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Thread started 12 Nov 2014 (Wednesday) 14:59
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7D Mark II - Focus Discussions

 
Diver-Down
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Mar 05, 2015 20:52 |  #2056

One thing that I've been playing with when using a slower focusing lens like the Tamron 150-600 in Ai Servo is to slow down the frame rate to give the camera/lens a chance to track between frames. Last time out I shot it at 6 fps and it seemed to do pretty well.


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huntersdad
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Mar 05, 2015 21:15 |  #2057

Diver-Down wrote in post #17462583 (external link)
One thing that I've been playing with when using a slower focusing lens like the Tamron 150-600 in Ai Servo is to slow down the frame rate to give the camera/lens a chance to track between frames. Last time out I shot it at 6 fps and it seemed to do pretty well.

Another excellent suggestion. I have slowed mine down to 7-8.


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gschlact
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Mar 06, 2015 00:52 |  #2058

rejay14 wrote in post #17462414 (external link)
Correct with the spot focus. It was case 1, all default. Lens drive when AF impossible: on. 1st and 2nd priority: focus.

Relay,
I am catching up. I agree with your settings. I did see that the next day it was perfect.
I'll speculate, is it possible that the spot focus wasn't quite on the rock when your pressed the bb for focus, moved the point to be more solidly on the rock, and then pressed shutter? Where was the plane of sharp focus on the original failed rock image? Assuming there was one, my theory would mean the camera was still tracking the original area when shutter release instead of rock. Conversely is true if spot slipped off rock momentarily and new focus grabbed, shutter, and then you moved it back. Possible?




  
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gschlact
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Mar 06, 2015 01:22 |  #2059

huntersdad wrote in post #17462568 (external link)
It was discussed over on FM as being answered rather authoritatively by Chuck Westfall, I believe. I have confirmed the same personally with CPS.

It only makes sense that the underlying drivers are different. If they weren't, why have cases at all? You'd need one screen for adjusting any of the 3 parameters. A look at the cases and their bias towards certain actions and movements make it pretty clear they are not the same.

So I did some digging.
From Chuck Westfall as reported on the digital picture. Com.:
-----
All three cameras (1dx, 5diii, 7dii) use the same AI Servo AF algorithms (i.e., AI Servo AF III), and all three use a similar system for setting AI Servo AF characteristics, based on a menu structure with 6 customizable “Case" scenarios. Each case can be customized in terms of AF Tracking Sensitivity, Acceleration/Decelerat​ion Tracking, and AF Point Auto Switching.
-----
It was also mentioned that the 1dx had 5 values for some of the subsettings in the Cases.


I wasn't yet successful find the source you mention about different underlying algorithms.
I am thinking of emailing Chuck directly to ask and put it to bed.




  
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NeilB0147
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Mar 06, 2015 02:34 |  #2060

huntersdad wrote in post #17462607 (external link)
Another excellent suggestion. I have slowed mine down to 7-8.

So you now have a 7Dmk1 :rolleyes:




  
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Triplexbee
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Mar 06, 2015 04:40 |  #2061

NeilB0147 wrote in post #17462890 (external link)
So you now have a 7Dmk1 :rolleyes:

Only if frame rate is how you judge a camera.


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rejay14
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Mar 06, 2015 06:56 |  #2062

gschlact wrote in post #17462821 (external link)
Relay,
I am catching up. I agree with your settings. I did see that the next day it was perfect.
I'll speculate, is it possible that the spot focus wasn't quite on the rock when your pressed the bb for focus, moved the point to be more solidly on the rock, and then pressed shutter? Where was the plane of sharp focus on the original failed rock image? Assuming there was one, my theory would mean the camera was still tracking the original area when shutter release instead of rock. Conversely is true if spot slipped off rock momentarily and new focus grabbed, shutter, and then you moved it back. Possible?

I don't use BBF. I've had great success not using it on my other bodies. Also, I don't focus/recompose. I paid for all of those points and I'm gonna use them! Centre point was used in my previous test.

Regarding slipping off of the focus plane, anything is possible. The next day when I shot moving cars, it was pretty good @85-90%, which is what I would expect.


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habenero
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Mar 06, 2015 07:30 |  #2063

NeilB0147 wrote in post #17462890 (external link)
So you now have a 7Dmk1 :rolleyes:

I would think pretty much, if this is really a recommended step to achieving sharp focus, this body certainly loses some of its appeal.


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huntersdad
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Mar 06, 2015 07:39 |  #2064

habenero wrote in post #17463112 (external link)
I would think pretty much, if this is really a recommended step to achieving sharp focus, this body certainly loses some of its appeal.

I don't recall anyone recommending it. But it does make a difference.

And, yes, stepping down to 8 FPS gives you a 7d - with a better focusing system, higher res, better noise quality, better build and a plethora of other things. Get a grip people.


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Diver-Down
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Mar 06, 2015 09:28 |  #2065

And you don't need to step it down in every situation with every lens. I think just having this option is a great feature in itself, just like the many other customizable options that can be utilized for many different shooting scenarios. The 7D is by no means a perfect focusing camera at 8 fps, maybe if this could be dialed down a little in tough focusing situations people would be much happier with the camera.


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CyberDyneSystems
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Mar 06, 2015 09:34 |  #2066

NeilB0147 wrote in post #17462890 (external link)
So you now have a 7Dmk1 :rolleyes:


There are a lot of very good reasons to set the max frame rate below the max possible. I've been doing this since 2005 with the 1D2, then again with the 1D3 and 1D4.
Getting well focused images is just one reason to do this.



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CyberDyneSystems
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Mar 06, 2015 09:38 |  #2067

habenero wrote in post #17463112 (external link)
I would think pretty much, if this is really a recommended step to achieving sharp focus, this body certainly loses some of its appeal.


Are we expecting 10 FPS with 100% of the shots in focus?
Maybe the camera could do this (any Camera including the 1DX) IF the operator is skilled enough to maintain the AF point exactly where they want it during that spray and pray./ But frankly not many are. I've been shooting action with high frame rate cameras for a long time, and frankly 100% results is not possible in my hands. And I doubt any Camera could do it either.

There is a reason we call it spray and pray, it's because you pray that some will come out ok.

If 100% results is expected of anyone @ 10FPS, regardless of sill and practice to get such results, then the expectation is too high.



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NeilB0147
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Mar 06, 2015 09:52 |  #2068

I'm still calling "Not fit for purpose" on this, top marks to Canon though getting the general public too do the R&D for them ;-)a




  
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Mar 06, 2015 09:57 |  #2069

NeilB0147 wrote in post #17463253 (external link)
I'm still calling "Not fit for purpose" on this, top marks to Canon though getting the general public too do the R&D for them ;-)a

Good luck finding any camera from any company that does not have similar issues. Just about all camera releases have all types of complaints when they come out. Some of those issues are due to operator error, and some are due to camera issues. Even the 1D series have had issues at release, it happens.

Check the Nikon forums when a new camera comes out, you will see a lot of the same thing!


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RodS57
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Mar 06, 2015 10:16 |  #2070

Diver-Down wrote in post #17462583 (external link)
One thing that I've been playing with when using a slower focusing lens like the Tamron 150-600 in Ai Servo is to slow down the frame rate to give the camera/lens a chance to track between frames. Last time out I shot it at 6 fps and it seemed to do pretty well.

I did much the same. I left fast at 10 and pushed slow up to 5 and I usually have the camera in slow.

Rod


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7D Mark II - Focus Discussions
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