600d lenz help

Greetings
I am new to this forum and to photography,
I need some assistance please
Need to take photos without flash for live music gigs, smallish venue 100 to 200 people , few people playing on stage, very low different coloured lights flashing here and there
No flash allowed.
was advised to get a 50mm f 1.8.. works like a dream , however am limited to angle, and zoom due to restricted movement of my feet,( cannot get up close on stage to get the drummer and base player ect)
was then advised to get a 18 to 250, works ok but then only has a 3.5 f stop, so am stuck again with blurry shots, now have been advised to get a tamron 17 to 50 fixed 2.8 f stop, i read that there are two versions on this the vc and no vc, i read further there is a sigma 17 to 50 as well with a fixed 2.8 f stop
another forum says i should get the cannon ef - s 17 to 55 fixed 2.8 f stop
Please note that this is all for only low light any help and advise will be greatly appreciated
thank you

Your shots with a 50mm f/1.8 you like but you are considering a lens at f/3.5 and another at f/2.8. These are not huge differences in light gathering ability. What ISO are you using? Any ability to go to the slower lenses but bump the ISO up?

John thank you
yes the 50 mm 1.8 is good in low light, however i am restricted as no zoom and no wide angle
i was told to buy a 18 to 250 sigma which i did, this does not work well in low light for dark venues
i am now told to but the Tamron 17 to 50mm with a fixed stop of 2.8 or the sigma/ canon with fixed 2.8 f stops
really need help with low light advise
sir, what lenz would advise to get, this is specifically for low light music gigs with no flash
your assistance and advise will be greatly appreciated
thank you kindly
regards

In order to best accomplish your chosen task, you need a full frame camera and some fast (low-aperture number) prime lenses. The f/6.3 zoom was, honestly, a waste of money for this job.

The drawback to this solution is the expense. You can go with f/2.8 zooms, but f/2.8 is slower than the 50 1.8 you already have. Two ways to go, all used prices/guesses:

Camera - 6D, $1,000 (may be able to get 5D MK II for less, 6D is better in poor light)

Zooms (both f/2.8, which is likely too slow for your job)
24-70 II, $1200
70-200 II $1200
Total, Camera and zooms: $3,400

Primes
28 1.8, $350
50 1.4 (focus challenged in poor light), $300
85 1.8, $300
100 2, $350
135L, $800
200 2.8LII $500
Pick a few lenses to start with. Say 28, 85, 135.
Total, camera and primes: $2450.

If that is too expensive, consider just using the prime lenses on your current camera. Don't be afraid of ISO. It is the only other tool you have.

Chevy wrote in post #17761715
John thank you
yes the 50 mm 1.8 is good in low light, however i am restricted as no zoom and no wide angle
i was told to buy a 18 to 250 sigma which i did, this does not work well in low light for dark venues
i am now told to but the Tamron 17 to 50mm with a fixed stop of 2.8 or the sigma/ canon with fixed 2.8 f stops
really need help with low light advise
sir, what lenz would advise to get, this is specifically for low light music gigs with no flash
your assistance and advise will be greatly appreciated
thank you kindly
regards

I'll ask again, what ISO are you using? As you point out, the 18-250 and the Tamron 17-50 are slower lenses but often times you can get by with a slower lens by bumping up the ISO. Sometimes you sacrifice image quality, but very often this is a path worth considering.

I use the Sigma 17-50 mm f/2.8 and find it covers 90% of what I do, but that is just me. It probably would not work well for concerts like you describe. The 18-250 would likely work well, but I would suggest that whatever lens you chose, get one with with image stabilization.

I would like to know what ISO as well, and if you had a sample CR2 file you could share. I am sure we could help you get another stop of ISO out of your images by tweaking some settings, and providing some helpful tips on tools and technique to clean up your images.

I have a thread out there somewhere on how to get the best out of high ISO images on the 7D that would be pertinent to the 600D.

I've seen that thread. It has 'mini-review' in the title. Should be easy enough to find. Great stuff, by the way.

Ah, found it...

https://photography-on-the.net …read.php?t=1079​217&page=1

Bassat wrote in post #17762047
I've seen that thread. It has 'mini-review' in the title. Should be easy enough to find. Great stuff, by the way.

Could be the thread at https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1079217.

The point here we are trying to determine is if you are shooting at ISO 200 or 400 you can bump that to 800 or 1600 and likely get some good images with one of the slower alternative lenses you are considering. I think in your instance you are locked into two main variables, the focal length needed to accomplish the task, and the price of the lens you can afford. The image stabilization is recommended because this too is essentially allowing you to shoot with the slower lens.

get the canon 85 1.8

I have shot plenty in poorly lit clubs and can say that the Tamron 17-50 2.8 non-VC is not a good lens for this application. However, if you could hit ISO 3200-6400 with little/acceptable noise it might be a different story. You are still left with not so great focusing … yes the Tamron focuses fine in nice light, but not in weirdly lit club light. I would avoid it and probably the VC version too.

you will want your lenses to be at least 2.8. I don't even bring my 24-105 f/4 unless it is a daytime event or I know for sure that the light will be good (rare).

back to the 85mm. Just get it. It was the first lens I added to my digital XSi/450D kit, and the first time i used it was in a poorly lit club. I immediately knew it was the right choice and have used it time and time again, It is always in my bag when going to a show. Going on 6 years of use now.

I understand the desire to have a wide lens, but IMO it is really kind of a specialty thing, and 17mm on a crop is really not that wide. The Rokinon/Samyang 14 and the 85mm along with your 50 would make a great combo.

finally, i understand how hard it can be to move around but i find that shooting from the fringes provides great, unique angles and also let you include the scene which often makes for a better pic. Here's a pic from my first night out with my 85mm and XSi. It is probably a little dark but it was processed before i did any calibration work on my monitor. Southern Culture on the Skids from the back of the room, camera held overhead.


edit: not sure why POTN isn't letting me hotlink to my own server, here's the link.
edit 2: seems deleting it and re-adding it fixed the hotlink.

IS?

I very rarely shoot under 1/160 for musicians, hopefully 1/200. IS doesn't come into play at shorter focal lengths, once you get up to shooting at 150-200mm it starts to become more important depending on your shooting style and environment.

What aperture and iso do you use shooting at 1/200 in a club? Typically speaking...

Frodge wrote in post #17762165
What aperture and iso do you use shooting at 1/200 in a club? Typically speaking...

800-3200 ISO
f/1.4 -2.8

1.4 is with my Sigma 35mm
depending on what I'm doing, 1.8 is often too shallow with the 85mm, I like it between 2 and 2.8 more often than not.

Thanks a lot. Sorry for all the questions, what body do you use for this type of shooting....

Frodge wrote in post #17762193
Thanks a lot. Sorry for all the questions, what body do you use for this type of shooting....

no problem..
XSi has been retired to back up status, 6D is what i use exclusively, now.

i would love to keep it at ISO 1600 but I feel like getting the SS up is usually more important than a little noise.