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Thread started 31 Oct 2013 (Thursday) 10:43
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How does the cost and quality of 35mm film compare to full-frame digital?

 
YashicaFX2
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Oct 31, 2013 18:24 |  #16
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I grew up on film. I got my first camera in about 1964. I got my first SLR in 1976. You guessed it, a Yashica FX2. I donated my last film cameras to a local art school in August. Anyway, IMHO film is dying for a reason. While the camera are dirt cheap, and if you get the right one, you can use most modern lenses, you are still dealing with film. That leaves you making a selection between two equally poor choices.

1.) Learn to process film yourself. Expensive, stinky, and time consuming.
2.) Send it out. You get back what someone else thinks you wanted.

Digital allows you complete control over the developing process, no chemicals required. You can spend $99 on Lightroom and that is your total processing cost, for years. You can adjust any parameter, crop any way you like, and start back at the beginning any time you choose. One raw shot is about 20MB. That means you can get about 100,000 of them on a 2TB $59 HDD. And carry all of them in one hand, if the need arises. Film (I believe) has more native dynamic range than even the best digital. Digital can reasonably be adjusted in PP to display more DR than film ever could. And that is without HDR. The way I see it, the only drawback to digital is the price of the camera. If I were buying today, I'd get a 70D. In inflation adjusted dollars, it is about 1/3 the price of the AE-1P, when new. Realistically, digital is cheaper now than film ever was in its heyday. Buy yourself a 6D and be happy.


Dedicated APS-c shooter. Gripped 60D, 60 2.8, 10-22, 15-85, Σ70-200 OS and a big white something or other! Plus a 5D w/28-75.

  
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DocFrankenstein
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Oct 31, 2013 21:41 |  #17

YashicaFX2 wrote in post #16414632 (external link)
You can spend $99 on Lightroom and that is your total processing cost, for years.

This might be true... and you'd be the only person I know with that expenditure.

My list included a new computer, a good monitor, a second monitor, a calibration device, photoshop, books about photoshop, larger hard drive, memory cards, backup external hard drive, printer, inks for printer, calibrating printer, cleaning printer heads... lenses which are a grand each and are huge...

Exaggerated statement warning: ;)
Film is a classic medium with finite set of equipment which puts you into shooting mode. Once you get your setup, there's nothing to upgrade.

And BTW my dedicated film scanner cost me 100 bucks.


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YashicaFX2
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Oct 31, 2013 22:48 |  #18
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DocFrankenstein wrote in post #16414982 (external link)
This might be true... and you'd be the only person I know with that expenditure.

My list included a new computer, a good monitor, a second monitor, a calibration device, photoshop, books about photoshop, larger hard drive, memory cards, backup external hard drive, printer, inks for printer, calibrating printer, cleaning printer heads... lenses which are a grand each and are huge...

Exaggerated statement warning: ;)
Film is a classic medium with finite set of equipment which puts you into shooting mode. Once you get your setup, there's nothing to upgrade.

And BTW my dedicated film scanner cost me 100 bucks.

Perspective is everything, I suppose. I already had a computer system by the time I moved to digital. My back-up system consists of an extra internal redundant drive and two external drives. My general information is worth a lot more to me than my photos. I don't call 3-$59 drives expensive for a near fail-safe back-up.

I am just a hobby shooter who makes prints, when needed, at Walmart. No calibration or second monitor required.

I don't see the cost of the lenses being a difference at all. A 70-200 II costs the same whether you mount it on a 1Dx or an Elan 7Ne.

Dedicated film scanner? If you want digital images, shoot a digital camera. They're pretty handy little buggers.


Dedicated APS-c shooter. Gripped 60D, 60 2.8, 10-22, 15-85, Σ70-200 OS and a big white something or other! Plus a 5D w/28-75.

  
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DocFrankenstein
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Oct 31, 2013 23:00 |  #19

YashicaFX2 wrote in post #16415099 (external link)
I don't see the cost of the lenses being a difference at all. A 70-200 II costs the same whether you mount it on a 1Dx or an Elan 7Ne.

Dedicated film scanner? If you want digital images, shoot a digital camera. They're pretty handy little buggers.

Personal approaches. Everybody's in it for different reasons.

I find digital scans capture the essence of film in a way that I can't with a DSLR. I tried replicating the look and I can't manage to do it.

In terms of price of lenses, the vintage manual focus stuff was selling for peanuts for the last decade. Now that I sold most of it, some comes out with full frame mirrorless that takes everything.


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YashicaFX2
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Oct 31, 2013 23:34 |  #20
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DocFrankenstein wrote in post #16415115 (external link)
Personal approaches. Everybody's in it for different reasons.

I find digital scans capture the essence of film in a way that I can't with a DSLR. I tried replicating the look and I can't manage to do it.

In terms of price of lenses, the vintage manual focus stuff was selling for peanuts for the last decade. Now that I sold most of it, some comes out with full frame mirrorless that takes everything.

Yes, personal approaches matter. I am just a snap-shooter hobbyist who is trying to get decent photos of the cats, dogs, grandchildren and such. I am not after a 'look', jeez, I am not even sure what that means. I gave up film for digital because it is way more convenient. I must admit, being able to afford some decent digital hardware made it a lot easier. I think we all have to agree, getting into digital costs a lot more than your first dSLR. I've easily spent 10X what my first 500D with kit lens cost.


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amfoto1
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Oct 31, 2013 23:42 |  #21

OP,

I'd suggest you get an inexpensive used DSLR instead... film is a lot more involved to shoot with, requires a lot more planning and care, and there isn't the immediate feedback you can get with digital.

For color, slide film gives you the best control over the results. It's not subject to someone's interpretation and sloppy processing, the way consumer print film is.

With black and white, yes you can "soup" silver based film yourself, but it scans very poorly. You would be better off making a print the old fashioned way, then scanning that.

There is also C41 processed black and white film, which you drop off for processing at the same lab as color print film. It makes sort of low contrast prints, but scans much better than silver based B&W film.

Color print film is the easiest to get processed quickly, locally.... But you are at the mercy of the operator and their quality control process... which can be pretty bad. There are still a few pro labs around who can handle film, but the cost is much, much higher ($45 to $75 per roll, for pro quality work). You can have color print film scanned at the time of processing for around $10 or $15 extra, but the results are low resolution. For better quality, either scan it yourself or send it out for a high quality scan (that will cost up to $100 per image, maybe a little less if you do a lot, maybe a little more if it's just an individual image or two.)

Doing your own scanning is time-consuming. The best quality scans take around 10 or 15 minutes per image and the resulting files are huge. I have a 4000 dpi Nikon scanner that generates 130MB files... And for 8x10 prints I can get as good or better results from an 8 or 10MP camera.

So I'd suggest instead pick up a used 40D or 50D, or maybe a 5D classic if you must have "full frame" (FF is massive overkill for most people's actual uses). Then start collecting some quality lenses.

If you do want a film camera to play around with, I'd suggest one of the later EOS models, so that the lenses you get for it can later be used on a DSLR. EOS-3 is a great, pro quality camera. The Elan 7 models (EOS 30 and 33 outside the US/N. America market) is also a fine model.

There are many great films.... I shot a lot of slides, especially Velvia 50, Ektachrome 100 VS and 200. For B&W I really liked Fuji Acros 100 and good old Tri-X 400. But I have a darkroom that handles 35mm, medium and large format, and many years experience souping my own film and making my own prints. For a while I was doing my own color film processing and printing from both color neg and slide films. But that's a real pain to do... nasty chemicals and very tight temperature control is necessary... not to mention complete darkness for a lot of the work.

In the end I think you'd find that you would spend more money on a film camera, processing and printing, than you would just getting a decent, used DSLR now.

I recommend Adobe Elements to work with your images. It's got some features from both Lightroom and Photoshop, without being too overwhelming.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII, 7D, M5 & others. 10-22mm, Meike 12/2.8,Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, EF-M 22/2, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Sigma 56/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link)

  
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How does the cost and quality of 35mm film compare to full-frame digital?
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