Keep a stiff upper lip?

Rejection is nothing new to me, both in life and in business. Having made the foray into professional photography (weddings and portraits) in the past year, I've prepared myself for the fact that I wont get all the shoots I would like to for various reasons.

One of those reasons cropped up recently and I can see this becoming a more regular occurrence in the genre's I tend to shoot. The "I have a friend who has offered to do it" reason.

Little bit of back story here: I did an engagement shoot for a couple who were known to me via family (the girls mother is good friends with my wife's mother). They weren't strangers to me. I found out that they missed out on getting any engagement photo's and I offered to take some for them. It was very impromptu and casual. I was hoping though for an offer to shoot their wedding but if not, all good.

Things were looking good as they asked me if I was available to shoot their wedding and gave me a date. There was no pressure on them to hire me at all at that point but I made it known that I was available on that date and we could discuss it when they were ready. I provided them their shots from the impromptu engagement shoot along with a business card and a price list of my various wedding packages. As they were family friends I offered to shoot my top package for a lower package price. My prices are competitive and certainly not exorbitant.

Fast forward a couple of months and I received a text message from the young lady thanking me for my time but that a friend has offered to shoot the wedding (I'm guessing for free). I decided it was best to keep my reply simple and polite and said it wasn't a problem and wished her all the best on her big day. Being a family friend though, means that I will see the shots eventually and know how they turned out.

Anyone else encountered the "friend with a camera offering to shoot my wedding" scenario before? Is it even worth doing a follow up here to try and talk her around? Or just be happy knowing that if she can't afford my already reasonable prices, I probably don't want the gig anyway.

First off there is nothing to "keep a stiff upper lip about".

You didn't get the gig and for whatever reason the potential client didn't see your work as having enough perceived value to them to warrant your prices. The harsh reality here is that is a "you" problem not a "them" problem. Either you're targeting the wrong market or you believe you are worth more than the market does.

Secondly you instantly, by offering a significant discount showed you don't value you work yourself... or at least you gave out that perception.

The engagement shoot you did for them... paid, full price? How did they "miss out" on getting engagement photos done? They had you do some (which I guess they paid for). You can only "miss out" on getting engagement photos done if you have had none done by the time the wedding date comes around. And to "miss out" in that regard would mean they either didn't book a session (which isn't missing out just not bothering to book one) or they couldn't afford one (which would suggest you did theirs for free or low cost... setting your value as nothing or next to nothing in the process).

Personally I wouldn't have bothered responding to the text. There was no need to. She wasn't a client, she hadn't booked. Trying to talk her around smacks of desperation and having to prove your worth to anyone shows a lack of perceived value.

Something you'll need to get used to in the industry is not everyone is meant to be your client. You have no idea whether she could afford your prices or not. Couples almost always find the money for things that they really value.

Look at it this way...

After doing an engagement shoot for a family friend and offering a large discount to shoot the wedding you still didn't get the booking... and lost out to someone who you believe will most likely be shooting that wedding for free. That speaks volumes about the perceived value you created (or rather lack of it) where even being a family friend, offering a discount and having already taken shots for the couple didn't sway them.

If I were in your shoes rather than "being happy knowing that if she can't afford my already reasonable prices" I'd be doing some self reflection.

...I was speaking to a good friend the other day who has been a photographer as long as me and is desperate to take this to the next level and make photography her sole income. I asked her a few questions about her business goals. She said that she had done four weddings last year, and that she was aiming to book six next year, and was going to spend this year booking those six.

After I pulled my jaw in off the floor, I proceeded to tell her that her goals were unrealistically low and that at those levels it would take decades to become full time. We talked some more and hopefully she is getting set on the right track.

So I come and read what you have written, and I have to wonder what sort of business plan you have put in place. How many weddings are you targeting that this rejection has any sort of impact on you? Remember this wasn't a booking. It was what I call a "tentative hold." I've got a few of those in my diary over the next year. Some convert, some do not. I simply get on with life.

You have no idea why she decided to go with someone else. It wouldn't hurt to ask her. But don't assume it was price. I don't shop on price and not everyone is looking to get the best deal. She simply might not like your style and likes someone else's more. If your gear list is accurate you don't have back up equipment. People are fickle. I bought my first DSLR based on the sound it made. How fickle is that? Are you really that desperate that you need to try and talk her around? There are plenty of potential wedding clients out there.

You need a business plan in place, and you need to set targets. You need to learn how to close the deal. You also need to learn not to take things personally. Business can be rough. It will most certainly get a lot rougher than this.

This isn't a "friend with a camera offering to shoot my wedding" scenario. This is a potential client has chosen to go with another photographer scenario. Say a few swearwords. Go for a run. Punch a punching bag. These things happen. Time to move on.

Happens all the time. Here's a recent exchange to someone who wanted a family portrait. Their rejection and my response.


"I have found a couple Photographers more in the budget I need to stay in at this time . Thanks so much. Best"

"I understand. As with any professional service, there are several very good photographers in this community. Our pricing and product, however, is quite different than that of the budget photographers. Sorry my value is not in line with your budget. Let me know if I might be of service to you in the future. Thank you for your consideration."


Notice I made a distinction between "professional" and "budget photographer". I also suggested that there is value in paying for a better product. That's something that may get me the nod for a future shoot, especially if they are disappointed with the results of their decision. If they are unable to see the difference and are delighted with "good enough" then they aren't my client anyway. You can't sell quality to those who can't see it. Of course, If they do contact me in the future, or refer me to someone else, It's with the status of a "professional" worth spending the extra money for.

Thinking about this part of what you wrote:

BarrySpug wrote in post #17401979
I was hoping though for an offer to shoot their wedding but if not, all good.

It doesn't sound like "all good" now, not emotionally. I'm not clear on why you label the couple's decision a rejection. They never committed to hiring you, it was only something you were hoping for. Because the situation was competitive, not getting the gig was possible all along. The bride was courteous enough to let you know, and that counts for something.

Reframing the outcome as something other than a rejection may make it less distressing.

I must be reading something completely different than what you guys are reading.

He was told that a friend had offered to shoot the wedding which is why his offer was declined. he asked if this has happened to anyone else. he even said that it wouldn't be any skin off his back if he didn't get the gig. I think perhaps you guys are reading more into his thread title than the actual substance he posted.

To me he was relaying a story which is happening with more frequency "I have a friend willing to do it" and wanted to share an experience and also find out if others hear this often. He also wanted to get an opinion on whether or not to shoot this girl another message and make sure the friend is up to capturig her memorable day.

I certainly don't see anything regarding the need for a business plan or the inability to hanle a rejection of services.

memoriesoftomorrow wrote in post #17402017
First off there is nothing to "keep a stiff upper lip about".

You didn't get the gig and for whatever reason the potential client didn't see your work as having enough perceived value to them to warrant your prices. The harsh reality here is that is a "you" problem not a "them" problem. Either you're targeting the wrong market or you believe you are worth more than the market does.

Secondly you instantly, by offering a significant discount showed you don't value you work yourself... or at least you gave out that perception.

The engagement shoot you did for them... paid, full price? How did they "miss out" on getting engagement photos done? They had you do some (which I guess they paid for). You can only "miss out" on getting engagement photos done if you have had none done by the time the wedding date comes around. And to "miss out" in that regard would mean they either didn't book a session (which isn't missing out just not bothering to book one) or they couldn't afford one (which would suggest you did theirs for free or low cost... setting your value as nothing or next to nothing in the process).

Personally I wouldn't have bothered responding to the text. There was no need to. She wasn't a client, she hadn't booked. Trying to talk her around smacks of desperation and having to prove your worth to anyone shows a lack of perceived value.

Something you'll need to get used to in the industry is not everyone is meant to be your client. You have no idea whether she could afford your prices or not. Couples almost always find the money for things that they really value.

Look at it this way...

After doing an engagement shoot for a family friend and offering a large discount to shoot the wedding you still didn't get the booking... and lost out to someone who you believe will most likely be shooting that wedding for free. That speaks volumes about the perceived value you created (or rather lack of it) where even being a family friend, offering a discount and having already taken shots for the couple didn't sway them.

If I were in your shoes rather than "being happy knowing that if she can't afford my already reasonable prices" I'd be doing some self reflection.

Some people simply don't want to pay a lot for a photographer. A salesman can try and sell me a Mercedes all day long but I don't want a Mercedes - I want a Honda. It doesn't mean the Mercedes is not valuable, nice, professional or very good at what it does. It just isn't want I want.

Much the same - some people just want photos that are exposed right and that is pretty much it. They just don't care for all the other stuff. Sadly pretty much anyone with a t3 and kit lens can do that.

mikeinctown wrote in post #17405479
I must be reading something completely different than what you guys are reading.

He was told that a friend had offered to shoot the wedding which is why his offer was declined. he asked if this has happened to anyone else. he even said that it wouldn't be any skin off his back if he didn't get the gig. I think perhaps you guys are reading more into his thread title than the actual substance he posted. . . .

I certainly don't see anything regarding the need for a business plan or the inability to hanle a rejection of services.

The cues for my interpretation that the OP was upset were his "stiff upper lip" title and his opening line, "Rejection is nothing new to me, both in life and in business." These suggested that he groups missing out on a gig with disappointments of a more personal nature as the same kind of thing.

As a full time professional photographer, I already know that my conversion rate of inquiries to completed shoots is about 30% no matter how eager they seem at first contact. You should develop a consistent sales process, require a deposit for confirming schedule, and be fully aware that most will not complete the shoot.

Best of Luck-
Scott

Firstly, thanks for everyone who as replied. Perhaps I chose my words badly when I created this thread which have led to some of the replies along the lines that I am in some way pissed at not getting this shoot.

In no way am I upset about missing out. Yes, there was a rejection of my services but I certainly didn't take it to heart either emotionally or in a business sense. As many of you have said - I had no formal agreement with the girl to shoot her wedding so I certainly can't and won't worry about not getting the shoot.

My main question, as a couple of you have already hit on, is how often are you seeing your services being passed on and going to people offering to shoot for free (such as relatives of the clients etc)? This was the first time it happened to me so I was curious if anyone else had experienced this.

BarrySpug wrote in post #17411189
My main question, as a couple of you have already hit on, is how often are you seeing your services being passed on and going to people offering to shoot for free (such as relatives of the clients etc)? This was the first time it happened to me so I was curious if anyone else had experienced this.

It is much, much more likely to happen to you at the bottom end of the market.

I've had it happen once. The sister of a bride (whose wedding I shot) opted for a friend over me despite liking my work and knowing what I did etc. Fast forward a good few months and the friend backed out and they came back to me, by that time their date had gone.

I don't worry about it though. If people don't book with me they weren't meant to in the first place.

Like I said; happens all the time. We're all guilty of it. How often have we helped a friend or relative with DIY improvement projects around the home or garden instead of them bringing in a professional because they feel we have some degree of familiarity or confidence about the task and they'd rather not spend the money? The "how hard could it really be" mentality kicks in, right? To nondiscerning eyes the end result is "just fine". So many people are perfectly happy with "good enough" results. It's even worse in the so called non-essential/creative fields. Who has helped someone decorate their home for free? After all, who's got the money to hire an interior designer? How high is that on one's priority list? How hard is it to pick out furniture paint, carpet, drapes? In a world of "good enough" and "just fine" non-essential professionals have to convince customers the value of excellence. Not an easy task for the bottom end market and the top end market is not particularly large. That's what makes this business challenging. To do well, you must be very good and market to customers who can see that.

BarrySpug wrote in post #17411189
Firstly, thanks for everyone who as replied. Perhaps I chose my words badly when I created this thread which have led to some of the replies along the lines that I am in some way pissed at not getting this shoot.

In no way am I upset about missing out. Yes, there was a rejection of my services but I certainly didn't take it to heart either emotionally or in a business sense. As many of you have said - I had no formal agreement with the girl to shoot her wedding so I certainly can't and won't worry about not getting the shoot.

My main question, as a couple of you have already hit on, is how often are you seeing your services being passed on and going to people offering to shoot for free (such as relatives of the clients etc)? This was the first time it happened to me so I was curious if anyone else had experienced this.

Barry,

Someone in an earlier reply asked if you had shot the engagement for free. When I saw that you checked back in to the thread, I was eager to see your answer to that question. But, when I read your post I did not see any mention of the terms under which you shot the engagement. So, could you please answer the question, "How much did you charge to do the engagement shoot?"

I was ask to photograph a Sweet 16, then they backed out because their friend would do it with an "iPhone."

I told them, "good luck."

They would not make good clients. Glad I didn't do it.

Old thread, but I'm kind of in the same place...
This year I've really decided to 'go for it', so I'm doing everything I can to shoot a lot more (have only around 8000 captures in the three years since I bought my first DSLR). Obviously I've been shooting for free.
A couple of weeks ago, I got an account with Model Mayhem, hoping to get more chances to shoot. Already have a few shots booked. With one of the models the conversation has gone really good; she mentioned my style and how she loved the soft look of my poses. A few messages after, she told me that her boyfriend (now I know that is fiancée) was also excited about getting photographed together, and, out of the blue she mentions they will be getting married in about 6 months.
In one of the messages, where we were trying to come up with a location for the shoot, as they live relatively far from where I do, I've slipped a line wondering if they would be getting married there, assuming someone will be shooting their wedding they would already have photos in that location. The answer never mentioned a Wedding Photographer, only that the location isn't the same.
So, yeah, I'm also hoping that they like my work enough to ask me to shoot their wedding... If not, at least I'll have some nice images to possibly upgrade my portfolio, which was the intention in the first place...