Bride Cancels Wedding, Wants Depsoit Back

elrey2375 wrote in post #16034043
And this is also a good example of why you NEVER tell them how many photos you took.

No, but they gotta be aware of the difference between 13 and 100.

gonzogolf wrote in post #16034235
No, but they gotta be aware of the difference between 13 and 100.

13 out of 100 might be a good number. Eyes that are closed, something weird about expression, hair in the wrong place, etc. After you whittle out the ones that don't make the cut, 13 out of 100 could be good, you never know

On your blog it says the Engagement Sessions are 2 hours long. Did you photograph for 2 hours? If you didn't, and she only received 13 photos with less then 2 hours of shooting, I'd say just give back 50% of the deposit, which I would guess would be $55? (Engagement Session :$220. Deposit is 50% $110)

You still get paid, though not as much as you'd like. But is it really worth $55 to make this such a huge deal? I don't think she is being unreasonable. She isn't asking for ALL the money back. She understands you gave a service and deserve to be paid for it, though a service she is not happy with.

What I don't get is that they don't like the chemistry between you and them...but they still want you to shoot their Bridal Shower.
Something suss is going on.

philwillmedia wrote in post #16035375
What I don't get is that they don't like the chemistry between you and them...but they still want you to shoot their Bridal Shower.
Something suss is going on.

Does anyone actually believe that "chemistry" has anything to do with this?
The engagement shoot didn't go according to plan and as a result the B&G didn't get either the number or quality of images they were expecting. As a result they are nervous and want the OP to shoot the shower as a way of finding out for sure if they can produce images of the quality shown in the OPs portfolio.

The found a way to get some freebies out of you, and hoping it will work. Stick to your contract. Let them know if there is "no chemistr"y then that means you're not the right fit and it's pointless to continue to do any-type of further work with them. If they only gave you a certain percentage towards the overall total payment, subtract the value of the time you've input with the conditions you had to work with to which they agreed instead of rescheduling that day, and give them back the difference only after they will sign some kind of documentation that they will not slander your name based upon termination of contract, where you amicably part ways.Have your lawyer come up with one if you don't already have one. If it smells like poop chances are it's poop. Best is to stay away from crappy clients like that. You don't need the high blood pressure nor the stress or feeling drained and discouraged after dealing with them.

To me, the deposit is not worth the hassle, its already consuming your time and attention.
I would just give back the deposit, and move on. Let them keep what they have and advise your services are no long available to them.

To me business is about making people happy, happy people pay. If you can't make them happy, move on but leave the best impression you can. Bad word of mouth is not worth any deposit

IMHO return the "Deposit" less deduction for time spent (and document the hours) at the billing rate and depart as your contract allows. You have a conflict either between you that is honest in style and expectations (and thus hard to overcome) or worse, they are dishonest and trying to obtain services for which they are not paying and do not intend to pay. There is no way for you to know which is the case with certainty. The first is bad but possibly salvageable, the second will become a nightmare if you continue. There is no reason for you to continue once your original premise, that both parties are dealing in good faith and like each other at a professional level, has been materially damaged. You negotiated a price on that premise and it's no longer valid.

Next, change your contract to specify that you are collecting a "Non-refundable booking fee" rather than a "Deposit." Explain in the agreement that the fee is for the privilege of retaining the date and is fully-earned at signing. Specify appropriate and reasonable constraints on changes in the date, time and/or venue once the commitment is taken and booking fee is paid. In a case such as this the latter is important because apparently part of the problem was either arrangements with one of the venues and/or weather conditions; one is under your control if you know about it in advance but the other is not, but your fee must (and should) include the first while the risk of the second and its impact on results must lay with the client, since they are the ones choosing both the venue and date/time.

If you are not already doing so change your fee schedule so that you collect for each component of your work as-performed. If your booking fee is particularly substantial then allow it to be applied to the LAST payment for service (only!) in whole or part as you deem appropriate. Had you put this in place up front there would have been a strong disincentive for someone to try to obtain services without paying for them. This is important for the future as the first and best defense against a client pulling something like this is for the contract to make such behavior unprofitable -- and thus you'll never sign such a client in the first place.

Do not (ever) allow a payment against your schedule to slip or be made in a non-agreed manner. This is particularly true if you specify good, cleared funds (and you damn well should) because people DO write rubber checks and while you might eventually get the funds the collection costs both personally and financially are ridiculous.

This ought to be a warning sign for the groom. I feel bad for you OP but I feel worse for him.

Refund their money with an agreement that you get to photograph the divorce!

overclock wrote in post #16045450
This ought to be a warning sign for the groom. I feel bad for you OP but I feel worse for him.

Refund their money with an agreement that you get to photograph the divorce!

I was thinking this throughout my entire reading of this thread! In fact, I'm wondering if part of the initial consultation should include the photographer asking, "Have either of you been diagnosed as schizophrenic, manic-depressive, or bi-polar?". LOL.

This is a good read and good thread. OP, I like your openness to the responses.

Here is my take, I have been in a similar situation but worked out well.

1) the client is being reasonable. You also have two people on the end of the email, the bride and groom (groom normally remains hidden but you can bet they wrote the message together).

2) the reason for the request of the bridal shoot is simple. They are not 'digging'. If we understand they are being reasonable, they clearly understand that you may not give them their money back, so Instead they are asking of something that may be of value.

3) I am concerned that you have already spent their money. That's why there is a problem returning it. Always keep a fund of cash in the bank for emergencies like this.

4) I had to fight tooth and nail not to shoot a bridal session yesterday with parents of the bride as it was horid weather. They eventually gave in, based on the need to 'trust me as their photographer'.you should have postponed.

5) 13 images. Ridiculous. Especially given the time it took to present them with 13 images. I would be livid.

6) you failed in what you had planned, it was your fault not there's. give them all their money back and walk away. Run away from them. Don't keep their money u less you really think you earned it.

I like your work on your website.

7) learn and move on.

Don't worry about bad reviews. If they are threatening, they will likely leave them anyway.

Secondly, let your work speak for you. Some like it, some don't. I took a quick peek at your blog, and it's quite clear you have a younger, edgier feel. Perhaps they were after something a bit more romantic, warm and soft... Regardless. She sounds like a complete bridezilla who won't be happy with anything...probably ever...