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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 01 Jul 2013 (Monday) 23:04
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Canon EOS 70D officially announced!

 
dnauer
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Jul 06, 2013 21:23 |  #706

mojodawg wrote in post #16097413 (external link)
Any thoughts on pre-ordering? I usually wait until the dust settles before I jump on new technology, but I am overdue for an upgrade and I wouldn't mind having the 70D in my hands sooner rather than later.

Just wondering if anyone has had issues in the past with early production runs.

I was an early adaptor of the 40D and have waited. I'm preordered within 12 hours of the announcement with B&H. Go for it.




  
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Keyan
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Jul 06, 2013 21:41 |  #707

mojodawg wrote in post #16097413 (external link)
Any thoughts on pre-ordering? I usually wait until the dust settles before I jump on new technology, but I am overdue for an upgrade and I wouldn't mind having the 70D in my hands sooner rather than later.

Just wondering if anyone has had issues in the past with early production runs.

I preordered one. Usually if there are any early production run issues Canon makes them right. Also have a 60 day local return policy if it doesn't work well or has an issue.


Cameras: 7D2, S100
Lenses: 17-55 f/2.8 IS USM, 18-135 STM, 24-70 f/4L IS USM, 50 f/1.4 USM,70-300L IS USM
Other Stuff: 430 EX II, Luma Labs Loop 3, CamRanger

  
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Keyan
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Jul 06, 2013 21:42 |  #708

iowajim wrote in post #16097538 (external link)
I waited for the T2i for some time because it had full HD video, where the T1i did not. I bought it the day it was first available. It dropped in price a few months later, but for my first dslr I was happy. Since I am camera-equipped, I'm tempted to wait for the reviews on the 70d. Especially since the 70d has a new sensor, new focus system, new SD card compatibility, somewhat limited lens support for the new focus system, the fantastic reviews that the EOS M had...

Somewhat limited lens support...? 103 lenses?


Cameras: 7D2, S100
Lenses: 17-55 f/2.8 IS USM, 18-135 STM, 24-70 f/4L IS USM, 50 f/1.4 USM,70-300L IS USM
Other Stuff: 430 EX II, Luma Labs Loop 3, CamRanger

  
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mojodawg
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Jul 06, 2013 22:18 |  #709

Keyan wrote in post #16097617 (external link)
I preordered one. Usually if there are any early production run issues Canon makes them right. Also have a 60 local return policy if it doesn't work well or has an issue.

True, and with Dave saying "go for it" - I can hardly resist.


70D | 10-22mm ƒ/3.5-4.5 | 17-55mm ƒ/2.8 | 50mm ƒ/1.4 | 70-300mm ƒ/4-5.6 |

  
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gjl711
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Jul 06, 2013 23:57 |  #710

mojodawg wrote in post #16097413 (external link)
...
Just wondering if anyone has had issues in the past with early production runs.

Canon sort of has a bad track record with new introductions, especially with new technology. The 1D3 AF issue, the 5DII white spot issue, the 5DIII light leak issue to name a few. With this sensor being teh first time it has hit any camera, I would not be surprised if there is some issue that pops up. To Canon's credit though, they have done a pretty decent job making good once the issue is understood and a fix strategy put in place.


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DreDaze
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Jul 07, 2013 00:29 |  #711

Keyan wrote in post #16097619 (external link)
Somewhat limited lens support...? 103 lenses?

i think the main thing people are wondering is how it plays with 3rd party lenses...


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FEChariot
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Jul 07, 2013 00:49 |  #712

gjl711 wrote in post #16097815 (external link)
Canon sort of has a bad track record with new introductions, especially with new technology. The 1D3 AF issue, the 5DII white spot issue, the 5DIII light leak issue to name a few. With this sensor being teh first time it has hit any camera, I would not be surprised if there is some issue that pops up. To Canon's credit though, they have done a pretty decent job making good once the issue is understood and a fix strategy put in place.

It's not really new technology though right? It's more a matter of scale. The t4 and M have some pixels dedicated to dual AF, this just goes a step further by having every pixel for dual AF. Am I wrong?


Canon 7D/350D, Σ17-50/2.8 OS, 18-55IS, 24-105/4 L IS, Σ30/1.4 EX, 50/1.8, C50/1.4, 55-250IS, 60/2.8, 70-200/4 L IS, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 IS L, 135/2 L 580EX II, 430EX II * 2, 270EX II.

  
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kcbrown
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Jul 07, 2013 00:50 |  #713

Tom Reichner wrote in post #16096346 (external link)
Underexposing (intentionally) is often very necessary in the type of photographhy I do. When I underexposed 7D images, the noise grain was noticeably worse than when I intentionally underexposed 50D images to the same extant. Perhaps for the type of photography you do, you do not need to underexpose often, but if you have, have you noticed the difference between the way the two bodies handle noise grain when shooting at ISO 400 and ISO 800?

I've not had to underexpose at those ISO ranges, so I can't comment on the difference between the 50D and the 7D in that regard.

However, I do know that the 7D absolutely demands good exposure, and that it seems to be more sensitive to proper exposure than other camera bodies. So your experiences here don't surprise me at all. The best you can do is overexpose the highlights by about a stop and then pull them back during postprocessing (the 7D has about a stop of headroom in the RAW), but it sounds like you'll still have to push your midrange and shadows in order to get the results you're looking for.

If you nail the exposure or ETTR, my experience is that the 7D will outperform the 50D, though not by very much at middle ISOs.


Unfortunately, it really sounds like you'd be much better served by Nikon equipment for what you do. You'd get perhaps a stop of additional dynamic range over the 7D in the ISO range you're talking about, even from the D7100. The D600 will give you an additional half stop on top of that, roughly, but it means going full frame (which may suit you just fine for all I know).


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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kcbrown
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Jul 07, 2013 01:32 |  #714

Canon_Lover wrote in post #16096747 (external link)
FYI, Nikon DR is only superior at lower iso.

Once above 800 Canons actually tend to a slight advantage in DR.

That's true for the Canon full frame models. The 7D does have the odd nonlinear dynamic range curve that the full frame models have, but it falls away less gradually than the full frame models do. ISO 100 dynamic range is nearly the same between the 7D and the 6D, but the gap widens past ISO 400. The Nikon D7100 and the Canon 6D intersect at ISO 800. Before then, the D7100 has the DR advantage.

Unless someone shoots ISO 400 or lower for birds in flight, there is no advantage.

With respect to Canon's full frame lineup, that's true.

But with respect to Canon's crop lineup, the Nikons hold a 1 stop lead throughout the ISO range, and that lead widens below ISO 800.

Still would be nice to have more though! :)

Never can have too much dynamic range as long as you have enough bit depth in your files to handle it. :)


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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iowajim
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Jul 07, 2013 08:16 |  #715

DreDaze wrote in post #16097858 (external link)
i think the main thing people are wondering is how it plays with 3rd party lenses...

That^^


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jhayesvw
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Jul 07, 2013 19:50 as a reply to  @ iowajim's post |  #716

kcbrown wrote in post #16097898 (external link)
I've not had to underexpose at those ISO ranges, so I can't comment on the difference between the 50D and the 7D in that regard.

However, I do know that the 7D absolutely demands good exposure, and that it seems to be more sensitive to proper exposure than other camera bodies. So your experiences here don't surprise me at all. The best you can do is overexpose the highlights by about a stop and then pull them back during postprocessing (the 7D has about a stop of headroom in the RAW), but it sounds like you'll still have to push your midrange and shadows in order to get the results you're looking for.

If you nail the exposure or ETTR, my experience is that the 7D will outperform the 50D, though not by very much at middle ISOs.


Unfortunately, it really sounds like you'd be much better served by Nikon equipment for what you do. You'd get perhaps a stop of additional dynamic range over the 7D in the ISO range you're talking about, even from the D7100. The D600 will give you an additional half stop on top of that, roughly, but it means going full frame (which may suit you just fine for all I know).

I agree that ETTR works well with the 7d for many instances but as Tom said with some wildlife it just isnt possible to ETTR.

It would suck to have to switch to Nikon because Canon wont make a sensor with less noise.



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Keyan
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Jul 07, 2013 20:15 |  #717

FEChariot wrote in post #16097896 (external link)
It's not really new technology though right? It's more a matter of scale. The t4 and M have some pixels dedicated to dual AF, this just goes a step further by having every pixel for dual AF. Am I wrong?

It is totally new. Previous designs have had some pixels which are masked on the left or right side that the sensor uses to detect phase. This is totally different. Each pixel has dual micro lenses and two photo receptors that can each detect phase. It is fundamentally different and new.


Cameras: 7D2, S100
Lenses: 17-55 f/2.8 IS USM, 18-135 STM, 24-70 f/4L IS USM, 50 f/1.4 USM,70-300L IS USM
Other Stuff: 430 EX II, Luma Labs Loop 3, CamRanger

  
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Keyan
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Jul 07, 2013 20:16 |  #718

Aaand now it is descending into a Nikon vs Canon pixel peeper war...like half of the threads here.


Cameras: 7D2, S100
Lenses: 17-55 f/2.8 IS USM, 18-135 STM, 24-70 f/4L IS USM, 50 f/1.4 USM,70-300L IS USM
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kcbrown
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Jul 07, 2013 21:19 |  #719

jhayesvw wrote in post #16100037 (external link)
I agree that ETTR works well with the 7d for many instances but as Tom said with some wildlife it just isnt possible to ETTR.

Understood. This is why I expect he'll be better served by a different camera, either a full frame Canon or a Nikon (crop or full frame).

It would suck to have to switch to Nikon because Canon wont make a sensor with less noise.

I agree, but that's precisely what Canon has refused to do for the past 4 years, at least on the crop front. And if what Canon itself says is true of the 70D's sensor, then I expect we'll see no real improvements there, either.

In other words, I fully expect Canon won't address this until the 7D2 at the earliest. They have to give it some truly substantial advantage over the 70D, and at this point, the sensor is really the only thing they'll have to "bargain" with.


"There are some things that money can't buy, but they aren't Ls and aren't worth having" -- Shooter-boy
Canon: 2 x 7D, Sigma 17-50 f/2.8 OS, 55-250 IS, Sigma 8-16, 24-105L, Sigma 50/1.4, other assorted primes, and a 430EX.
Nikon: D750, D600, 24-85 VR, 50 f/1.8G, 85 f/1.8G, Tamron 24-70 VC, Tamron 70-300 VC.

  
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Keyan
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Jul 07, 2013 21:46 |  #720

kcbrown wrote in post #16100300 (external link)
Understood. This is why I expect he'll be better served by a different camera, either a full frame Canon or a Nikon (crop or full frame).

I agree, but that's precisely what Canon has refused to do for the past 4 years, at least on the crop front. And if what Canon itself says is true of the 70D's sensor, then I expect we'll see no real improvements there, either.

In other words, I fully expect Canon won't address this until the 7D2 at the earliest. They have to give it some truly substantial advantage over the 70D, and at this point, the sensor is really the only thing they'll have to "bargain" with.

Reticular AF, 12 FPS, metal body and pro ergonomics, stuff like that.


Cameras: 7D2, S100
Lenses: 17-55 f/2.8 IS USM, 18-135 STM, 24-70 f/4L IS USM, 50 f/1.4 USM,70-300L IS USM
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