Does anyone require a face to face meeting to discuss pricing and such?

abbypanda wrote in post #16228188
You are talking about negotiating prices. I'm not.
I'm not talking about lowering price or running the numbers. I get many emails and I ask people "what type of product are you looking for in terms of prints"
Answer always the same "I don't know"
How can they place any value on the price if they don't know?

By your example it's like someone calling for a car
"We'll what type of car do you want "
"Oh I don't know"

Ok it's "$30,000"

Uhhhhhhh

Flip this around. They dont want to commit to much in the way of a print order until they see their images. How can you ask if they are going to want a big enlargement until they are charmed by the image. This is why the shooting fee plus print markup model still exists, or the shoot and burn and walk away from prints is increasingly popular.

You are mistaking my post. I'm not referring to selling a large print up front.

I'm talking this :

Person sends email inquiry

You set up meeting, in the meeting say do a questionnaire about what they want for the session (kids pets family, setting, interests, etc and in addition they get a take home price list.
In addition you show them the option:
They can hold a book and look at it (they see the diff vs a shutterfly book)
They can see a comparison of prints (different papers, mounting options etc)
They can see canvas, etc.

They can book the shoot if they want.
Selling occurs after they see images


I am not talking about selling up front but merely showing and letting the person touch and see option.
I believe many dont know the difference and seeing could help

abbypanda wrote in post #16228092
Everyone can afford it, for the most part. Long ago I stopped buying into the whole "cant afford it". If people have cable, a smart phone, video games, SUV, nice clothes, internet, etc they can afford it. It's just a matter of what htey want to buy. Now yes there a few people who dont have cable, dont ahve a tv, dont have a smart phone or video games or any luxuries and drive a very old car adn truly cant afford it, but by and large the average person can. Did they go on vacation this year? How much did that cost?

Thus my question of inviting them in to show them an example of prints, canvas, etc to convey value. It also lets you meet them and build rapport, which I feel is an important part of closing the deal.

It's not really an issue of "can" or "can't", it a question of where their priorities are. Personally, having super-high-quality wedding pics wouldn't be all that high on my list. I'd rather spend 1/4 as much, and put the rest toward a house, the honeymoon, or whatever. When I got married back in '87, all the pics were taken by family and friends, and we loved them. Got copies of everybody's shots and put them in an album that brings back great memories.

abbypanda wrote in post #16228229
You are mistaking my post. I'm not referring to selling a large print up front.

I'm talking this :

Person sends email inquiry

You set up meeting, in the meeting say do a questionnaire about what they want for the session (kids pets family, setting, interests, etc and in addition they get a take home price list.
In addition you show them the option:
They can hold a book and look at it (they see the diff vs a shutterfly book)
They can see a comparison of prints (different papers, mounting options etc)
They can see canvas, etc.

They can book the shoot if they want.
Selling occurs after they see images


I am not talking about selling up front but merely showing and letting the person touch and see option.
I believe many dont know the difference and seeing could help

I think its a good option, but requiring it up front seem overly burdensome for some with limited time. If they've seen the portfolio and want me to do the work, I'm not placing any additional barriers to making it happen.

archer1960 wrote in post #16228247
It's not really an issue of "can" or "can't", it a question of where their priorities are. Personally, having super-high-quality wedding pics wouldn't be all that high on my list. I'd rather spend 1/4 as much, and put the rest toward a house, the honeymoon, or whatever. When I got married back in '87, all the pics were taken by family and friends, and we loved them. Got copies of everybody's shots and put them in an album that brings back great memories.

That was exactly my point

Christopher Steven b wrote in post #16228149
^ But Thomas, do you not include some kind of ball park in terms of pricing on your site / via email for the very reason of deterring those prospective clients who want shoot and burn pricing ? As you suggested, you don't really want to meet with these folks anyway.

Absolutely. Start at 1950 (that's 4hr Friday or Sunday) and most clients spend 4-7k. That's basically all they know, but we fluff it up a lot.

tkbslc wrote in post #16228160
Of course. I always get a lesson on why the undercoating and extended service plan is absolutely vital.

The difference is, I am not trying to upsell anyone. I talk to them about their wedding day and find out what they already want. I never push prints, albums, etc. I just want them to get to know me, be comfortable with me and figure out if they are a good fit for me and I am for them. I have zero problem turning someone away that I think will be a PITA.

I see face-to-face meet as a way for my clients to get to know me/us in person and for me/us to get to know them in person. All the formalities such as price, payment and deliverable are mostly ironed out during email/phone. By the time we meet, the client has pretty much booked us.

Our meetings are quite informal. More like meeting with an old friend and catching up on life....bounce some ideas. It is to allow each of us to be comfortable with one another for this collaborative photography project.

veritasimg wrote in post #16228434
I see face-to-face meet as a way for my clients to get to know me/us in person and for me/us to get to know them in person. All the formalities such as price, payment and deliverable are mostly ironed out during email/phone. By the time we meet, the client has pretty much booked us.

Our meetings are quite informal. More like meeting with an old friend and catching up on life....bounce some ideas. It is to allow each of us to be comfortable with one another for this collaborative photography project.

This. I meet with all my clients in their home to get to know them and they me. It also helps a lot to meet the children beforehand because I get a chance to hang out with them without my cameras. I also bring all my product samples like big canvas wraps, photo books, prints in different sizes so they can see in person how big something is on their wall, etc. My clients say it's nice to see the quality & size in person and jots down what size canvas they want to order later etc. During this meeting they sign the contract and pay the session fee. After the shoot, they buy all the products on my website. Works for me because all my clients are very close by, less than 10-15 min drive.

I don't require a meeting. Why should I need to do that? You can get all the info you need from my website about what I do, how I do it and what I offer etc. I'm not going to make it harder for someone to book if they just want to book by forcing a meeting on them.

I don't look as it as selling either. I tell people what I do. They decide if they want to book or not. I'm not phased either way as if they don't want to book then either price, product or personality do not fit their requirements. Which I'm not going to worry myself about. Not everyone is a client.

FWIW when I do meet with people at least 90% of them book. The main reason for that is I have pre-filtered people beforehand. Why waste my time with people who weren't really interested in the first place. Time is money.

I disagree about the "by giving a price" comment too. By giving a price you are letting people know whether you are in their ballpark or not.

Again FWIW I get a LOT of comments from clients about how useful my website is as far as giving information compared to other photographers. Why? Because it is transparent and tries to answer any questions people may have without them having to jump through hoops to get answers or information. And It actually works out to be a very good USP compared to the competition who don't do it.

Even Lambos have prices on their window stickers these days.

I agree about not putting obstacles in the way of my clients giving me money.

They can sign their contract and pay by credit card online.

I am more concerned with whether I want to be their photographer or if my style or ability will be a good fit for her. So I always talk on the phone or Skype, but prefer to meet in studio. That's why I pay the big rent there for a swanky building.

Just to be simple, if the photographer wouldn't give me a ballpark estimate of what they usually charge to do weddings, minus any add ons like albums and huge prints then I'd walk away. I would compare it to a used car dealership if they wouldn't. Now once I get a ballpark estimate, then I may decide my budget fits and then I'll want to discuss in person and see images and albums, etc.

abbypanda wrote in post #16228105
It's also my experience from hearing various complaints and the barrier to entry being nothing into this market that hte people don't really know what is a "quality" photographer vs someone who just picked up a camera. They dont know what to look for, etc. By giving a price, they have little to compare on ohter than price. And if they arent educated to make pick quality over price, they might likely pick price. This is my thought based on the # of threads about "lost cost" photographers, etc. I am not bashing them, this is just a general impression that if you give people nothing to compare you on but price they will pick the lesser, esp if they arent educated as to whats better and how its better.

Excellent post.

I wouldn't meet face to face without first giving a broad range on price, but you need to be prepared to sell your services and experience once you get face time.

gonzogolf wrote in post #16228140
Withholding your rate sheet until you have a face to face requires a certain arrogance that your competence needs to live up to. By that I mean, its offputting to many clients, but if your portfolio is good enough that doesnt matter. If your portfolio isnt good enough then its a bad move.

Exactly. I think a lot of people in this thread think they're photography is special and what try offer is unique, but the reality of the situation is that we're all just another photog in a saturated market. Potential clients are emailing 10+ photogs for price and availability.

Clients know how much this stuff is and photogs need to stop thinking they have the magical formula package.

ZachOly wrote in post #16230046
Exactly. I think a lot of people in this thread think they're photography is special and what try offer is unique, but the reality of the situation is that we're all just another photog in a saturated market. Potential clients are emailing 10+ photogs for price and availability.

That is why I reply to any any generic enquiries that are like that with a generic response... "see the website".

One thing I would say though that I have found over year is that under a certain price bracket you get a different sort of enquiry. The moment you offer anything (even reduced hours etc) in that price bracket you open yourself to the price shopper clients.

In my book if you feel you have to "educate" your potential clients then the value of what you do isn't evident in the work you have on display. It is a harsh truth to accept but the reality.