven't tried this unit personally. :rolleyes: I just present it for your delectation, delight, satisfaction and as yet another gadget on which to spend your money.;)


Phil ǁ Kershaw Soho Reflex: 4¼" Ross Xpres, 6½" Aldis, Super XX/ABC Pyro in 24 DDS, HP3/Meritol Metol in RFH, Johnson 'Scales' brand flash powder. Kodak Duo Six-20/Verichrome Pan. Other odd bits over the decades, simply to get the job done - not merely to polish and brag about cos I'm too mean to buy the polish!
FlickR (external link) ◄► "The Other Yongnuo User Guide v4.12" by Clive Bolton (external link) ◄► UK Railway Photographs 1906-79 (external link)

  
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Light Weight Battery for Speedlights...?
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