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Thread started 09 Feb 2014 (Sunday) 17:46
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Snowy Owl help needed....

 
itw
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Feb 09, 2014 17:46 |  #1

I can find 'em, now I need to learn how to photograph them ! :cry:
They are wonderful subjects as they just calmly sit there seemingly oblivious to everything happening around them.

My camera was on a tripod, although I did have IS "on". I also thought my ISO was on "A", but it turns out I was locked on 400.
Late afternoon, cloudy and oh yeah..... frickin' COLD !

( 70D / 100-400 / f 5.6 / exp 1/800 / ISO 400 / focal length 400MM )

Where am I going wrong ? How do I get those crisp feather details you guys achieve or even a less soft shot ?

Helllp !

Thanks ;)

Ted

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Feb 09, 2014 17:58 |  #2

This would be a good question for Duane he has Shot the most Snowy Owl's that I have seen. lol
One more thing ....If you can touch both ends of your lens at the same time.... your in the same boat as me!!


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Snydremark
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Feb 09, 2014 17:59 |  #3

Where were you focused? And did you have a UV filter on the lens?

As you mentioned, IS should be off when using the 100-400 from a tripod; especially if you aren't using a timer with that sort of shutter speed. When you activate the shutter, the IS takes a second to settle out, and at 1/800 you may have caught it in that settling period.


- Eric S.: My Birds/Wildlife (external link) (R5, RF 800 f/11, Canon 16-35 F/4 MkII, Canon 24-105L f/4 IS, Canon 70-200L f/2.8 IS MkII, Canon 100-400L f/4.5-5.6 IS I/II)
"The easiest way to improve your photos is to adjust the loose nut between the shutter release and the ground."

  
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itw
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Feb 09, 2014 18:15 |  #4

Nope, no filter. I had the single focus box squarely on his right eye. You would have liked to see the shutter speed faster Eric ? How about ISO ?

Snydremark wrote in post #16676865 (external link)
Where were you focused? And did you have a UV filter on the lens?

As you mentioned, IS should be off when using the 100-400 from a tripod; especially if you aren't using a timer with that sort of shutter speed. When you activate the shutter, the IS takes a second to settle out, and at 1/800 you may have caught it in that settling period.


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Feb 09, 2014 18:17 |  #5

Mmmmm, well, my hands ain't that big ! :D
Hopefully we'll hear from Duane !

Pondrader wrote in post #16676864 (external link)
This would be a good question for Duane he has Shot the most Snowy Owl's that I have seen. lol
One more thing ....If you can touch both ends of your lens at the same time.... your in the same boat as me!!


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Feb 09, 2014 18:21 as a reply to  @ itw's post |  #6

Is this cropped at all? If so, how much.

I'm no expert but my guess is either the crop is your issue, processing steps, lack of sunlight or one or all of the above.

And just a side note about the IS. I'm not saying I'm right or anyone is wrong but I've turned mine off once in the 4 years I've owned my 500mm lens and I shoot with a tripod 95% of the time.


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horse51
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Feb 09, 2014 19:39 |  #7

I have also seen on very cold days with a little sun you get heat off snow as I have seen in mine. I like the image here and maybe some selective sharpening to help it....


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Snydremark
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Feb 09, 2014 22:24 |  #8

itw wrote in post #16676908 (external link)
Nope, no filter. I had the single focus box squarely on his right eye. You would have liked to see the shutter speed faster Eric ? How about ISO ?

No, shutter speed should have been sufficient, in and of itself, if a hair dark. Personally, I would have gone slightly slower (1/640) and boosted the ISO a tiny bit (640), from the looks of things.

As Duane asked, is this a crop of the original? and if so, how much of one? Were you using One Shot, AI Focus or AI Servo? And, from your statement above, I assume you're shooting with a single AF point?

My earlier point was make sure the IS is on on the lens, put the camera on a tripod without pushing any buttons, put your eye to the viewfinder, now half press the the shutter button to activate IS. Note how the view appears to move, briefly? If you triggered the shutter without giving it the chance to make that transition, you can catch some softening from that movement.

More likely, though, from that shot, it looks like the issue was either, a huge crop or some failure to focus.


- Eric S.: My Birds/Wildlife (external link) (R5, RF 800 f/11, Canon 16-35 F/4 MkII, Canon 24-105L f/4 IS, Canon 70-200L f/2.8 IS MkII, Canon 100-400L f/4.5-5.6 IS I/II)
"The easiest way to improve your photos is to adjust the loose nut between the shutter release and the ground."

  
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itw
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Feb 09, 2014 23:01 |  #9

Eric Laddie ! So we meet again ! Thanks for checking in and following up with your interest and direction. Much appreciated.

Yes, you and Duane are seeing the results of a pretty good croppin', can't tell you for certain what the numbers were but attached is the original.

Wanting to be sure I was ready in case of flight, I was in AI Servo and shooting with a single AF point, the center one.

I did notice the phenomenon of the image movement you mention just this afternoon here in the house before I went out. Not a clue why, but I did try and let things settle down in the field. I'll bet using a remote shutter release or timer will help even more, yes ?

Snydremark wrote in post #16677421 (external link)
No, shutter speed should have been sufficient, in and of itself, if a hair dark. Personally, I would have gone slightly slower (1/640) and boosted the ISO a tiny bit (640), from the looks of things.

As Duane asked, is this a crop of the original? and if so, how much of one? Were you using One Shot, AI Focus or AI Servo? And, from your statement above, I assume you're shooting with a single AF point?

My earlier point was make sure the IS is on on the lens, put the camera on a tripod without pushing any buttons, put your eye to the viewfinder, now half press the the shutter button to activate IS. Note how the view appears to move, briefly? If you triggered the shutter without giving it the chance to make that transition, you can catch some softening from that movement.

More likely, though, from that shot, it looks like the issue was either, a huge crop or some failure to focus.

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Feb 09, 2014 23:09 |  #10

Duane N wrote in post #16676919 (external link)
Is this cropped at all? If so, how much.

I'm no expert but my guess is either the crop is your issue, processing steps, lack of sunlight or one or all of the above.

And just a side note about the IS. I'm not saying I'm right or anyone is wrong but I've turned mine off once in the 4 years I've owned my 500mm lens and I shoot with a tripod 95% of the time.

Thanks Duane..... could have fooled me on the "expert" part ! ;) You are correct about the crop, I posted the original above so you could get an idea of what I did.

I'll head over there again tomorrow to see if this rascal is still hungry and hunting this spot. I'll say a little prayer for sun before I turn in tonight ! Appreciate your comments regarding IS & tripod work also. // Ted

horse51 wrote in post #16677100 (external link)
I have also seen on very cold days with a little sun you get heat off snow as I have seen in mine. I like the image here and maybe some selective sharpening to help it....

Hey Horse, Thanks for the encouragement ! Maybe I'm being too hard on myself but I know I have a lot to learn.

This place is great ! Catch ya next time around. // Ted
PS: I like your tag line. It would make a good T-shirt !


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Snydremark
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Feb 10, 2014 00:20 |  #11

Thanks for that. It looks like you're fighting a decent bit of underexposure, plus heavy cropping there; to really get the sharp, detailed shots you see here, you need to get your exposure better but even more importantly, you need the bird filling more of the frame to begin with.

It certainly explains some of what we see in the edited shot. When you've got an image that is this underexposed, you have to push that up in post to get to where your edit was, which brings out noise much stronger. For a situation like that one, if you had run your ISO up a stop or so (to 800+) you could have had a much brighter image and pulled it back slightly in post. That would have helped keep your owl more white, and not given that odd green/red coloring in the chest barring that you see in the original.

Also, getting closer is really the trick with any lens. For example, this shot is from our irruption on the West coast, 2 years ago. This is a full height framing at 400mm, crop was rotated to portrait, so it only cropped off the edges. (click through to the actual Flickr post for a sharper version)

IMAGE: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7188/6776569730_7cdfe80787_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/snydremark/6776​569730/  (external link)
Snowy Owl-6983 (external link) by Guideon72 (external link), on Flickr

This was the first year they came down and the birds were much more tolerant of people at that point. The next year, they're been pressed hard enough by people including the (juvenile twits I saw chasing one waving their coats) that we were hard-pressed to approach the things very close at all.

This is about a 1/3 crop on both edges, from [I'm guessing] 40ft away or so, again, at 400mm. This guy was perfectly happy with all of the photographers standing at that distance, but if anyone got any closer, he'd move further down the log.
IMAGE: http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8499/8333217083_34b37d9830_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/snydremark/8333​217083/  (external link)
Damon Point Snowy Owl-0927 (external link) by Guideon72 (external link), on Flickr

Keep working at it, and don't forget that the quality of the light you're working with is going to have as much or more to do with your final outcome than the quantity of the light does.

- Eric S.: My Birds/Wildlife (external link) (R5, RF 800 f/11, Canon 16-35 F/4 MkII, Canon 24-105L f/4 IS, Canon 70-200L f/2.8 IS MkII, Canon 100-400L f/4.5-5.6 IS I/II)
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Feb 10, 2014 03:56 |  #12

horse51 wrote in post #16677100 (external link)
I have also seen on very cold days with a little sun you get heat off snow as I have seen in mine. I like the image here and maybe some selective sharpening to help it....

Great point here. Also, if you shoot from a vehicle and the heat is on the heat rolling out of the window can effect the image.


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Feb 10, 2014 04:35 |  #13

itw wrote in post #16677525 (external link)
I'll bet using a remote shutter release or timer will help even more, yes ?

This is something I'm going to be investing in here shortly (shutter release). I think it can help making sharper images in the long run as long as you're photographing a cooperative subject.

The one thing I think that helps me a lot with my keeper rate is how my focus is set up on most of my camera bodies. I have the focus button set to the " * " button on the back of the camera. I also put the camera in movie mode, zoom in 10X on the head or eyes, focus the camera then take it out of movie mode and take pictures. As long as the subject doesn't move too much where it will effect my depth of field I don't have to re-focus the camera.

Here's an example of one of my Snowy Owl images where I used the above focusing technique. I found that focusing on a white bird fools the camera and it doesn't know what to really focus on unless you hit the eye or a dark feather. At a distance the camera still has a hard time picking up on the eye or something else so this is why most of the times I use movie mode to focus on whatever I'm photographing when I can.

IMAGE: http://www.3rdicreations.com/img/s10/v110/p416637806-4.jpg


IMAGE: http://www.3rdicreations.com/img/s10/v110/p723749866-4.jpg


The above image setting were: Canon 1D4, Canon 500mm f/4L, Canon 1.4II extender, Kenko 1.5 non-reporting extender (giving me a total focal length of 1050mm), 1/640", f/10, ISO 500, tripod. I hate cropping my images too much like I did in the above image but sometimes you have to because the subject is uneasy like this Owl was. It let me know the distance it would allow me to get when I first came across it (150') so I didn't push things the rest of the morning with it and I left with some drinking images and some bathing images from the encounter.

Pay attention to how the Owl reacts to your presence and know the signs of when it's feeling uncomfortable. It will either sit up on it's legs, start looking around (spinning it's head quickly) or start stretching it's neck up and down when it feels uneasy. Approach it when it's not looking at you quietly and stop moving when it turns to look at you. It's taken me anywhere from 20 minutes to 45 minutes to approach a Snowy Owl so I take what the Owl will let me get without disturbing it too much.

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