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Thread started 16 Jan 2014 (Thursday) 20:49
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kin2son
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Jan 20, 2014 15:50 |  #226
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I don't understand why a focusing test was even suggested in the first place?

None of OP's photos posted so fast in this thread shows any signs of back/front focusing, they were all shot at small aperture....clearly focusing wasn't the problem to begin with :rolleyes:

OP said that he isn't totally satisfied with his results because his photo didn't turn out 'special', or the sharpness could be better with a crow miles away. It clearly shows it has never been a body or lens issue....

Stop blaming on the gear and do your part better....


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DigitalDon
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Jan 20, 2014 16:14 as a reply to  @ kin2son's post |  #227

Sounds to me, the OP is asking for camera settings (something to try) for the zoomed in part of the lens.



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kfreels
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Jan 20, 2014 16:44 |  #228

It seems to me like there is an awfully lot of jumping about which is only going to create more confusion for the OP whom already appears confused given the sharpness and clarity of the initially posted pics. Given the pics posted and the comments by the OP, I don't believe this is a camera issue.

My suggestion is for the OP to throw out everything learned here and to start with this:
http://www.amazon.com …=8-5&keywords=photography (external link)

And once that book is done,

http://www.amazon.com …s=photography+c​omposition (external link)

You could also go here and read all of this material: https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=414088

Work through these books from beginning to end. It will probably take you less time than trying to figure it out through the Q&A, trial & error approach.


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Colin ­ Glover
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Jan 20, 2014 16:57 |  #229

After posting in this thread last night, I went to look at some Jpegs of a pre wedding shoot done with my 55-200 usm and they looked soft and flat. I loaded the Jpegs as Raw files in Photoshop and set to work. The biggest improvement came with the Clarity slider. After boosting it to 60 I added 25 on the ACR sharpener, and then used ACR NR to get rid of noise without going OTT. Then opening it in main programme I went to Colour curves and used the preset for increase contrast. Finally, a large dollop of USM was applied and the image straightened and cropped at the same time. Bingo! The bride to be now looked fabulous. Pagman, follow these steps in the right order to improve shots. But you kind of have a point in a way but you don't know why it is and I think I do. Your lens is NOT a top of the range 55-300 VR. What we see in magazines and on the big internet sites is taken with these expensive L lenses or equivalent. Virtually everything about them is way superior to 'Bog Standard' lenses. I've seen sigs on here with some having spent £0000's on good lenses and bodies. And it can make you think either your gear or your tecnique is at fault. Apart from being a 'snapper' as opposed to a composer, Pagman's not doing that much wrong. Learn to PP the proper way. For example if I overdo the 'Darken Highlights' slider it gives the image that artificial feel. I find it better to lighten using a combo of exposure and brightness in ACR. Remember, it's just down to the fact you see so many shots on here taken with expensive glass. Cheaper lenses have their own feel. Look at my Rebel Users Allied Show Us your best non L series lens shots and then tell me if you think your shots still lack something apart from compositional error.


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xarqi
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Jan 20, 2014 17:15 |  #230

kin2son wrote in post #16621703 (external link)
I don't understand why a focusing test was even suggested in the first place?

For myself, I'm not pushing for focus tests per se, but more some testing at various apertures and focal lengths to assess any weakness present in the lens that may be able to account for the softness that I see in some images. The process may reveal a fault, or it may help the OP realize the limitations of the lens, even with perfect technique and composition.




  
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Tom ­ Reichner
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Jan 20, 2014 17:26 |  #231

kin2son wrote in post #16621703 (external link)
I don't understand why a focusing test was even suggested in the first place?

None of OP's photos posted so fast in this thread shows any signs of back/front focusing, they were all shot at small aperture....clearly focusing wasn't the problem to begin with :rolleyes:

Kin2Son, you are wrong. You said that none of the OP's posted photos showed signs of front or back focusing, and that focusing was not the problem. Focusing was most definitely the major problem with the image Pagman posted in post #103 of this thread.

Why did you use the "roll eyes" symbol? Are you frustrated at people for having suggested a focus test? What concern is that of yours? They were suggesting it to Pagman, because he clearly had a focusing issue with the afore-referenced image. You have no right to be frustrated at them, when they have carefully paid attention to every single image Pagman posted, and you are the one who has overlooked something. Don't be so critical unless you can do so without being wrong yourself.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"They're", "their", and "there" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"Fare" and "fair" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one. The proper expression is "moot point", NOT "mute point".

  
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Pagman
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Jan 20, 2014 17:30 as a reply to  @ xarqi's post |  #232

I took this today mid am, poor conditions with heavy overcast, i saw the mist lingering so i shot it including the trees for interest, getting a decent Ap was difficult unless i pushed the Iso to 400 but i set ettr to +1 stop to help the noise at this Iso, i was handholding so all i got sh speed was 125/sec and managed f.9, shot it jpeg/raw for the first time, i dont think it came out to bad there seems to be some detail there despite the mist and lack of light:)

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Pagman
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Jan 20, 2014 17:36 |  #233

h14nha wrote in post #16621559 (external link)
Pagman.

Teamspeed gave you great instructions on how to set up your camera to test it for faults. Then you go and handhold a shot at 1/13 sec. You really aren't helping yourself, that's why people are getting short with you. You have to eliminate all possibles to get to the bottom of the kit v user error issue.

Really, help yourself or the people in the thread will give up on you :(

Sometimes it takes time for me to devote time to my photography during daylight hours, as i have a terminaly ill wife who needs my care, taking pictures is however a breather for me so i can loose myself for a while, so i rarely have the time.

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kin2son
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Jan 20, 2014 17:48 |  #234
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Tom Reichner wrote in post #16621949 (external link)
Kin2Son, you are wrong. You said that none of the OP's posted photos showed signs of front or back focusing, and that focusing was not the problem. Focusing was most definitely the major problem with the image Pagman posted in post #103 of this thread.

Tom I just had another look at the picture at post #103, I'd say 99% was a misfocus as the AF was confused by all the leaves and branches. God knows what AF mode OP used....that wasn't a front/back focus issue, it was clearly an user error combining with limitation of hardware and unrealistic expectation.

Even if OP did indeed use the right AF method (single point), the distance and size of the subject means the point is probably bigger than the whole subject which affects the accuracy. Can't believe I have to spell that out loud to an experienced birder....:rolleyes:


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Pagman
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Jan 20, 2014 18:01 as a reply to  @ kin2son's post |  #235

Talking of birds....i also shot this today same time as pic above, what do people think?

P.

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TeamSpeed
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Jan 20, 2014 18:08 |  #236

kin2son wrote in post #16622006 (external link)
Tom I just had another look at the picture at post #103, I'd say 99% was a misfocus as the AF was confused by all the leaves and branches. God knows what AF mode OP used....that wasn't a front/back focus issue, it was clearly an user error combining with limitation of hardware and unrealistic expectation.

Even if OP did indeed use the right AF method (single point), the distance and size of the subject means the point is probably bigger than the whole subject which affects the accuracy. Can't believe I have to spell that out loud to an experienced birder....:rolleyes:

Yeah, I called all that out too in my post where I describe how to do the detailed AF check. There is a point where your brain says "I want object X" to be in focus, but when you tell the camera to AF, it sees much more than X over one of of its AF points simply because you don't have enough optical reach. Then when you look at the pic, other things were in focus.

I suggested the focus test because if there is any front/back focusing issues at all, they can be exaggerated when doing these long shots.

In any case, the same discussions are now being had on this Nikon/lens combo, as we had with the 30D/55-250 in the past. It most likely is user error, poor user expectations, and glass that simply isn't long enough. 100% crops are rarely going to look good in these cases unless you have stellar glass and a great sensor. The 30D actually has a great sensor, its pixel density is the same as the 5D2 and its AA filter is really weak. Nice long glass (like 300mm or 400mm) on the 30D would produce great results. Unfortunately Pagman has switched camps, and thus reduced the pool of resources to help him dig through this.


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Jan 20, 2014 18:10 |  #237

Pagman wrote in post #16622043 (external link)
Talking of birds....i also shot this today same time as pic above, what do people think?

P.

Hard to tell unless this is a 100% crop? If not, then we are looking at a postage stamp sized photo at these resolutions, and there are really no good details to make out. Back of birds, birds in bushes, etc make for very poor material for assessment of your equipment. I called out the specifics in my post, yet nothing... I am going to have to unsubscribe, as it gets a bit frustrating when I spend the time outlining what you can do to really assess your equipment, and you continue to shoot what you have been to have us assess your equipment. Good luck I hope you iron this all out.


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Pagman
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Jan 20, 2014 18:14 as a reply to  @ Pagman's post |  #238

This is about as close as i have ever come to a wild bird of prey, same one as above, i couldnt get any closer as soon as he spotted me he was off:(:(

Yep its a crop about 40%

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kin2son
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Jan 20, 2014 18:25 |  #239
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^^ There's nothing wrong with your shot.

Birding is an expensive business, always has been.

Distance will always be your worst enemy, you only have 10mp, and once you start cropping you really don't have much pixels left on your target.

Why do you think pro birder spend $10+ on a long 600mm tele?

Maybe you should consider the Tamron 150-600 if birding is your passion?

Accept the limitation, sharpen your skills and be happy with the result...


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Tom ­ Reichner
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Jan 20, 2014 18:34 |  #240

Kin2son,
You don't have to "spell it out" to me. I was trying to pin you down to the actual words you used. When you say, "clearly focusing was not the problem . . .", and focusing was the problem, I am gong to call you out on that mistake.

Whether the camera has front/back focusing issues, or if the OP missed focus thru user error, it is a focusing issue either way. A user error in which the photographer misses focus is still a focusing issue, and the way you worded the last part of your rant is still wrong. Try to make sure that every sentence you write here is absolutely accurate, and can stand on its own as an accurate statement. Otherwise, what you type may be wrong due to careless wording.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"They're", "their", and "there" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"Fare" and "fair" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one. The proper expression is "moot point", NOT "mute point".

  
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