Official specs: Canon EOS-1D X Mark II

David Arbogast wrote in post #17908441
It would be "groovy" if I could be a bit clearer regarding what I would prefer (ergonomically). On the back of the camera there is a groove built right into the body for your thumb, yet the available buttons for bb focus are all to the right of that ergonomic groove. I want a button aligned with the groove at my thumb tip...so I can continuously keep my thumb in the groove where Canon designed it to be.

I rarely use autofocus, but what you're saying makes sense. I do have the joystick on my 5d2 set to choose focus points and i use that relatively frequently. If you're going to have a back focus, it seems like it would work well if it where in that area somewhere.

Having a handstrap on my cameras allows me to more easily hit any button on the back with the right hand, without risk of dropping the camera, etc. Not sure if that helps others, but I have long since gotten over where the AF ON button is, but then I have had several years to acclimate.

In my personal experience, my handstrap always got in the way of back button af (Nikon three-contact-point, camdapter and Canon hand straps). That said, I don't ever BBAF nowadays since focus and recompose and focus lock don't really work well with f/1.2 lenses that I'm using more frequently nowadays. With sport at f/2.8 and f/3.2, it's a lot more doable and even advisable.

David Arbogast wrote in post #17908441
It would be "groovy" if I could be a bit clearer regarding what I would prefer (ergonomically). On the back of the camera there is a groove built right into the body for your thumb, yet the available buttons for bb focus are all to the right of that ergonomic groove. I want a button aligned with the groove at my thumb tip...so I can continuously keep my thumb in the groove where Canon designed it to be.

David,

Have you ever learned to heal-toe downshift on a standard car? Heal-toe is a bit of a misnomer because most heal toers actually don't use their heal at all but use the left side of the ball of their right foot for the brake pedal (on the right edge of the brake pedal) and the right side of ball of the right foot for the throttle. I did the racing car thing for many years and it is an adjustment at first but once you learn, it is actually a blind like touch thing whereby you learn to feel both the brake and the throttle at the same time through your right racing shoe sole - and here is the key point, you use that feeling when you are on the brakes to feel the throttle at the same time - i.e. you know where it is.

If you now pick up your Canon 5DSR and put your thumb in the grove that you mentioned, if you have a normal man sized hand, the right quarter of your right thumb will actually be on the AF-ON button (this is the racing heal toe analogy I was trying to make above). When I pick up my camera, my immediate goto default position is:
- right thumb immediately on the AF-ON button
- finger on shutter
- right ring finger tip on the DoF button

That is how I hold the camera all the time - it is only when I have to goto my second AI-Servo button, the *, that it feels like I am reaching into the unknown a little - and that is only because I don't shoot as much wildlife as I shoot people so it is a 5% button for me.

The button that did take a little more work in my setup was the DoF button to get comfortable forming a grip that encompassed this button. As I took a lot of golf lessons and gave them as well, I can tell you that changing your grip is the hardest thing to do period - it screws with your mind and makes you lose confidence because your feel is gone and it feels alien. But now that I have 100% comfort with this setup, it allows me to press the DoF button and bring up all 65pts for auto focus if I need them.

I love the Canon ergonomics and that is why I just can't do Nikon and I struggle with the A7Rii to commit 100% - things are just too sensitive and you get them wrong and the wrong thing is happening. If the 1Dx II sensor is Sony like, which appears to be the case, Canon is going to be selling a lot of Cameras in 2017.

Great points Paul...gonna commit to developing the muscle memory so it begins to feel as natural as TeamSpeed mentioned as well.

Can't agree more about Canon ergonomics in general. Picking up any Canon DSLR, including the 1DX (feebly trying to stay on topic ), is a total pleasure for me compared to the Nikon and Sony bodies I have owned.

David Arbogast wrote in post #17908621
(feebly trying to stay on topic )

lol

Funny thing is now that I think of it, I use back button focus a lot more for landscape and travel and not for weddings these days. So I guess BBF is great for what you shoot. I think it's funny because I shot sports and landscapes using the same af setup. Who would've thunk it.

wallstreetoneil wrote in post #17908613
Have you ever learned to heal-toe downshift on a standard car? Heal-toe is a bit of a misnomer because most heal toers actually don't use their heal at all but use the left side of the ball of their right foot for the brake pedal (on the right edge of the brake pedal) and the right side of ball of the right foot for the throttle. I did the racing car thing for many years and it is an adjustment at first but once you learn, it is actually a blind like touch thing whereby you learn to feel both the brake and the throttle at the same time through your right racing shoe sole - and here is the key point, you use that feeling when you are on the brakes to feel the throttle at the same time - i.e. you know where it is.

i actually do use "true" toe-heel... balls of feet on brakes, my heal on the bottom of gas. i'm 5'11", size 11 shoes. before i got my current daily, which regrettably has a lam-o double clutch, this used to be every turn, every stop light, every slow down in traffic, and of course on the track. .....and i too hate the positioning of that all-important button on my camera. my thumb always slips and i lose the focus position. i would offer a huge hug to the canon engineer who finally makes that damn button bigger and farther from the other buttons.

Xyclopx wrote in post #17908643
i actually do use "true" toe-heel... balls of feet on brakes, my heal on the bottom of gas.

Likewise, or very close to it! I've used the side of the foot thing too, but just enough to be scary...my foot would slip off. Not a big deal when practicing around town in the beginning, but a VERY big deal coming into a curve at the limit.

David Arbogast wrote in post #17908621
Great points Paul...gonna commit to developing the muscle memory so it begins to feel as natural as TeamSpeed mentioned as well.

Can't agree more about Canon ergonomics in general. Picking up any Canon DSLR, including the 1DX (feebly trying to stay on topic ), is a total pleasure for me compared to the Nikon and Sony bodies I have owned.

Im anxious to see how its going to feel with that Thumb cut out on the front.

Not a fan of hand straps.

I have crashed and burned soooo many times. I want it around my neck.

From a guy who fell in a lake and managed to keep his 5D3 and 35L out of the water. Had to change my pant and shoes. But the camera did not get wet. So dam embarrassing at the time. good thing it was Hot as all get out. Everyone got a chuckle out of it.

umphotography wrote in post #17908367
I was also talking to a lady who shoots wildlife with a 500F/4 and she puts an extension tube on the darn thing to get around some of the restrictions. .

Are you talking about restrictions re: AF with T-cons or restrictions re. MFD?
Because the latter is very common practice among birders.

I wish I ever had the problem of the birds being too close

David Arbogast wrote in post #17908391
The AF lock button on the back (5DS R) is probably the best positioned button for me. I just need to train myself to use it and get over my discomfort.

Even the a7r2 back button is placed perfectly!

On the 1DX, the AF-ON button is exactly where my thumb rests when I hold the camera normally. Perfect ergonomics for me. Just push the thumb down to press it.

umphotography wrote in post #17908367
...just a great lens to 400MM. 600MM is a new ballgame.

I understand what you mean, but since a forum is all about learning things, let me just point out that it's 400 mm and 600 mm. Nothing else. Different case means different things in the SI system, so 400 MM is four hundred mega-mega, not four hundred millimeters.
Just like 60 kph is sixty kilo-pico-hours, equal to sixty nanohours or 216 microseconds. It's 60 km/h, nothing else.

I know this is off topic. And we all understand anyway. I'm not nitpicking, just educating.

^^^
Above my pay grade

Pay grades wont matter in another year. Enjoy life now
famous words eh?