A really basic NOOB question about RAW ...

I apologize, but this place is SO big I can't refine a search enough to see if this has been addressed.

Just what, exactly, of the camera's many settings, affect the RAW image?

I suspect that sounds kind of dumb, but I keep reading that the RAW image contains the original sensor information, and I know ISO affects it--you have to get the exposure right.

But all the other image settings, like white balance (which I know can be adjusted in processing later), picture styles like Standard, Faithful, Sharpening, and filter effects like grainy, soft focus, toy camera -- do any of those affect the RAW image file, or just in-camera JPG?

I've only shot JPG, Fine, Large up to this point on my old Rebel XT. Now that I have the 60D I want to also move up to using Lightroom. And I realize now I have no idea what camera settings do or do not affect the RAW image. Maybe they all do, but I suspect at least some of them are only used for shooting JPG and are ignored for RAW.

Can you enlighten me on what does or does not affect RAW and, second question, what camera settings do you recommend when shooting Raw? If anything other than ISO does affect the RAW image file, then I would suspect you want to set it on Neutral or Faithful, yes?

Thanks for helping. I don't want to do anything in the camera that will either make more work later in Lightroom or narrow my range of adjustment in RAW processing.

White balance, picture style, etc. just tag the RAW with a bit of metadata so that DPP, etc. can process in such-and-such a manner. AFAIK, this metadata does not alter the actual sensor data that has been recorded in the file. Even ISO doesn't directly alter the RAW, it just varies the amplifier gain as the sensor is being read.

JohnCollins wrote in post #16655846
I suspect that sounds kind of dumb, but I keep reading that the RAW image contains the original sensor information, and I know ISO affects it--you have to get the exposure right.

I'm only marginally more familiar than you but I'll try to help. All of the exposure settings matter. ISO, Aperture and shutter speed. The as shot white balance is the white balance that the raw file is originally opened with in Lightroom unless you apply a preset when opening that contains a different white balance.

JohnCollins wrote in post #16655846
But all the other image settings, like white balance (which I know can be adjusted in processing later), picture styles like Standard, Faithful, Sharpening, and filter effects like grainy, soft focus, toy camera -- do any of those affect the RAW image file, or just in-camera JPG?

The settings above affect the in camera jpg production. White balance affects both the jpg and the raw file.

Other than the hardware settings - aperture, shutter and ISO - there is only one setting that directly affects the Raw data, Long Exposure NR. All the rest is annotated in the metadata but does not change the Raw image data. If you use Canon's DPP it reads the metadata and sets its defaults accordingly, but if you use LR or any other third party application, it reads only one item, the WB, and in its WB menu there is an As Shot option that applies a WB that is equivalent to what the camera would have done, but is not exactly the same.

Geonerd wrote in post #16655920
White balance, picture style, etc. just tag the RAW with a bit of metadata so that DPP, etc. can process in such-and-such a manner. AFAIK, this metadata does not alter the actual sensor data that has been recorded in the file. Even ISO doesn't directly alter the RAW, it just varies the amplifier gain as the sensor is being read.

Since the Raw data is siphoned off downstream from the ISO amplifier, it is affected by the ISO setting.

Ah, great, thanks. That was what I thought, but I'm not confident enough to assume I was right.

So, the only thing that actually affects the RAW image file, the way it is recorded, is ISO. So You have to get the aperture and shutter speed (exposure) correct or close to correct. The ISO does affect the sensitivity of the sensor (amplification?), so if I goof the exposure a lot, I won't be able to recover in processing.

If I'm understanding correctly, nothing else actually affects the way the RAW image file is recorded. Take white balance, for instance. It tags what color temperature to open the RAW file at in DPP or Lightroom, but you can adjust that as you see fit during processing. Other than defining what settings to open the file with in DPP or Lightroom, no camera settings other than ISO, aperture, and shutter speed make any difference in how the RAW image file is recorded.

Then I guess the answer to my last question, what settings do you usually shoot in (Standard, Portrait, Landscape, Neutral, Faithful, or Monochrome) is it doesn't make any difference if you are only shooting RAW. You really only have to think about those if you are shooting in-camera processed JPG. Or RAW + JPG. In Raw, all I need to think about is proper exposure. Period.

If that is a correct understanding, I thank you all very much.

You've got it.
One small comment: Although the Picture Style doesn't affect the Raw data and you will choose the one you want to use later in LR or DPP when you use the Raw to create a jpg or tiff, it does affect both the picture the camera shows you when you press the Review button and the histogram associated with it. That is because what you are seeing is a highly compressed jpg that the camera embeds inside the .CR2 file to be used as a display. That jpg will be built using all the camera settings, including whatever Picture Style is set and the sub-settings in that P.S., contrast, sharpening, saturation and hue. And, perhaps more important, the histogram is derived from that jpg and all the processing that has been done to it often inflates the histogram and makes it unrepresentative of the Raw reality behind the jpg. In order to alleviate this situation, at least partially, many people make sure that when shooting Raw the camera is set to Neutral P.S. with contrast and saturation all the way over to the left end of their scales (minimum), because this makes the jpg processing minimal. If you do this the green histogram will be very close to reflecting the exposure and tonality of the Raw (the red and blue values are skewed by the white balancing applied to the jpg, but the green is generally unaffected by WB.)

tzalman wrote in post #16657940
You've got it.
One small comment: Although the Picture Style doesn't affect the Raw data and you will choose the one you want to use later in LR or DPP when you use the Raw to create a jpg or tiff, it does affect both the picture the camera shows you when you press the Review button and the histogram associated with it. That is because what you are seeing is a highly compressed jpg that the camera embeds inside the .CR2 file to be used as a display. That jpg will be built using all the camera settings, including whatever Picture Style is set and the sub-settings in that P.S., contrast, sharpening, saturation and hue. And, perhaps more important, the histogram is derived from that jpg and all the processing that has been done to it often inflates the histogram and makes it unrepresentative of the Raw reality behind the jpg. In order to alleviate this situation, at least partially, many people make sure that when shooting Raw the camera is set to Neutral P.S. with contrast and saturation all the way over to the left end of their scales (minimum), because this makes the jpg processing minimal. If you do this the green histogram will be very close to reflecting the exposure and tonality of the Raw (the red and blue values are skewed by the white balancing applied to the jpg, but the green is generally unaffected by WB.)

Wow! That's useful information there! So the picture style can make a difference, but indirectly? If I understand you correctly the picture styles will still not affect the way the RAW image is recorded ... but if I am using the histogram to judge my exposure, using other picture styles may influence me to expose just a little bit off the exposure which would give me the most latitude for adjustments in PP. Is that a correct understanding?

So if I am going to shoot only RAW, and if I use the histogram as an exposure help, I should always set PS to Neutral to ensure the histogram will guide me to the best (one allowing widest adjustment latitude later) exposure for PP work?

JohnCollins wrote in post #16658053
Wow! That's useful information there! So the picture style can make a difference, but indirectly? If I understand you correctly the picture styles will still not affect the way the RAW image is recorded ... but if I am using the histogram to judge my exposure, using other picture styles may influence me to expose just a little bit off the exposure which would give me the most latitude for adjustments in PP. Is that a correct understanding?

So if I am going to shoot only RAW, and if I use the histogram as an exposure help, I should always set PS to Neutral to ensure the histogram will guide me to the best (one allowing widest adjustment latitude later) exposure for PP work?

Yes, the histogram is generated based on the data from a pre-baked jpeg, that's used as the preview icon for the full image. This means all jpeg-only settings like picture styles, dynamic range optimization, and vignette correction all influence the preview image and may not represent what you're actually going to get in post.

There are however a small number of settings on Canon cameras that are baked into the Raw, such as D+ and dark frame subtraction. I'm not sure which others might off the top of my head.

Kolor-Pikker wrote in post #16658095
Yes, the histogram is generated based on the data from a pre-baked jpeg, that's used as the preview icon for the full image. This means all jpeg-only settings like picture styles, dynamic range optimization, and vignette correction all influence the preview image and may not represent what you're actually going to get in post.

There are however a small number of settings on Canon cameras that are baked into the Raw, such as D+ and dark frame subtraction. I'm not sure which others might off the top of my head.

OK, thanks, very much. I think I got what I needed here. D+ and dark fram subtraction are getting way beyond my level of understanding, but my takeaway from this has been very helpful.

If I shoot RAW + JPG for some reason (or just JPG, of course), I will use WB and picture styles as I see fit. If I am just shooting RAW, I will always set AWB (because it really does not matter) and NEUTRAL picture style. Provided I do my job correctly, that should get my RAW files in the best possible place to begin PP in Lightroom.

I appreciate it, people!


Edit: I found this, and they say the same thing, Neutral is the way to go for RAW images. Thanks again for the help.

http://www.learn.usa.c​anon.com …tureStyles_Quic​kGuide.pdf

I thought the Highlight Expansion Priority setting (or whatever it is called) gets baked in ... can't remember the name, but it provides more room in the highlights end at the expense of the shadows ..

Maxdave

With Highlight Tone Priority, aka D+, turned on, three things happen: 1. The actual ISO used is one stop lower than what is set. 2. A flag is written in the metadata. 3. DPP sees the flag and applies a tone curve that raises the shadows by a stop and the highlights by about half a stop. When HTP was first introduced (I think in the 40D, 6.5 years ago) LR/ACR couldn't see the flag, so no curve was applied and you got an underexposed conversion. After about a year of people screaming, "Oy vey! Lightroom ruined my photo," Adobe added the ability to read the flag and to react, not with a curve, but rather a linear boost of one stop across the board that in effect cancels the HTP. (But because it is a digital boost adds some noise as punishment)