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Thread started 31 Oct 2014 (Friday) 12:28
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7D2: 70D/7D2/5D3 ISO Comparison

 
stsva
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Nov 01, 2014 16:16 |  #46

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17246020 (external link)
As long as the same software and steps are used across all files when comparing one camera to another, it is an apples to apples comparison. Don't need Adobe to do raw comparisons. You may because you choose to use it, but it doesn't invalidate the comparisons done so far with DPP, ESPECIALLY IF YOU KNOW HOW TO USE DPP.

The ALLCAPS/bold part (added for emphasis) is the problem, at least for me. ;)


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Nov 01, 2014 16:34 |  #47

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17246020 (external link)
As long as the same software and steps are used across all files when comparing one camera to another, it is an apples to apples comparison. Don't need Adobe to do raw comparisons. You may because you choose to use it, but it doesn't invalidate the comparisons done so far with DPP, especially if you know how to use DPP.

I'm pretty comfortable with DPP. I apply the same process for NR as I do using Adobe. I found DPP painfully slow using NR so I'm not going to do any comparisons because I doubt I'll use it on a regular basis. I'll OK with noise improvements I have see posted so far but that is not the main reason for getting it but I'll take what it offers.


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Nov 01, 2014 16:39 |  #48

This fellow is from Canada and does a lot of birding

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Nov 01, 2014 16:52 |  #49

digital paradise wrote in post #17246173 (external link)
I'm pretty comfortable with DPP. I apply the same process for NR as I do using Adobe. I found DPP painfully slow using NR so I'm not going to do any comparisons because I doubt I'll use it on a regular basis. I'll OK with noise improvements I have see posted so far but that is not the main reason for getting it but I'll take what it offers.

On my i7 laptop, the NR works pretty quickly, but I never use DPP for noise reduction, I use 3rd party tools. Plus I would rather compare without NR, because that is what I have to work with when I develop NR actions.


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Nov 01, 2014 19:21 |  #50

I have Topaz and a few others but in the last year or so I have relied on Adobe. When I install the new DPP my camera and the software will be disabled as usual. I always like total control which does make me wonder, even if disabled if there is something going on in the background we don't know about. Main reason I'll be waiting for Adobe to update.


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Nov 01, 2014 19:29 |  #51

digital paradise wrote in post #17246421 (external link)
I have Topaz and a few others but in the last year or so I have relied on Adobe. When I install the new DPP my camera and the software will be disabled as usual. I always like total control which does make me wonder, even if disabled if there is something going on in the background we don't know about. Main reason I'll be waiting for Adobe to update.

I would suspect there is as Canon knows the shortcomings of the camera and how to fix them as Adobe will not until they have researched and discovered them.


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Nov 01, 2014 20:30 |  #52

I think the 70D is slightly misfocused and you applied too much jpg compression. Properly exposing the images will help with appearance.




  
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Nov 01, 2014 20:39 |  #53

For tests like this, you really have to focus using live view (I find the contrast detection autofocus works well for shots like this, at least where a tripod is being used). There's just too much potential for focus variability otherwise.


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Nov 01, 2014 21:05 |  #54

HappySnapper90 wrote in post #17246538 (external link)
I think the 70D is slightly misfocused and you applied too much jpg compression. Properly exposing the images will help with appearance.

You could download the raws yourself. ;) My samples from Jim's raws were taken right from DPP and then JPG from DPP, at the highest settings. Also these tests are exposed well enough, as evidenced by the histograms.

Also as was discussed in the OP, this was a test for noise, and not for sharpness.


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Nov 01, 2014 21:07 |  #55

Not if the wall and light switch are supposed to be white and not gray.




  
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Nov 01, 2014 21:10 |  #56

HappySnapper90 wrote in post #17246595 (external link)
Not if the wall and light switch are supposed to be white and not gray.

I don't care what color they should or shouldn't be, the histogram on the raw is only about 1/3 stop below 0. Not bad at all, and in all reality, most people's shadows will be below that anyways, so this gives them an idea of what they will see. Whether you expose all 3 to the right, or all 3 to the left, as long as they were identical in exposure, the tests show the differences, apples to apples.


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Nov 01, 2014 22:26 |  #57

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17244754 (external link)
Cannot tell which lenses were used in those test shots. Same lens, and one that can resolve to a high density sensor? Probably not. This is why I gave up on those, I got just enough info regarding ISO performance from the raw, but cannot use anything there regarding detail. The 7D2 will be pretty close once you crop out the 1D4 and resize it up to the 7D2 shot.

I would have thought by now you would know the Imaging Resource RAW samples inside and out. :) To find out look up the sample in the ISO and JPEG or RAW version and do not down load but rather click on the oval button below the thumbnail labeled "Full Exif Display" once clicked it will display all the info you want and most likely more. ;)

In both cases the lens used was the Sigma 70mm F2.8 EX DG Macro. IIRC this is the lens they want to use in all of their tests as in their opinion is is very sharp. It is also available in most mounts so you have cross platform image control as well.

IMO the 7DmkII is softer than the 70D at ISO 100 which is where the most detail will be found. The black smudge on the switch looks a bit more blurred than the others which goes along with my earlier observations of the Pre-production samples. While noise is a bit down on the 7DmkII vs the 70D and the 7D, the detail is also reduced so overall Canon is swapping some detail for some noise reduction. If you like this compromise fine. I think it is a bait and switch approach and should be loudly called out so those less informed are not taken unfair advantage of. I also would like to say that DPP is not the best RAW converter in the past and my bet is ACR will be much better and more tweekable(?) too.

It (ACR) will bring the detail back and allow you to make the choices and compromises you feel are the best ones for your taste and comfort/concerns.


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Nov 01, 2014 23:00 |  #58

I don't trust their exif, and we are no longer looking at the IR sources. The EXIF data has been edited, so that the lens says the Sigma 50, but at 70mm and the filename is a name that cannot be set in the camera. ;)

Now we have our own samples to work with. And we have DPP that can work with the raws. Finally, we can now do our sharpness tests. This particular thread is purely about ISO and not sharpness/details, as Jim pointed out.


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xseven
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Nov 02, 2014 07:42 |  #59

Now ... can we have a comparison geared towards sharpness/details? :)




  
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Nov 02, 2014 07:49 |  #60

I'll be getting into the sharpness part pretty soon. My 7D was so sharp I had to carry bandaids in my camera bag.


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7D2: 70D/7D2/5D3 ISO Comparison
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