STICKY:  NEW RULE: Paypal Gift (Friends and Family) is not allowed here

https://photography-on-the.net …p?p=17140595#po​st17140595

Ask and you shall receive. Nice job Pekka.

Thank you for putting this policy into place. I've been asking about it for years. PayPal Gift for purchasing is no different than Dine and Dash at a restaurant. So glad people are choosing to be honest.

So, just to be clear, saying "PayPal +3%" and "net to me" pricing is "ok" as long as you don't offer to accept PP "gift" as an option in your "FS:" post or via a PM?

baj2k wrote in post #17276479
So, just to be clear, saying "PayPal +3%" and "net to me" pricing is "ok" as long as you don't offer to accept PP "gift" as an option in your "FS:" post or via a PM?

Why not just do the math, then adjust your asking price?

baj2k wrote in post #17276479
So, just to be clear, saying "PayPal +3%" and "net to me" pricing is "ok" as long as you don't offer to accept PP "gift" as an option in your "FS:" post or via a PM?

That seems to be the workaround. It is really annoying, however, as a buyer. As a buyer, I don't care how much a seller needs "net". I wish sellers would just factor in any fees and shipping charges into their sale price and let that be it. Buyers only care about the amount that comes out of their own pockets, not the amount the seller needs.

Scatterbrained wrote in post #17276493
Why not just do the math, then adjust your asking price?

I have been wondering for years why some sellers can't do this either. To me, it's silly saying "net to me", then "PayPal + 3%", then "plus shipping." To me it makes a seller sound like they can't do simple math, or are too lazy to determine and add the costs. You know how much you want for an item, simply add the 3% and shipping costs and ask a bottom line price, makes it easier for everyone. Online shipping calculators are easy to use, flat rate boxes make it even easier. I have never used the Gift option, I don't want to lose the protection (what little there is) of PayPal, especially as a buyer. My wife is an artist and sells/ships stuff all over the country. Her clients don't want to bother adding this and that to get to a price, they want a bottom line price.

For me, the 3% isn't an important factor but PayPal's Buyer Protection is. If a buyer is "unknown" then I wouldn't want to send equipment and put myself in a position where I could be defrauded with a false claim, or with the return of different equipment (or a brick).

PayPal invariably sides with the buyer, so there has to be a very high level of trust on the part of the seller. If that level of trust is not there (as it would be for a person buying for their first time online) the only way a seller can protect themselves is to use the "Send Money to Friends and Family" option, which is a straight cash transfer that doesn't include Buyer Protection. (A couple of years ago I phoned PayPal customer service and they said that they don't have any problem with people doing cash transfers for one or two private sales but that they insist that all eBay vendors include PayPal's Buyer Protection.)

Disallowing PayPal transactions that don't include Buyer Protection excludes some buyers and opens the door for buyer fraud. But, if that's the rule, then that's the rule and I'll follow it. I'm happy to be here and fully appreciate the value of this forum.

cacawcacaw wrote in post #17286539
For me, the 3% isn't an important factor but PayPal's Buyer Protection is. If a buyer is "unknown" then I wouldn't want to send equipment and put myself in a position where I could be defrauded with a false claim, or with the return of different equipment (or a brick).

PayPal invariably sides with the buyer, so there has to be a very high level of trust on the part of the seller. If that level of trust is not there (as it would be for a person buying for their first time online) the only way a seller can protect themselves is to use the "Send Money to Friends and Family" option, which is a straight cash transfer that doesn't include Buyer Protection. (A couple of years ago I phoned PayPal customer service and they said that they don't have any problem with people doing cash transfers for one or two private sales but that they insist that all eBay vendors include PayPal's Buyer Protection.)

Disallowing PayPal transactions that don't include Buyer Protection excludes some buyers and opens the door for buyer fraud. But, if that's the rule, then that's the rule and I'll follow it. I'm happy to be here and fully appreciate the value of this forum.

Yeah but an easier method is just to insist that for high dollar amounts the people have feedback in the feedback thread and be established members. Then just do a search.

Not all sellers want to include the PP fees in the selling price (which is now up to 3.7% for payments from outside of Canada) as this would penalize buyers who pay with more modern, no-fee payment systems like EMT.

It also greatly increases the chances of fraud from overseas buyers, because the cost of using a PayPal-approved shipping service makes the cost prohibitive. Since I'm not willing to assume 100% of the risk in these transactions, no PayPal Gift option means no more selling outside of Canada or the USA.

imageswest wrote in post #18285564
Not all sellers want to include the PP fees in the selling price (which is now up to 3.7% for payments from outside of Canada) as this would penalize buyers who pay with more modern, no-fee payment systems like EMT.

It also greatly increases the chances of fraud from overseas buyers, because the cost of using a PayPal-approved shipping service makes the cost prohibitive. Since I'm not willing to assume 100% of the risk in these transactions, no PayPal Gift option means no more selling outside of Canada or the USA.

I'm the exact opposite. PayPal offers me the ability to sell my gear anywhere I choose, for a (relatively) small fee. The alternative is local with the likes of CraigsList. (Though I live in Indiana and bought a 1DIV from Hawaii through CraigsList.) With PayPal, both buyer and seller are protected to some degree. I consider PayPal a service worth paying for; it expands my marketplace, and my customer base, to the entirety of the US and Cananda, at least. Seems worth ~3% to me.

When I list something, the only price I mention is what I want the buyer to submit to PayPal. As mentioned above, buyers don't give a FFA how much I net, how much goes to PP fees, how much goes to shipping. Buyers want to know how much to PAY.

Whenever I list the sales price, I always make sure to include the 3% PP fees and shipping in there, to avoid any confusion and unnecessary calculations. But I also add a note to clarify that the sales price is all-inclusive of all the fees.

I think what causes so much confusion is that every seller lists their sales price differently. Naturally, including the fees into the sales price is going to result in a higher-than-market-value price, so when a buyer does a quick run through of the items for sale and the associated price, my listing will appear a lot higher because these other people's prices are "net" and not "all-inclusive."

As far as why people don't include the fees in their sales price, it's probably a reasonable marketing ploy. No fees in sales price = comparatively lower sales price = more views from potential buyers = higher likelihood of sale because of increased views.

What also sucks is the negotiating part, but that's another story for another day.

imageswest wrote in post #18285564
Not all sellers want to include the PP fees in the selling price (which is now up to 3.7% for payments from outside of Canada) as this would penalize buyers who pay with more modern, no-fee payment systems like EMT.

It also greatly increases the chances of fraud from overseas buyers, because the cost of using a PayPal-approved shipping service makes the cost prohibitive. Since I'm not willing to assume 100% of the risk in these transactions, no PayPal Gift option means no more selling outside of Canada or the USA.

In other words, you want to assume 0% of the risk, and use the service for free.

For those that struggle w/ the math.

http://thefeecalculato​r.com/

put in the value you need and it tells you what to charge.

Then problem is people want the final value only so in actuality you are charging the $$ you want, plus shipping and then you include the fee.

So if you want $100, and shipping is $7.50 you will need to charge: $111.02 as the fee applies to all money sent.

What about using google wallet for those who don't like to use paypal?

Joseph