House Finch or Purple Finch - Let the Debate Begin!

I'm seeking "professional" help with this ID because I'm conflicted. I certainly know the history of these 2 species in my area, but I'm truly on the fence using these 4 available images to pin down a positive ID. Images 2 & 4 are simply tighter crops of images 1 & 3, respectively. I'd love to hear from others including why you might lean one way or the other.

1.

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Great captures Steve. I say Purple Finch. The beak is a little more dainty and with a straight culmen. The sides are mostly clear with the red wash and there is red on the feathers of the back as well as the rump. Also the color is more purple than red.

House Finches have a heavier beak with a curved culmen. The sides have some light dark brown streaking and lack the red color as far along the body as well as on the feathers of the wings and back.

Beautiful captures and I say purple finch.

I agree with 2n10. It's a Purple finch.

As well as the afore mentioned features, this bird has extensive red on head, back, wings and flank, consistent with a Purple Finch.
Also, it lacks any hint of the House Finch's grayish cheek or wing bars.
If it's a House finch, it's the weirder than any that I've seen.

Defiantly Purple Finch Steve, one of my fav's and I have none

Well the "jury" has spoken and although we only had an external jury of 5 I can add my vote and speak with 6 voices in finding this guy guilty of being a Purple Finch!

My history here runs about 10:1 House Finches to Purple Finches, although I've seen more female Purple Finches this year than the last 5 years combined. I find the females easy, but the position of this guy made me 2nd guess. These images represent the first time I've been able to document a Purple Finch and I hope to add the female later. Thanks for all your votes!

2n10 wrote in post #17400896
Great captures Steve. I say Purple Finch. The beak is a little more dainty and with a straight culmen. The sides are mostly clear with the red wash and there is red on the feathers of the back as well as the rump. Also the color is more purple than red.

House Finches have a heavier beak with a curved culmen. The sides have some light dark brown streaking and lack the red color as far along the body as well as on the feathers of the wings and back.

Sounds like you've almost memorized the field guide John
And thanks as always for your "vote".

butterfly2937 wrote in post #17400899
Beautiful captures and I say purple finch.

Always appreciated Carol; and thanks for your vote too!

Beekeeper wrote in post #17401181
I agree with 2n10. It's a Purple finch.

Much appreciated BeeKeeper! Your vote makes 3.

LIGHTRAE wrote in post #17401257
As well as the afore mentioned features, this bird has extensive red on head, back, wings and flank, consistent with a Purple Finch.
Also, it lacks any hint of the House Finch's grayish cheek or wing bars.
If it's a House finch, it's the weirder than any that I've seen.

Thanks Ralph! Your vote is appreciated too.

Pondrader wrote in post #17401398
Defiantly Purple Finch Steve, one of my fav's and I have none

It's a shame to have a fav and then have none Jeff! If I could share you know I would
Thanks for chiming in too.

I'm late to the party, but my vote was for Purple Finch too! More red than what you would see on a House Finch. Beautifully sharp photos Steve!

I'm late too but vote Purple Finch. I'm just going on recollection of looking them both up in a Nat Geo Birds of NA book last week while observing several " House Finches" at my East farm at a distance of 10 feet. My conclusion at the time was I seem to have the House Finch in decent numbers but do not recall seeing any that match the colors that are seen in these images posted.
I know they leave me confused and I'm never quite sure which one I'm observing, so welcome the answer of any experts with their definition on these images.

I think so too Purple Finch. Great shots.

I agree, its a Purple Finch.

Beautiful set, and I am going with Purple Finch.

Mike

Whatever it is , its a lovely looking bird that has been well captured.

SJC from VT wrote in post #17403408
I'm late to the party, but my vote was for Purple Finch too! More red than what you would see on a House Finch. Beautifully sharp photos Steve!

Haha Sandy, you know you can join in any time and it's always fun to have you. Your vote always counts in my book!

Grizz1 wrote in post #17403467
I'm late too but vote Purple Finch. I'm just going on recollection of looking them both up in a Nat Geo Birds of NA book last week while observing several " House Finches" at my East farm at a distance of 10 feet. My conclusion at the time was I seem to have the House Finch in decent numbers but do not recall seeing any that match the colors that are seen in these images posted.
I know they leave me confused and I'm never quite sure which one I'm observing, so welcome the answer of any experts with their definition on these images.

I believe the experts have spoken above Steve, and now we have one more voice in the Purple Finch camp.
My first look is the markings on the cheek w/the Purple Finch showing much more definitive almost "arrow" shaped look to the markings than a House Finch. If the breast is showing it's pretty easy from there, but this guy didn't make it that easy.

Peter2516 wrote in post #17403710
I think so too Purple Finch. Great shots.

Thank you Peter! You all are confirming my initial ID.

Nogo wrote in post #17403721
I agree, its a Purple Finch.

Thanks Nogo! Always glad to add more voices to the "diagnosis".

Pike40 wrote in post #17403817
Beautiful set, and I am going with Purple Finch.

Mike

Everyone seems to be fairly conclusive on this ID including you Mike. I appreciate the comments and opinions too.

Red Dexs wrote in post #17404145
Whatever it is , its a lovely looking bird that has been well captured.

C'mon Red, you're not covered up w/Purple Finches?
Thanks for the compliments.

OK Steve I am no expert. And there are some things I don't even try to get into, like purple vs house finch, sharp shinned vs cooper's hawk, and arguments with women . I'm just here to say I love the shots, whatever you decide them to be....sounds like Purple Finch