Disappearing PS edits. Driving me mad.

Hopefully some of you PS experts out there can help me with this one. I'll explain in detail what I'm doing below but the end result is that when I merge visible layers, flatten the image or save back to Lightroom my PS edits disappear. Here is where I'm noticing this.

- I take a night shot that includes stars, import to Lightroom and do basic edits.
- Export to PS CS6 for editing (to boost the stars).
- I select the star by using select-color range and then clicking on a star with the sample tool.
- Duplicate the selection to a layer.
- Change the blending mode to Screen.
- Duplicate that layer as many times as needed to achieve the look I want.
- Group the layers, add a layer mask and brush out the effect where desired.

Up to this point everything is good but as soon as I merge, flatten or save back to Lightroom the effects of my layers immediately disappear. Can anyone clue me in as to why this is happening?

Thanks for reading!!

Let's talk about flattening first. What we need to know is, do the edits still "disappear" if you're viewing at 100% when you flatten?

Assuming that you move from the RAW file in LR to PS using the Edit in PS command, are you simply saving the PSD/TIFF file (depending on your preferences) by using the Save command (Ctrl+S) or are you doing a Save As? If you are doing a Save As the file that is created will not be auto-imported and stacked with the original RAW file in LR. You must use Save to see the resulting PSD/TIFF file in LR along with the RAW file.

Personally I do not flatten the image in PS, I know that it can make a huge difference in file size, but I treat the PSD files from PS as being a "work in progress" So I keep all my layers intact so that I can go back and make changes should they be necessary. If I get a stage in the process where it suggests flattening the layer stack for the next stage I use I think it's called Stamp Visible Layers, using the Ctrl+Shift+Alt+E command. This produces a new layer comprised of all current visible layers. You can then use this layer, for doing things like High Pass sharpening. I have seen tutorials on HP sharpening, where it is suggested to flatten, then duplicate the flattened layer to use for the HP Sharpen. Using Stamp Visible layers allows you to do the HP Sharpen on the top of the existing stack.

I suggest that you try a Stamp Visible Layers at the top of your layer stack, and see if it keeps the image looking the same. If it has worked correctly, you should see no change in the visible image just the new layer in the layers pallet. This will at least tell you that you can indeed combine all of those layers successfully. If Stamp Visible works for you I do not know why flatten would not also work correctly, but at least you would have a work around while you figure out the problem with flatten. After all Flatten just seems to do a Stamp Visible followed by deleting all the lower layers.

Alan

Thanks so much for the replies so far. Please see my responses below.

Damo77 wrote in post #17524467
Let's talk about flattening first. What we need to know is, do the edits still "disappear" if you're viewing at 100% when you flatten?

This happens regardless of viewing magnification.

BigAl007 wrote in post #17524692
Assuming that you move from the RAW file in LR to PS using the Edit in PS command, are you simply saving the PSD/TIFF file (depending on your preferences) by using the Save command (Ctrl+S) or are you doing a Save As? If you are doing a Save As the file that is created will not be auto-imported and stacked with the original RAW file in LR. You must use Save to see the resulting PSD/TIFF file in LR along with the RAW file.

Thanks Alan. When I originally noticed this I was just closing PS and letting the default save/import back to Lightroom happen without merging/flattening first and yes, the TIFF was stacked with the original. So, just closing and accepting the save dialogue box. I started doing a keyboard shortcut save in PS to test things out and then tried exporting the image from PS to a Jpeg file outside of LR to see if it made a difference (which it didn't). That is when I noticed that merging/flattening inside PS was causing the changes to disappear. So to recap, I can make my edits then merge or flatten and the changes disappear. I hit the undo shortcut...edits reappear. I use the TIFF format when using PS as LRs external editor. I assume the image gets flattened upon save/close. I'd like to point out that this is only happening in this scenario. My external editing works as one would expect otherwise.

BigAl007 wrote in post #17524692
Personally I do not flatten the image in PS, I know that it can make a huge difference in file size, but I treat the PSD files from PS as being a "work in progress" So I keep all my layers intact so that I can go back and make changes should they be necessary. If I get a stage in the process where it suggests flattening the layer stack for the next stage I use I think it's called Stamp Visible Layers, using the Ctrl+Shift+Alt+E command. This produces a new layer comprised of all current visible layers. You can then use this layer, for doing things like High Pass sharpening. I have seen tutorials on HP sharpening, where it is suggested to flatten, then duplicate the flattened layer to use for the HP Sharpen. Using Stamp Visible layers allows you to do the HP Sharpen on the top of the existing stack.

I suggest that you try a Stamp Visible Layers at the top of your layer stack, and see if it keeps the image looking the same. If it has worked correctly, you should see no change in the visible image just the new layer in the layers pallet. This will at least tell you that you can indeed combine all of those layers successfully. If Stamp Visible works for you I do not know why flatten would not also work correctly, but at least you would have a work around while you figure out the problem with flatten. After all Flatten just seems to do a Stamp Visible followed by deleting all the lower layers.

Alan

Just tried a stamp visible and... poof. Edits gone. Ever feel like you're going completely mad?

I've no idea about the flattening issue, or the Stamp Visible layers. Have you tried doing a Save As as a JPEG file without flattening first? PS will now automatically flatten when doing a Save As JPEG, without affecting the original image, it even does the convert from 16 bit to 8 bit if necessary too. I'm just trying to think of all the possible ways you can flatten an image.

When you do the default save in PS back to LR, PS will save all of the layers currently in the file, including those that are hidden. Personally I prefer to keep the layers in my master copies in LR, so that I can go back to them. Storage is cheap enough to do that with now. It's not like I have to send every image to PS anymore, about 98% just stay in LR as RAw files. That's also why I do all my final exports from LR, as that way I only have to finished files on my hard drive for as long as it takes me to send them to wherever they are going, and LR manages my uploads to Flickr and FB automatically anyway.

Alan

Tanks for chiming in again Alan. Yes, I've tried the save to JPEG without flattening. Same result.

Can you post two screenshots for us, before and after, to show us?

Sure. Here are some screenshots that I just took. Just simple snaps from the back yard for the purpose of troubleshooting this (lots of light pollution) but you'll get the picture. In the first shot you'll see the background layer with the group containing my star enhancements (visible) and the second shot shows the image after flattening and the enhancements no longer visible.

What happens if you do the following:

1) LR > PS
2) Duplicate background to a layer (CMD-J).
3) Set this new layer to screen.
4) Duplicate the new layer as needed (CMD-J) to get the star brightness you need.
5) Group all of the star boost layers together.
6) Make a layer mask for the group, but OPT-Click on the new mask button to make the new mask filled with black (hide the effect of the group).
7) Paint with white on mask to reveal boosted stars in the group.

Flatten.

Any different?

kirk

I had something along this line happen (quite a while ago, so might remember wrong) and found that once I closed LR and opened it again the changes where reflected on the TIFF file. This was probably in LR4 or before and might have been some other issue all together, but worth a try? Otherwise I'd check the Adobe support forums or post there. Good luck!

Thanks! And may we have the same pair of screenshots, but at 100%?

kirkt wrote in post #17525438
What happens if you do the following:

1) LR > PS
2) Duplicate background to a layer (CMD-J).
3) Set this new layer to screen.
4) Duplicate the new layer as needed (CMD-J) to get the star brightness you need.
5) Group all of the star boost layers together.
6) Make a layer mask for the group, but OPT-Click on the new mask button to make the new mask filled with black (hide the effect of the group).
7) Paint with white on mask to reveal boosted stars in the group.

Flatten.

Any different?

kirk

Thanks Kirk. I just gave this a try with the exact same results. As soon as I flatten or merge visible my edits disappear.

Damo77 wrote in post #17525515
Thanks! And may we have the same pair of screenshots, but at 100%?

Sure Damien. As soon as I get a chance I'll produce another copy with the edits even more exaggerated. May I ask what it is you hope to see with a 100% crop?

Are the edits disappearing within PS or when viewing in LR? What happens is when editing/saving, LR takes a little to load new data. Might not be your case. Certainly sounds strange.

Tony_Stark wrote in post #17525707
Are the edits disappearing within PS or when viewing in LR? What happens is when editing/saving, LR takes a little to load new data. Might not be your case. Certainly sounds strange.

This is happening in PS as soon as I flatten or merge. It also happens when I save to LR with or without merging/flattening prior to the save. It can take a bit for the edits to propagate to LR but unfortunately that isn't the case. They just aren't there.