trying to understand the golden rule

Rule of thirds is another

rule of 4/5th or sometimes referred to 1/5th is another.

Heres something that should clear it all up LoL
http://en.wikipedia.or​g/wiki/Golden_ratio

This might help. Definitely worth a watch. I know a couple of hours long but time well spent in my opinion.
http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=OtcD84l9eUw

ceriltheblade wrote in post #16366928
the idea is just to use a scene where the center of attention is in the right lower third of the frame?
Does it matter if it is on the left?
or upper third instead of lower?

No, "right lower third" isn't required. You might have a flying bird above the middle of the frame, and the rest of the picture all sky. This would be a simple composition. Most scenes in nature have more elements than that.

Yes. A portrait may have a plain background, but a photo that isn't just a picture OF something (headshots, product photography) will typically have other things in it, and the Golden Mean or the Rule of Thirds (they are different) can still be used.

This is an assignment and in this case one needs to do what the teacher says but I think learning about visual language is far more important than learning any of these rules. The more fluent you become the less you need rules.

Advice I once received from a great photographer was what you really need to know is this; that either everything in the photograph is helping that photograph and if it's not helping the photograph then it's hurting it. A quest for becoming fluent in the language that has been with us and is always changing for 2000 + years of two dimensional art will help one understand whether everything in the frame is helping ot hurting.

Understand how things like repeating shapes, leading lines, implied texture, color, tone or any other visual elements are either supporting the visual statement or when those things are fighting each other and maybe hurting the visual statement, in my opinion, are what it's really all about.

If everyone is using the same rules then how can their be any freshness of vision or how can anyone ever develop a style? We see it now with the sea of sameness out there where everyone follows the same rules.

Quotes from photographers that were all fluent in the language....

Weston said this:
"When subject matter is forced to fit into preconceived patterns, there can be no freshness of vision. Following rules of composition can only lead to a tedious repetition of pictorial cliches." - Edward Weston

....... "so called “composition” becomes a personal thing, to be developed along with technique, as a personal way of seeing." - Edward Weston

And a few other great photographers on rules:
"And in not learning the rules, I was free. I always say, you're either defined by the medium or you redefine the medium in terms of your needs." - Duane Michals

"Photography is not a sport. It has no rules. Everything must be dared and tried!" - Bill Brandt

"There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs." - Ansel Adams

"There are no rules and regulations for perfect composition. If there were we would be able to put all the information into a computer and would come out with a masterpiece. We know that's impossible. You have to compose by the seat of your pants." - Arnold Newman

Composition Articles library

Load your image & see how it works in the Composition Adjuster.

This is more about shooting & working the scene to find the shot that everyone else will miss.
Scott Kelby's Crush the Composition, a one hour video on "Work the Scene, Work the Setting".

tzalman wrote in post #16367187
That's ok, I never cared much for the second Caesar anyways. Rumor had it that he only got to the throne because his mother "arranged" the removal of four other heirs who had a better claim.

But Tiberias is a nice town.

I grow more and more confused.

^ http://en.wikipedia.or​g/wiki/Tiberias

But I have no idea what Tzalman meant. Was he agreeing with me or not? I'm confused!

I'm very sorry. My impulse to sarcasm sometimes overwhelms me, although I know it can be easily misunderstood or not understood at all. I do apologize.

This is what I think on the subject: I strongly believe in the value of education although you cannot teach creativity. Education has to impart general formulas that cover most situations. The "rules" of composition are not arbitrary; they were formulated over many generations because in most situations they work well. They should be the foundation of a beginner's education, but more advanced education should instill in the student the realization that "most situations" is not "all situations". The talented artist will know when to use them and when to discard them and the real measure of his talent will be what he does instead of applying a rule.

Great Photographers on the Internet

tzalman wrote in post #16367187
the second Caesar anyways. Rumor had it that he only got to the throne

how did we get from photography to Pink Floyd and now Caesar?
Oh, since I'll be at Caesar's AC tomorrow, fits perfectly.

BTW, after lifting $750 of lottery tickets from the trash, I found $120 cash on the street!

tzalman wrote in post #16369482
I'm very sorry. My impulse to sarcasm sometimes overwhelms me, although I know it can be easily misunderstood or not understood at all. I do apologize.

This is what I think on the subject: I strongly believe in the value of education although you cannot teach creativity. Education has to impart general formulas that cover most situations. The "rules" of composition are not arbitrary; they were formulated over many generations because in most situations they work well. They should be the foundation of a beginner's education, but more advanced education should instill in the student the realization that "most situations" is not "all situations". The talented artist will know when to use them and when to discard them and the real measure of his talent will be what he does instead of applying a rule.

I agree, and I will add that while education can't teach creativity, a good education in a creative subject like photography will encourage the student to get plenty of experience, because it is with experience that the creativity develops.

FrankC,

Hilarious. Thanks for starting my morning out right.

tzalman wrote in post #16369482
I'm very sorry. My impulse to sarcasm sometimes overwhelms me, although I know it can be easily misunderstood or not understood at all. I do apologize.

This is what I think on the subject: I strongly believe in the value of education although you cannot teach creativity. Education has to impart general formulas that cover most situations. The "rules" of composition are not arbitrary; they were formulated over many generations because in most situations they work well. They should be the foundation of a beginner's education, but more advanced education should instill in the student the realization that "most situations" is not "all situations". The talented artist will know when to use them and when to discard them and the real measure of his talent will be what he does instead of applying a rule.

While I agree with what you're saying, I also think that it's easy to overthink these things, much like I find that many people's quest to find the "perfect" exposure often tends to ruin the photo by killing any sense of spontaneity or artistic expression. Like you say, the context, or situation, is ultimately what should drive the photographer's decisions, because things like composition and exposure vary depending on the subject.

onona wrote in post #16373076
While I agree with what you're saying, I also think that it's easy to overthink these things, much like I find that many people's quest to find the "perfect" exposure often tends to ruin the photo by killing any sense of spontaneity or artistic expression. Like you say, the context, or situation, is ultimately what should drive the photographer's decisions, because things like composition and exposure vary depending on the subject.

And to add, composition should very between photographers and should become part of a personal way of seeing. There is no one right way to take any photograph. Only whats right for each individual photographer.

You may find this a bit basic but helpful...

http://photoinf.com …chenko/GoldenSe​ction.html