420EX and off-camera flash

Hi All,
Playing with my 650D and an older 420EX flash. I've got it to successfully use the in-built flash on the camera to wirelessly trigger the 420EX, which is great.
Couple of questions, though -

* Does using a 420EX wirelessly still give E-TTL when triggered by the on camera flash?
* As the 420EX does not have manual controls on the back of the flash, can I use the in-camera flash compensation via the menu and have it still work wirelessly to control the 420EX output, or does this need a wired sync cord to do?
* If I'm using the 420EX ON camera, then presumably the flash exposure compensation in the camera menu will work normally?

I'm working up to some club photography so need a method of balancing available light with flash...

Any tips much appreciated.
Ric

Yes to all.

Really? Awesome! I don't need to buy a new flash!
So part of the wireless sync protocol is that when I press the shutter - the camera's onboard flash triggers the slave, the slave then has the output adjusted by the camera based on the E-TTL metering over the wireless connection and all works just as if the 420EX was physically attached to the camera?

So for shots where I've got the camera in full manual, I'd be shooting around ISO 800, 1/8th sec to get the background to expose correctly - then I can just leave the flash in E-TTL, and it'll sort out the "freeze" exposure of people in a club?
And I can tweak the relative ambient/flash ratio by using in camera flash exposure compensation?
I should be able to use the in-camera menu to set the onboard flash to trigger only so I'm only getting the scene lit from the off camera, wireless flash too?

One other thing - when using an off camera wireless flash, the "external flash" controls in the camera menu are not available. I presume this means I just use the normal on-camera FEC controls to control the wireless output?
Pretty happy if this is all the case!
Thanks
Ric

You can run into ghosting if you run ambient too close to flash exposure with a slow shutter speed. I'd want to be closer to 1/60 at minimum, or drop ambient down a couple stops.

As far as the other settings, just play around with it and get comfortable. It works pretty well.

One issue you may have in the club would be line of sight and interference with the flash signals. Where do you intend to put the external flash?

The controls for "External flash" are for an external flash that's mounted in the camera's hot shoe. When you are using a "remote flash", then that's controlled by the camera's internal flash. Hence you use the setup for the internal flash to control the remote ones.
This works exactly the same if you have, say, a 580 EX II in the hotshoe and use that to control remote flashes.

Landwomble wrote in post #16202162
One other thing - when using an off camera wireless flash, the "external flash" controls in the camera menu are not available. I presume this means I just use the normal on-camera FEC controls to control the wireless output?
Pretty happy if this is all the case!
Thanks
Ric

I have a 650D and a 420EX. I'll have to try and see what control I have using the built in optical wireless and let you know. I've only used radio triggers to date since they have gotten so cheap. If you want to use the external flash control menu on your camera with a remote ETTL flash the Yongnuo YN-622C radio triggers are $89 a set. One trigger sits on your hotshoe and looks to the 650D like an external master flash. The other would slide under your 420EX foot and provide all the control over the flash you would have as if the flash was sitting on top of the camera. That would free you from the limitations of optical control such as line of sight and poor performance outdoors in bright sun and also replace the low light focus assist beam you lose by moving an external flash off camera.

The trusty old 420EX is a reliable ETTL flash. Its only limitation is that it can not be switched to manual power level control. You have to use ETTL and FEC. Most all current ETTL flashes in its power range also allow manual control.

Thanks all, some good tips. As a gear whore I'm trying to see what I can do with what I already have, rather than buy more stuff, but those Yongnuo units do get a good write up.

Planning to hand hold the flash off camera in the main, it's going to be me walking the venue rather than setting up formal light stands etc...