Shoot a group help

I have to shoot a group of educators. There will be about 30-40 people for the group photo. it will be shot in a gym on bleachers. Listed below is the equipment I have.
1. 2-Yongnuo flashes YN565
2. 1-light stand and one umbrella
3. Canon 60D
4. 2-Yongnuo triggers

I will be mounting flashes on the one stand with the umbrella and triggering with the Yongnuo triggers. My question is what to set the flashes at in regards to spread. 10mm-105mm?

If your firing them into an umbrella, there is no reason to zoom the flash at all. I'm not sure what you have planned, but I would probably find it difficult to light that many people with a small flash.

What's your plan?

I am planning on shooting both flashes through the umbrella to diffuse the light. This is all the equipment I have so I have to make due.

You may want to consider working with the ambient light.

It may be better to actually think about it as you will be working with the ambient light.

"In a gym on bleachers" is trouble. Gym lighting generally doesn't emit the full spectrum of color, so white balance is going to be tough. Additionally, it probably flickers with the AC current, so using a fast shutter speed is going to give erratic results.

How I would likely approach it:

Get as high as possible - e.g. on a ladder - and shoot down, so that the faces are somewhat closer to being in a plane that's parallel to the camera sensor. This allows you to keep everyone in focus using a somewhat wider aperture, and also reduces the chance that a person will be hidden behind the head of the person in front of them.

Set the camera to approximately the correct exposure for the gym lighting. Use a shutter speed of 1/60 - this is the absolute bottom edge of what I like for portraits, but I'd rather try to avoid capturing a partial cycle of the flickering gym lights. Set the aperture for the appropriate depth of field based on distance, focal length and crowd depth. Set the ISO for the correct exposure.

Clamp the camera (or tripod) to the ladder so I can take multiple shots, swapping faces in post if necessary.

Use bare flashes, each one a bit above and to each side of the camera, zoomed relatively wide. Set the power relatively low so that they supplement the ambient light for a little bit of fill, especially in the eyes; don't try to replace the ambient. Probably use a gel that's as close to the ambient color as possible.

On the umbrella: Maybe use an umbrella directly over the lens axis, maybe not. If I have plenty of power in the flashes then probably. If the umbrella is close enough to the subjects that its size makes a significant difference compared to bare flash, then it's also going to be close enough that the middle of the group will be way hotter than the outer edges of the group. To avoid objectionable light fall-off, you're gonna need to put your light source far away, which means more power, plus an additional couple of stops because the umbrella wastes/spills so much.

Additionally, I'd probably shoot a couple of test shots of a calibration tool such as the X-Rite Color Checker, which might help compensate for the ugly gym lighting. At an absolute minimum, a neutral gray reference is a must-have. White balance in gym lighting is gross.

Thanks for your suggestions. I am a bit panic-ed to say the least.

nathancarter wrote in post #16227638
"In a gym on bleachers" is trouble. Gym lighting generally doesn't emit the full spectrum of color, so white balance is going to be tough. Additionally, it probably flickers with the AC current, so using a fast shutter speed is going to give erratic results.

How I would likely approach it:

Get as high as possible - e.g. on a ladder - and shoot down, so that the faces are somewhat closer to being in a plane that's parallel to the camera sensor. This allows you to keep everyone in focus using a somewhat wider aperture, and also reduces the chance that a person will be hidden behind the head of the person in front of them.

Set the camera to approximately the correct exposure for the gym lighting. Use a shutter speed of 1/60 - this is the absolute bottom edge of what I like for portraits, but I'd rather try to avoid capturing a partial cycle of the flickering gym lights. Set the aperture for the appropriate depth of field based on distance, focal length and crowd depth. Set the ISO for the correct exposure.

Clamp the camera (or tripod) to the ladder so I can take multiple shots, swapping faces in post if necessary.

Use bare flashes, each one a bit above and to each side of the camera, zoomed relatively wide. Set the power relatively low so that they supplement the ambient light for a little bit of fill, especially in the eyes; don't try to replace the ambient. Probably use a gel that's as close to the ambient color as possible.

On the umbrella: Maybe use an umbrella directly over the lens axis, maybe not. If I have plenty of power in the flashes then probably. If the umbrella is close enough to the subjects that its size makes a significant difference compared to bare flash, then it's also going to be close enough that the middle of the group will be way hotter than the outer edges of the group. To avoid objectionable light fall-off, you're gonna need to put your light source far away, which means more power, plus an additional couple of stops because the umbrella wastes/spills so much.

Additionally, I'd probably shoot a couple of test shots of a calibration tool such as the X-Rite Color Checker, which might help compensate for the ugly gym lighting. At an absolute minimum, a neutral gray reference is a must-have. White balance in gym lighting is gross.

I shoot similar on a regular basis for schools, universities, sports teams and so on.

Good advice from nathancarter, the only thing I do differently is when inside I shoot with a shutter speed of a 30th of a second balancing my flash with the ambient light by adjusting the iso.

Lighting I do differ, I use a single studio head with no diffuser. Placed as high as possible and I bounce of the ceiling/roof.

Use a custom white balance and manually set the colour temperature in your camera and your colours should be spot on.

They are old enough, have them go old school and stand very still. Probably pull off 1/10th ss. I agree on the custom wb for the space, with that many people the fall off from the strobes will be dramatic, you could just set them to max power with the bounce, or bounce off a large umbrella. I'm sure you can try some sample shots before the event to get a good baseline.

My advice would be to totally forget about the umbrella. Umbrellas are great at creating diffused lighting, but only as a function of it's size relative to the subject. You'll have to move the umbrella WAY back to get even lighting and to cover all subjects. And at this distance, the umbrella won't really provide soft light. Moreover, the umbrella will reduce the effective power of the flashes going through it.

I think shooting at 1600 ISO and 1/60-ish with 2 flashes bouncing off the ceiling / wall, you'll actually be okay. It's an interesting challenge.

Tip: Get there early, decide where they will be sitting / standing, setup the flashes, then move from one end of where they'll be whilst taking shots of your hand as you move across and then up a row until you've covered most of the area they'll be occupying. If, e.g. you notice your exposures are falling off as you reach one end (judging by the shot of your hand in the scene), you'll know you have to angle / re-position your flash a little. Rinse and repeat until the exposures of all your hand shots are close enough. Thanks, David Hobby !

Don't forget the obvious solution to move the people to another location, if that's an option. Is there a set of bleachers outside you could shoot at?

Forget the umbrellas, find something to use as a second stand (rubber band the flash to a music stand or something) one flash pointing forward on each side of the camera so that you get even light across the entire spread of people. Using the two flashes in one umbrella will result in a bright spot in the middle with considerable falloff out to the edges. The farther your flashes are from the subjects the less falloff you will get from front to back so this may be the one time you want the flashes back further than the camera.

Took the picture today....will post later tonight.