First Wedding next month and already problems - advice needed!

Hello all. I know these "first wedding" post are a dime-a-dozen, and you probably get tired of reading them. So I do appreciate anyone who cares to respond with some advice.

A brief background of myself, I'm no different than the hundreds of others that have come before me. Right now I'm just your regular facebook portrait photographer (a hem, "natural light" ), that has been talked into shooting a wedding. I've always said I was going to stay away from them and leave them up to the pros, even though I've always been somewhat intrigued by the challenge and thought I could do a decent job. However, I never felt comfortable enough to advertise to shoot weddings or even offer to, and I don't know any pros in my area that I could 2nd shoot for.

A portrait customer referred me to his brother who is getting married. They aren't the most personable and rather difficult to communicate with. However, I decided to take the job because of a few reasons:
1. Their expectations are not high at all. I saw their engagement pictures and they were very amateur (even by my standards). They look like they were taken in full auto mode, in broad daylight, harsh shadows, etc. Apparently they paid that person a good bit of money, from what my client told me.
2. I'm not charging very much. They approached me, and I made it abundantly clear that this is my first wedding, and not to expect professional, knock your socks off pictures. So therefore I'm charging less than half of what pros would charge.
3. Now before I get flamed for the normal "typical, undercutting the pros by charging next to nothing...diluting the market...you should 2nd shoot a thousand times before taking your first wedding....etc". This is not a couple that would have booked a real pro for what a wedding shoot should cost. In fact, he even told my client "If I can't find someone to do it for $X then we just won't have pictures."

So, I said all of that because I think that if there ever were a wedding to "get my feet wet" and see if I want to continue to shoot weddings, this would be it. One where there aren't high expectations, I'm not friends with them, apparently they don't even care if they even have pictures in the first place, and I'm not robbing a real pro of any business.

The wedding is taking place at a country club that hosts tons of outdoor weddings. Since this wedding is in the first part of October (great weather for our area), I naturally thought it was going to be outdoors. Well apparently it isn't. Now that isn't what most concerns me. I have fast enough primes to get the indoor ceremony without flash.

What concerns me is the ceremony starts at 6:30. Sunset is at 7. They have elected not to do a first look. So by the time the ceremony is over, the light will be gone. So then I'll be stuck taking B&G, and family portraits indoors with flash. I know we can get all of the wedding party photos done before the ceremony, but obviously none with the B&G.

My gear is: Canon 5d mii, 50 1.2L, 85 1.2L, 24-105L (probably won't use), and a speedlite 430. I'll be renting a 70-200 2.8 IS, and a 100 Macro L along with a 580exii, a light stand, and a softbox. I had originally planned to shoot everything outdoors, a first look, wedding party, family, etc. using all natural light. For the reception I was going to trigger an off-camera 430 on the stand (in a softbox) set up in a corner aimed at the dance floor with an on-camera 580EX (triggering the 430 using ETTL) as fill flash bounced off the ceiling and using a bounce card.

Now, do I just make the best of it and find the most appealing wall or background inside for after the ceremony and bounce the flash off the ceiling? I had planned on having the off-camera flash already set up ahead of time in the reception.

By the way, I do have a friend with some wedding experience (some, but not much...she's 2nd shot a few weddings) coming to be a 2nd shooter for me.

Any tips? Besides run away now?

Yes, rent your lighting gear 2 weeks before the wedding and shoot every day practicing.

Get a contract, get the expectations in writing.

What gonzogolf said.

Great, thanks for the replies so far. I do plan on getting the lighting equipment early and practicing.

Yes I already have a signed contract and deposit. Included in the contract is wording that I'm not liable for any particular photos. Here is one sentence of that section: Photographer does not guarantee to deliver any particular image, or any quantity of images to Clients.

Thanks again!

Twolabs wrote in post #16322412
Great, thanks for the replies so far. I do plan on getting the lighting equipment early and practicing.

Yes I already have a signed contract and deposit. Included in the contract is wording that I'm not liable for any particular photos. Here is one sentence of that section: Photographer does not guarantee to deliver any particular image, or any quantity of images to Clients.

Thanks again!

That language is designed to protect you from a missed shot like "the kiss" or from a negotiated shot total, but it still isnt likely to protect you from a total failure.

If the venue has white or near white walls, bounce your light behind you off the wall for your group shots. Shoot at higher ISO so the background isn't a dark pit. Gel your lights with 1/2 CTO if there is a lot of tungsten ambient light.

Are you expecting to use the 100 Macro for up-close ring shots and other details of this nature? Do you expect to have time to do that stuff before the wedding? If not, I don't think it's worth your rental cost, as you've already got that focal length plenty covered with the 70-200, and a very close approximation with the 85L. Skip the 100mm and rent a third flash instead.

Agreed with the above advice to practice with those flashes every day, read books like the Hotshoe Diaries. Depending on the venue, a Super Clamp or justin clamp might serve you nicely, as well.

If at all possible, scope the venue in advance and get some test/practice shots there.

Read Tim's thread on how to light a reception using remote flashes on stands.

Is there a chance you can do the photos outside after sunset? I'm thinking you could use the flash to keep your subjects well lit while completely blacking out the background. The venue I'm getting married at next summer does alot of night weddings, usually 6 per week, and they showed us alot of photos done like this. You might even hang some white Christmas lights behind them to give a "stary" look to the shot. Just an idea you can play with.

Before I give my advice, I have one simple question:

Can you elaborate on "They aren't the most personable and rather difficult to communicate with"? That to me is the biggest red flag out of everything you wrote.

I think the thing that bugs me most about the post (as a full-time wedding photographer) isn't about 'diluting the market' as you say, or taking work from a professional. I agree with you that these aren't really solid reasons against shooting a wedding. What annoys me is that you've formally signed onto shoot someone's wedding without even having the basics down--and I consider fluency with how light works--a flash, in particular--to be basic. I don't think there is any good reason why anyone needs to start shooting weddings without being GREAT at photographing people in natural light and with flash.

It also sounds to me like you don't have much respect for the couple. Your attitude seems to be that because you're 'less worse' than the engagement photographer it's OK if you're offering what may be sub-standard work. After all, these people are so ignorant about photography that they won't even know. As much self-doubt as I have about my own work, I couldn't imagine agreeing to photograph people if I didn't think I did solid work--in a kind of broader objective sense.

protege wrote in post #16327146
Before I give my advice, I have one simple question:

Can you elaborate on "They aren't the most personable and rather difficult to communicate with"? That to me is the biggest red flag out of everything you wrote.

EXACTLY what I was thinking. A difficult couple s not the best first wedding.

Do you have a back up camera? I think you are over complicating you lighting set up for your first wedding. How big is the wedding party ?
I would not rent the 100 macro either.

I just wanted to come back and say thank you to those who offered advice. Even though some of it was tough love, I needed it. Prepare, long post ahead.

I should clarify a few things. Regarding the "difficult to communicate with" comment. The bride put the groom in charge of wedding pictures. He was looking for a budget photographer. As I mentioned in a previous post, he made a comment to his brother (my friend) that if they couldn't find a photographer to shoot it below a certain dollar amount, then they just wouldn't have professional pictures and just get it from their friends and family's point and shoots. They had the disposable cameras at the tables, as well as the hairstylist/makeup artist (a friend of the bride) was taking a LOT of pictures of everything. My wife (assistant) and I were thinking that those two measures were in place in case their first-time wedding photographer totally botched the job

With regards to communication, for example, when my friend said that his brother was interested in how much we would charge, I sent him a message on Facebook. I told him I was honored that they would consider me, that I've never shot a wedding before, and asked a few questions. Since FB tells you when the message is read, I saw that he read it about 30 minutes after I sent it. A full two weeks later I still hadn't heard from him and my friend said he asked him about it, and he said, "Hmm I never got the message." Anyway, it was small things like that. I emailed him the contract with the price in it, requesting a deposit (1/2 of quoted price plus tax). He said he would get it in in the mail the next day. Two weeks later I have nothing and I text him, "Hey! Just checking to see if you received my contract? Thanks!" And his reply text was, "Tax?"

So, that is what I meant by communication problems. Yes, red flags, but I continued on. After the "Tax?" comment, I told my wife that if he gave me any more trouble I was going to tell them to find someone else. However, he was nice and accommodating after that.

Anyway, with regards to the day. It could've been worse and better. So, I guess it was a normal wedding, right? My 2nd shooter wound up backing out on me...so it was just me. The ceremony was originally supposed to start at 6:30 but was pushed back to 6:45 because apparently during the rehearsal the night before, the setting sun was coming through the side windows and blinding the attendees. I told the bride and groom a few days before the wedding that I wanted to get as many pictures done before the ceremony as possible (bride, bridesmaids, groom, groomsmen, family shots, bride and daughter, etc.). I asked if everyone could be ready by 5, so that would give us 60-90 minutes to take all shots. Remember, they chose not to see each other before the ceremony. We arrived around 3:30 and took some detail shots of the center pieces. Since this was a low budget wedding, the bride and bridesmaids did all of the decorating that morning (and they did a pretty good job if I say so myself). The bride and bridesmaids were all there, but were not really getting ready. I was done with the detail shots and asked for the dress. I struggled with the dress shots as I couldn't find a good place for it. Inexperience. It was incredibly windy outside and I had to settle for some shots underneath a tree that was in a small courtyard (to shield the wind). I wasn't too excited about those shots. I then grabbed the rings (the bride was very, "You want the rings? Um, okay? Sure?" She acted surprised that I asked for them. Did some detail shots there. I took some pictures of the bride and bridesmaids just hanging out in the room. They had one person doing hair and makeup for bride, 3 bridesmaids, and bride's daughter. After a while, my wife pulled me out of there because she knew that they just wanted to "hang out" for a while without me being in there. The bride made some mention of getting some pictures when she gets her hair and makeup done.

So now, I'm out of the bridal room and I have nothing to photograph. It felt very strange. The groom and groomsmen were not there yet. So I took some of some family arriving and conversing. The groom and groomsmen finally arrive. I take a few prep photos and then take them outside to get some shots. The grooms parents and grandparents follow and we get some with them. My wife comes and grabs me and tells me they are doing the brides hair. I run back in and she is just now getting started on her hair and makeup (and I think the time was 5:45). 2 of the 3 bridesmaids were done, and the daughter was not even dressed. It was a little after 6 before the bride was done. We quickly get her outside and take a few shots. She was incredibly uncomfortable in front of the camera. However, I know it was completely my fault. It is my job as the photographer to put her at ease and get some natural reactions. We tried a lot of different ways to get her to relax, but she was probably the most rigid and nervous subject I've ever taken (and I can see why, its her wedding day). So we got a few keepers. Its 6:20 and no daughter. My wife runs inside to find the daughter. We knew that probably one of the most treasured pictures we could get before the ceremony (in the natural light) would be of her and her daughter, since we couldn't get any B&G. 6:25 and finally the daughter arrives. 20 minutes to the ceremony. We snap just a very few quick shots of bride, daughter, and bride's mother. My wife tells me that at 6:30 is when the maid of honor's hair was started.

Needless to say the ceremony is delayed about 15 minutes. Our friends (grooms' brother) tells us that some of the attendees were worried that someone had changed their mind. They still thought it was at 6:30 and it was 7 and still no ceremony. Ha.

Anyway, the ceremony came and went. Very quickly. I underestimated the extreme low light of the ceremony and went with too slow of a shutter speed because I didn't want to use 3200 ISO (I should have, in retrospect. Better to have noisier images but not blurry). Yep, inexperience . I still was able to get some. One thing that really threw me off was the bride walking down the aisle. I got some shots of the groom seeing her for the first time. 3 quick shutter snaps and I turn around, the bride is halfway down the aisle (a very small room) and walking a normal pace. About as fast as you would walk from the couch to the fridge. It took me by surprise and I messed that up. No excuses. My biggest regret of the day and biggest screw up. Even the minister remarked when they got up to the front, "Wow, now that was fast! You must be ready!" And everyone got a good chuckle....except me. I should've switched out to my prime or used a flash. This particular room was not very attractive. Goldish/beige wallpapers abounded, and the light was 100% tungsten. Very yellow. I was anticipating some natural light come through the side windows (the entire left side of the room were those rounded down to the floor windows that you might see in a greenhouse). However, since the ceremony started practically at sunset, I received no help there.

This post is long enough. Everything else went "alright". First dance, dinner, general dancing, etc. The last big problem came at the send away. The DJ gave me a heads up they were about to leave. So I grabbed my OCF and went outside to set it up. There were double doors, but the left door was locked. I put my flash stand just outside of this left door, took some test shots and was pleased. Everyone filled out and we were just waiting on the B&G. They were finally walking down the hallway to come outside when one of the groomsmen started to unlock and open the left door. I could tell these was going to block my light. The B&G were 10 steps away from the threshold, bubbles were flying. I start to yell "Hey hey! You're blocking my light! HEY!". Some others notice this and tell the B&G to stop. My wife grabs the stand and holds it up herself over the crowd and we get a couple of pictures.

Anyway, it was quite an experience. Thank you all for the tips and advice!

Sounds like a pretty standard wedding. Nothing ever goes 100% on-schedule according to plan, and you have to be prepared to adapt. You can't expect other people to accommodate you, either - for instance, the door blocking your OCF, as soon as you saw it might have been a problem you should have bolted over there to change it. Move the light since you can't move the door.

Twolabs wrote in post #16367496
I sent him a message on Facebook. I told him I was honored that they would consider me, that I've never shot a wedding before, and asked a few questions. Since FB tells you when the message is read, I saw that he read it about 30 minutes after I sent it. A full two weeks later I still hadn't heard from him and my friend said he asked him about it, and he said, "Hmm I never got the message." Anyway, it was small things like that.

I would pin this 95% on you and 5% on him. A single Facebook message is inadequate at best. If he left his computer on with Facebook open in the background, and walked away, Facebook would still say the message had been read.

Congrats Twolabs and thanks for sharing your experience. I always find stories like this to be a good read.

Shooting weddings can be exhausting, huh?

Congrats again,
Bryan