Inexpensive Lens for Group photos of 10+

I am in marketing and graphics for my day job and do family photos on the side. I use a Canon Rebel XS 1000D. I have been getting calls for families of up to 16! What would be an inexpensive lens to get the job done? I am using the 18-55mm lens right now but that only gets you so far. I was thinking the 18-135mm STM might actually be a good buy that way I could use it for portraits and events.

Otherwise, how bout a wide angle lens? Needs to be crisp around the edges though.

Any primes?

Keep in mind, this is a side job and I do not want to dump a ton of money into it just yet.

Thanks!

For large groups you' d be stopping down aperture anyways. The 18-55 should do fine.

Possibly you should be looking into better lighting gear for certain situations.

I dont think a 18-135 will be a massive jump from a 18-55IS.

budget?

Heya,

The 18-55 is fine. You just probably need to have a lot of working room to get the frame up you want. You will be stopping down to get them all in focus. I would do F8 for a group that large.

Save your money on lenses. You have a perfectly good portrait lens already.

Spend your money on lighting. You will see a MASSIVE difference in portraits, especially groups, if you had some speedlites.

Suggested route:

Yongnuo 560 III (get two of these)
Yongnuo RF603C II (pair, you only need one)
Light stands (cheap, $20 a pop)

Set them up on either side of you. You stand in the center. Manually set power on the flashes for exposure. Stop down to F8, shutter 1/200s, and ISO to your taste (more ISO = more ambient light and less requird power from the flashes, but you can also leave it ISO 100 for the cleanest image possible since the XS doesn't handle a lot of ISO anyways very nicely).

Best $200 you could spend right there for portraits, since you already have a camera and capable lens.

Very best,

AlanU wrote in post #17034031
For large groups you' d be stopping down aperture anyways. The 18-55 should do fine.

Possibly you should be looking into better lighting gear for certain situations.

I dont think a 18-135 will be a massive jump from a 18-55IS.

budget?

I do use an external flash as a fill light on occasion but I still prefer natural light.

Not sure on the budget. The problem is getting the wife to agree. I could prly get away with $200-$300 which I know doesn't get me very far. Was just thinking maybe there was a good value out there. I know the 50mm 1.8 is highly recommended bc of its price and speed. The 40mm pancake is also a great value. The only reason I thought the 18-135mm is bc I sometimes will zoom in on a small child when he/she finally cracks a good smile. lol. Plus It is a good versatile lens.

MalVeauX wrote in post #17034072
Heya,

The 18-55 is fine. You just probably need to have a lot of working room to get the frame up you want. You will be stopping down to get them all in focus. I would do F8 for a group that large.

Save your money on lenses. You have a perfectly good portrait lens already.

Spend your money on lighting. You will see a MASSIVE difference in portraits, especially groups, if you had some speedlites.

Suggested route:

Yongnuo 560 III (get two of these)
Yongnuo RF603C II (pair, you only need one)
Light stands (cheap, $20 a pop)

Set them up on either side of you. You stand in the center. Manually set power on the flashes for exposure. Stop down to F8, shutter 1/200s, and ISO to your taste (more ISO = more ambient light and less requird power from the flashes, but you can also leave it ISO 100 for the cleanest image possible since the XS doesn't handle a lot of ISO anyways very nicely).

Best $200 you could spend right there for portraits, since you already have a camera and capable lens.

Very best,

I've actually been shooting at F8, 200 or 400 for ISO, and a mounted speedlight when needed. But, I like the idea of the 2 stands; the one flash is ok for smaller groups but not a larger one. Thanks for the input, will def take that into consideration!

My only problem is I shoot on location in odd areas sometimes. Yesterday was on the beach in the rocks where setting up would be a pain! I also try to move fast and change locations quickly so a mounted flash works better. Maybe upgrade my flash?

You can't go wrong with the 50 1.8 for portraits of a few people but you'd need a large working space to fit 16 people in at 50 mm but I still advise you purchase it. I purchased the 50 1.8 and used my kit lens for the last 6 months with some really great results. I've just upgraded to the 85 1.8 and am REALLY excited to do my first portrait shoot with it.

In my experience, zooms (even fairly expensive ones, and even when stepped down to f8-f11) are usually not sharp enough at the edges for large group photos. I'd go for a cheap prime - like 40mm or 50mm f1.8. When stepped down to f8 or so, they should be sharp enough for your purposes.

pulsar123 wrote in post #17034118
In my experience, zooms (even fairly expensive ones, and even when stepped down to f8-f11) are usually not sharp enough at the edges for large group photos. I'd go for a cheap prime - like 40mm or 50mm f1.8. When stepped down to f8 or so, they should be sharp enough for your purposes.

That's what I was thinking. the 50 is just so cheaply made but it is also cheap! lol I'm afraid it may be a little narrow though.

The 40mm pancake has awesome reviews as well but is not quite as fast. I may be leaning towards the 40mm just to get a little wider, better built, and I hear it does better when stopped down as opposed to the 50mm which I heard doesnt do so well at say F8 or so.

BlakeC wrote in post #17034106
I've actually been shooting at F8, 200 or 400 for ISO, and a mounted speedlight when needed. But, I like the idea of the 2 stands; the one flash is ok for smaller groups but not a larger one. Thanks for the input, will def take that into consideration!

My only problem is I shoot on location in odd areas sometimes. Yesterday was on the beach in the rocks where setting up would be a pain! I also try to move fast and change locations quickly so a mounted flash works better. Maybe upgrade my flash?

You'd be surprised how light weight and simple it is to move two basic stands with two speedlites on top. Having good lighting is the difference between meh photographs and photographs that make people say "wow."

You know those photos you see in magazines and on beaches? They used lights. Several of them usually.

Practice with more lights. You can get a system down for moving them and knowing how much distance for power you need at certain apertures to get the exposure right. It will be second nature and you will land photos in one or two shots, rather than several, hoping for the best.

Even if you do get a lens, I would skip the 50mm F1.8 II, it's autofocus will leave you pulling your hair out if the lighting isn't perfect, as it is poor with autofocus. If you're buying an inexpensive prime, the 40mm F2.8 pancake is the way to go in my opinion. I own both. Also, shorter focal length here is your friend for groups.

Everyone that I've met (myself included!) that have said "I just want to shoot natural light" just say that because they're inexperienced and have not had the pleasure of using strobes. There are people who are masters, absolute masters of natural light portraiture, and they have probably the greatest skill of anyone out there. But unless you're one of them, strobes are your best friend. A few speedlites are easily one of the best things you can do to increase your ability to do versatile, controlled photography. Especially groups where you're stopping down aperture.

Cheap stands work fine ($24 for two)
Yongnuo 560 III (get two) ($140 for both) (build in wireless receiver, so you can string tones of them off camera and control with one transmitter!)
Yongnuo RF603CII ($35) (Comes as a pair, you only need one to trigger all your 560 III's)

You can start with that, and be done.

When you get used to strobing and bask in the light, you can get modifiers, like umbrellas & softboxes for cheap ($30 cheap!).

Very best,

MalVeauX wrote in post #17034142
You'd be surprised how light weight and simple it is to move two basic stands with two speedlites on top. Having good lighting is the difference between meh photographs and photographs that make people say "wow."

You know those photos you see in magazines and on beaches? They used lights. Several of them usually.

Practice with more lights. You can get a system down for moving them and knowing how much distance for power you need at certain apertures to get the exposure right. It will be second nature and you will land photos in one or two shots, rather than several, hoping for the best.

Even if you do get a lens, I would skip the 50mm F1.8 II, it's autofocus will leave you pulling your hair out if the lighting isn't perfect, as it is poor with autofocus. If you're buying an inexpensive prime, the 40mm F2.8 pancake is the way to go in my opinion. I own both. Also, shorter focal length here is your friend for groups.

Very best,

I may just end up trying out some lights if business keeps up like it has.

As far as a lens, im trying to justify it by being able to use it for more than just group shots.

I am thinking the 40mm pancake is the way to go just for the sake of having it. lol

Heya,

Don't get a lens just to have it. If it's focal length doesn't serve your needs, then it's not worth buying. If you're stopping down to F8, I will honestly say it's not that different, if really at all, from your kit 18-55 lens stopped down to F8. Again, I have both of these lenses. I bought the 40mm F2.8 for it's size and F2.8. I didn't buy it to stop down. I would suggest you stick with your current lens. It's more than adequate for group portraits. It's totally fine. Put more emphasis on controlling light, and setting up your shot, your poses, hand positions, etc. These things are far more important than a small increase in optical quality, and will result in more photos that make people want more, which equates to more business.

See previous post for edit; included links to equipment that will work and is all under $200 shipped.

Very best,

BlakeC wrote in post #17034156
As far as a lens, im trying to justify it by being able to use it for more than just group shots.

In my opinion, you do not need to buy a new lens at this time. The lens you have will do just fine. Lighting, on the other hand, can really do a lot for a variety of images including group shots.

For your group shots, get a sturdy 6-foot ladder to work on top of. Build a camera support that clamps to the top of the ladder.

Keep your lighting above the camera, not to the sides. If you use more than one light, group them above the camera and make them effectively one large light source.

o no, i mean, it would get used. seems like a lens id prly use alot for fun on my own. But as far as family shots, ur prly right. What I have is sufficient.

200-300$?

Canon 10-18mm IS. Will get you ultrawide and IS which could be helpful too. The optics are good for the value..

davidfarina wrote in post #17034322
200-300$?

Canon 10-18mm IS. Will get you ultrawide and IS which could be helpful too. The optics are good for the value..

I LOVE that lens! I actually used that lens this past Saturday. I shot a photobooth for The Color Run in Lansing, MI. It was their lens. But how is the distortion around the edges for group shots? I was shooting at F8-F10 with tight groups in the center of the frame.