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Thread started 27 Jun 2015 (Saturday) 10:02
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Grey Card issue

 
Dj ­ Silver
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Jun 27, 2015 10:02 |  #1

I've just started using a grey card in an attempt to get my white balance as accurate as possible, however I'm having issues.

Here is a shot of one I took. I take them with camera settings I will use to shoot on the day. Here I used AV mode, f/7.1, ISO 320 @ 1/800.

From what I've read and viewed on Youtube the grey 'reading' in Lightroom using the eyedropper should be around 18, my reading was 42.

Does anybody know where I'm going wrong please?

Cheers

Simon.

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PhotosGuy
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Jun 27, 2015 10:48 |  #2

I don't know that you're "going wrong". You can WB from any neutral source. It doesn't matter if it's gray at RGB 156, 156, 156, black at RGB 40, 40, 40, or a non-blown white at RGB 250, 250, 250.
Grey Card who uses one and which one ??

I usually use a Custom WB just to get close as I'll change the WB on an image to whatever looks good to me, which is usually just a bit on the warm side. Like #2 here: https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1431862


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GeoKras1989
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Post edited over 8 years ago by GeoKras1989.
     
Jun 27, 2015 11:10 |  #3
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Really, you can use anything even close to white for setting Custom White Balance. I keep an 18% grey card in my bag. Problem? I don't often carry the bag. Solution. White table napkin. White notebook paper. White tablecloth. White menu. White ceiling. White printer paper. White just about anything. If I can fill most of the frame with it, I'll take a shot and set CWB. If not, a raw shot with a bit of white in it can be used in LR to set WB on any number of frames.

Not sure of your problem, but my guess is that you are confusing White Balance and exposure. They are two completely unrelated entities. WB accounts for the mixture of different colors of light. Exposure accounts for the amount of light.


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Jun 27, 2015 11:24 |  #4

To expand on what GeoKras said... the shot you posted is underexposed if your intention was to reproduce the 18% card. It's a tool that can be used to gauge your exposure under different conditions from scene to scene or within the same scene, in addition to setting white balance, which your WB is fine.


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Jun 27, 2015 11:53 |  #5

"18" means 18% reflectance not an RGB reading of 18, 18, 18. I know Lightroom uses R, G, B percent readout, but Lightroom also makes auto ranging adjustments to your exposure and tone curve, so Lightroom's color readouts are pretty much useless. In this case, you are using your gray target not just for setting a neutral white balance, but also for setting exposure.

If your gray card is really 18% reflectance, then this might correspond to middle gray in an RGB color system of around low to mid 100's in the RGB readout in your editor (R, G, B = 118, 118, 118 to about 126, 126, 126 or so). That number will depend upon the working color space you are using.

If you do not know what all of this means, just click on the gray card with a WB dropper or sampler and don't worry about it. Just slide the sliders and read up on the subject when you have the time. You might also go to the website of the gray target manufacturer (Lastolite or who ever made that target) and see if they have a tutorial that explains how to use their target. It really is almost irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Or ask your friend to elaborate. The problem with using white paper and all that is that some things that are "white" contain optical brightening agents that make them look bright white (but actually make them blu-ish), so your white balance off of them becomes warmer than neutral, which, again in the grand scheme of things, is probably fine.

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Redcrown
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Jun 27, 2015 12:20 |  #6

Kitkt explained that the 18 (percent) number you read is about exposure, not white balance.

Unfortunately, others have given you some bad advice. Many common "neutral" objects are not really neutral and will give you errors if used for white balance. Most things like "white" clothing, paper, etc., have optical brighteners added and a camera will see them as blue. Same for things that appear black or gray. They may be yellow, they may be blue, they are rarely neutral.

However, the error when using these objects may be insignificant, so they are better than nothing when nothing else is available.

Exposure of a "neutral" target also impacts white balance. The closer the target is to a "middle" exposure the better. When you fill the frame with your gray card, the histogram should spike in the center. If not dead center, at least somewhere in the middle third.

Try this experiment: Gather up a bunch of neutral objects (so called white things, black things, gray things). Lay them out in good light along with your true gray card. Make several shots at a wide range of exposures. Bring those shots into your processor and "white balance" them, using different objects and different exposures.

Note the wide range of results you get. Balance one shot using your gray card at middle exposure, then sample the RGB values of the other objects. Are any of them really "neutral".

P.S. If anybody finds a white ceiling that is truly white, call Guinness World Records and report it.




  
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Dj ­ Silver
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Jun 27, 2015 12:39 |  #7

Wow, thanks one and all.

I thought it would be easy ..... Point and shoot at the grey card and all is solved! :lol:

All great stuff, I think I'll start with Redcrown's suggestions, it'll will be interesting.


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John ­ Sheehy
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Jun 27, 2015 13:05 |  #8

Redcrown wrote in post #17612366 (external link)
Try this experiment: Gather up a bunch of neutral objects (so called white things, black things, gray things). Lay them out in good light along with your true gray card. Make several shots at a wide range of exposures. Bring those shots into your processor and "white balance" them, using different objects and different exposures.

Note the wide range of results you get. Balance one shot using your gray card at middle exposure, then sample the RGB values of the other objects. Are any of them really "neutral".

If you want to easily see the color offsets in an exaggerated form, you can crank up the saturation slider; just remember that it is exaggerated.




  
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