You Might want to re-think that 7DII Purchase

Essentially, Canon started the dslr bubble with the 300D and now it's beginning to burst.

This doesn't mean they going to disappear, it just means the big dslr manufacturers might have to drop back down to 3 or 4 product lines instead of 5 or 6 to remain agile. The market that they had in, say, 2005 is still there and it should be more than enough to support them.

Social photographers can come and ago but there'll always be a lot of people who put quality/usability over connectivity/portabili​ty and it's this market which will sustain the companies who make the best/most usable products.

quickben wrote in post #16413333
Essentially, Canon started the dslr bubble with the 300D and now it's beginning to burst.

This doesn't mean they going to disappear, it just means the big dslr manufacturers might have to drop back down to 3 or 4 product lines instead of 5 or 6 to remain agile. The market that they had in, say, 2005 is still there and it should be more than enough to support them.

Social photographers can come and ago but there'll always be a lot of people who put quality/usability over connectivity/portabili​ty and it's this market which will sustain the companies who make the best/most usable products.

This reminds me of the "The PC is dead" nonsense. Just like with DSLRs, PCs were a product that reliably sold more and more units each year. Now everyone who wants one has one, its pretty reliable and has just about all the features it needs. So sales plateau or dip a bit and the analysts/bloggers need some link bait so they predict that the product will disappear within 5 years. I wonder if people were predicting "the refrigerator is dead" when it reached market saturation decades ago.

I think crop sensors are here to stay for a while. DSLRs will be too IMO.
Sure i use my Galaxy S3 for around the house shots or if we are out and I dont have my camera with me.
Theyre good for that but the # of missed shots is too high. There will have to be major upgrades to the cameras in phones to make them compete with DSLRs.

I agree with the above statement that Canon and Nikon will have to streamline their DSLRs to just a few bodies to cut costs and keep profits high. That is what they did until about 5 years ago when the market exploded. THey just have to go back to where they were a few years ago. Still making money hand over fist. LOL

I will always reach for a DSLR when the photos count.

My Logic is that these 5D3's are sooo good that its gonna have to be one heck of an improvement on the next release to make me find an excuse to upgrade. They do everything i want them to do and then.

Same for the I-phone. Its image quality is good enough for the consumer and it fits the needs for sharing and instant gratification purposes.

I think that the camera technology image wise is not going to change much other than incremental improvements in ISO and improvements in shadows and details. So unless canon develops something that is really gonna knock the socks of people its gonna be real hard to justify 4K on a body for Wifi and some other electronic gimmick that they want to put in a camera

They are gonna have to come out with game changers at this point for the professional market and with technology where it is, i dont see it for a while. So maybe its back to a good body will last you 6-8 yrs instead of 2-3 due technology upgrades.

But, I think the 1.6 is a dead player. Im not gonna jump on a 7DII yet. I get the 1.6 crop factor and reach argument. I will go out on a limb and say, I dont think they are going to be able to make that much of a change to the current sensor for IQ and noise improvements.

I also think photographers are educated enough that the MP game is a done deal as well. Lots of Nikon guys hate that 800 because 38MP files are a **** to work with, especially for wedding guys. I think the professional market is in a nice little place right now.

Ain't happening.

umphotography wrote in post #16412896
I think if you read into what he is saying it tells you that the 1.6 sensor which is used in the consumer oriented cameras will probably go Bye Bye. If they are not selling cameras, which they are clearly not, they are not going to put more time and effort into improving it and/or putting it in future camera bodies. (1) So I think it has a very limited future

as for the I phone. Its only going to get better and better. Instant gratification, being able to share with family and friends is where the consumer will go. Amatuers and consumers dont care about image quality as much as they care about the instant gratification part.(2) Right now, the Iphones are good enough for their needs

So, I think canon will dump the crop as they did with the 1.3 sensor (3). The professional markets and serious hobbiest markets will seek quality over good enough so I actually see canon eliminating bodies and stream lining the line up. I dont see canon investing more time and $$$ with the 1.6 sensor and they are going to need to find a way to compete with companies like Sigma who are stepping up the quality and undercutting canons market. If you look at lens like the 35,120-300,150macro, and now this 24-105 from Sigma, canon clearly has a problem.

I see major changes coming to canons professional line up as well. I think the prices will come down if companies like Sigma continue to bite at Canons heals.......Thats a good thing for the professional market.

1.) Yep. No visible interest in the 70D, anywhere. And all of those used 7Ds and 60Ds are going at yard sale prices.
2.) I am an amateur and a consumer. I care. I suppose I could be the only one.
3.) My bet is Canon dropped the 1.3s because computing power per dollar finally caught up to allow them to incorporate all of that into the 1Dx.

Couple of thoughts:

Phones are killing the compact, not the crop DSLR. People who are happy with iphone pics would not have been interested in a DSLR 5 years ago anyway.

Shrinking market doesn't mean gone market.

In my area, it's pretty tough to sell aps-c glass.

I posted my Nikon 17-55 F2.8 for $640 and got maybe one email.
All the guys are asking $750 - $900 for theirs - don't imagine the are going to sell.

Similar story for the Canon 17-55mm F2.8, no bites.

Eventually I traded the Nikon for a Panasonic G6 body.
Still have the Canon 17-55 and 10-22 which I'll use on the G6 through adapter.

I think over the last year the market for APS-C gear kinda died down a lot.
Glad I sold my 60Ds!

jefzor wrote in post #16413252
There'll still be a market for cheap entry level DSLR's. I don't think crop will be killed off until entry level FF prices drop sub $600. (yes, used FF prices might go that low, but the consumer is afraid of buying used gear)

Good point. It is true that most buy a crop camera now because it is a cheaper alternative to FF. If that advantage is (almost) eliminated by sub-$1000 FF cameras, then you could see two crop DSLRs in Canon's future lineup:

- Super cheap Rebel for those who value low price above all else
- Expensive 7D follow-on for enthusiasts/pros who need a crop sensor

Either way, crop DSLRs aren't going to go away in the immediate future.

umphotography wrote in post #16412896
I think if you read into what he is saying it tells you that the 1.6 sensor which is used in the consumer oriented cameras will probably go Bye Bye. If they are not selling cameras, which they are clearly not

And where exactly did you unearth this tidbit of (mis)information? I provided a link showing that mirrorless sales are dropping, please provide a link proving that nobody is buying 1.6 crop sensor cameras anymore.

FF lenses will scare off more buyers than the body prices will.

tkbslc wrote in post #16413680
FF lenses will scare off more buyers than the body prices will.

Valid point, to a point. I shoot APSc, and wanted something longer than 85mm and faster than f/5.6. EFS options? None. Never has been. I ended up with a Σ70-200 and 100-400L, which cost the same whether you mount them on APSc or FF.

FF lens prices did scare me out of the market, though. If I buy a 6D/5D3, I have to spend a ton of $$$ on 16-35II and 24-70 2.8 or 4 to replace my 10-22 and 15-85. Too much money for me.

scotchtape wrote in post #16413651
In my area, it's pretty tough to sell aps-c glass.

I posted my Nikon 17-55 F2.8 for $640 and got maybe one email.
All the guys are asking $750 - $900 for theirs - don't imagine the are going to sell.

Similar story for the Canon 17-55mm F2.8, no bites.

Eventually I traded the Nikon for a Panasonic G6 body.
Still have the Canon 17-55 and 10-22 which I'll use on the G6 through adapter.

I think over the last year the market for APS-C gear kinda died down a lot.
Glad I sold my 60Ds!

Not clear if you listed your stuff here on POTN, but I think you can get a slightly warped view of the marketplace looking in the For Sale forum here. Most members are pros or raving enthusiasts , so there is going to be a lot more interest in the 5D IIIs and 70-200 2.8s than in Rebel bodies and EF-S lenses.

Who cares what others are doing?
I certainly don't want an Iphone with a 70-200 ii sticking out of it
I'll take my 1000 photos out of my 6d per charge, over sony's 250-300 photos.

umphotography wrote in post #16413565
Same for the I-phone. Its image quality is good enough for the consumer and it fits the needs for sharing and instant gratification purposes.

I have iPhones. The image quality is not good if you blow it up whatsoever. For Facebook it's fine, but if you have any intention of printing on 3x5 or larger its grainy and miserable looking.

jrbdmb wrote in post #16413717
Not clear if you listed your stuff here on POTN, but I think you can get a slightly warped view of the marketplace looking in the For Sale forum here. Most members are pros or raving enthusiasts , so there is going to be a lot more interest in the 5D IIIs and 70-200 2.8s than in Rebel bodies and EF-S lenses.

Nope, Vancouver, BC