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Thread started 24 Mar 2016 (Thursday) 08:21
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Looking to get into Motorsports Photography Need Help

 
Blakes72x
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Mar 24, 2016 08:21 |  #1

Looking to get into motorsports photography i work for a race shop in southern california and am constantly attending track days, auto cross, off road events and many others but i'd like to start shooting the events and our customers cars to help promote our shop thing is i have no idea where to start. i tried searching around but most info is a few years old i find and use alot of camera terminology i don't quite understand yet. i'm a mechanic not a photographer lol atleast not yet.

first off i need help finding a camera i have a decent amount of experience with older film cameras and digital point and shoot cameras but never a DSLR. i plan to do lots of moving shots at track days and alot of still shots of our cars and customers cars i don't care what brand, or if its new or used just want the best bang for my buck trying to stay under 800 for body/lens. dont really plan on a ton of low light stuff but will definately be doing some. i've read that i need a decent fps camera with good af for a better chance at capturing moving/action shots but could be wrong thats why i'm here asking you guys.

next i know i need a lens what one/s do you all suggest to a beginner trying to do what i listed above. do i need filters?

i'm not to worried about camera set up/settings yet more focused on getting the right camera and lenses to suit my needs

thanks in advance,
blake

p.s. any awesome guides i should read for learning the basics? or tips on lighting etc. to get some awesome car shots?




  
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Grand ­ Dad
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Mar 24, 2016 14:57 |  #2

I’ll start by saying you are asking a lot for under $800.00. But it’s possible, if you’re willing to compromise a little. I shoot Canon gear so I’ll stay with them. Nikon probably has similar combinations. First off, shooting motorsports requires a camera/lens combination that is both fast and has a long reach. Unless you can get credentials at the racetrack, you are going to be far away from the action. As such, you want a camera that has a crop sensor (APS-C), not full frame. Don’t worry about the terminology right now, just make sure you get a crop sensor body. I have found that a zoom lens with a minimum of 300mm is required, with longer length desired. You don’t need the pricier lenses with f/2.8 or anything as you’ll usually be shooting in daylight.

A basic starter kit might be the Canon EOS Rebel T5i DSLR Camera with 18-55mm and 75-300mm Lenses from B&H Photo (http://www.bhphotovide​o.com …_eos_rebel_t5i_​18_55.html (external link)). It is currently $748.00 after rebates with free shipping and is tax free in California. The camera has 18 megapixels, 5 FPS and is a good entry level camera. This combination will not tolerate rough handling and the image quality of the lenses, although acceptable, is the big compromise.

You could try to find a better camera and/or lens on the used market, but its very buyer beware. A used Sigma 150-500mm lens for a Canon mount on eBay is going to be $550 -$700 alone.

You will not need filters for most motorsports shooting. And don’t spend any money on a tripod or monopod, you won’t use them and they just get in the way for panning shots. For reference sake, I use a Canon 7D Mk II with a 100-400mm Mk II lens for all my motorsports action shots. But that combination is $3,600.00.

A couple of suggested information sites are below.

http://www.the-digital-picture.com …News-Post.aspx?News=17530 (external link)
http://www.learn.usa.c​anon.com …otorsports_lefe​bure.shtml (external link)

Below are some tips I give new motorsports photographers for autocrosses.
1. Use a long telephoto zoom lens. 70-200mm is the minimum and usually not long enough from the course perimeter. APS-C sensor bodies are preferred to help with reach.
2. Try to shoot with the sun at your back or side to minimize reflections.
3. Shoot using continuous shutter bursts as fast as possible. Use AI Servo AF on Canon or AF-C on Nikon for all action shots.
4. For stop action shooting, set ISO to 320 – 400. Higher values will only be needed if it’s very cloudy, raining or dark. Shoot in Av/A at f/5.6 or Tv/S at 1/1000 or faster for best results. Head on or ¾ shots are best so the car doesn’t look parked.
5. Try to use a shallow depth of field (f/5.6-6.3) to minimize background distractions and highlight the cars.
6. For panning shooting, set ISO to 100, shoot in Tv/S and start with 1/125 – 1/160. As you become more practiced, drop the shutter speed to 1/80 – 1/100. Focus on a specific spot on the car throughout the pan. The best success will be with the car’s direction perpendicular to your shot. ¾ views are more difficult and will result in part of the car being more out of focus the slower the shutter speed (physics is not always our friend).
7. Photographing motorsports is difficult even for the best photographers. You are going to get bad panning shots. Do not worry about every shot being perfect. It will not happen.
8. Back button focus is preferred for any motorsports shooting.
9. If your camera has custom shooting modes, (C1, C2 on Canon or U1, U2 on Nikon) set up one for your baseline stop action shooting and another for the baseline panning. This makes it very quick to switch modes on a fast moving car.
10. Try to shoot low occasionally as the perspective allows views of lifting wheels and suspension changes that add to the sense of action and speed. If it is hot, beware of heat waves off the pavement that will degrade the image quality.
11. Watch the cars and memorize the track layout. You can usually see specific locations (bumps, dips, heavy braking areas, tight corners leading to a straight, etc.) that are better than others for unusual shots.


Larry

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Canonuser123
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Mar 24, 2016 15:17 |  #3

If you are in So. California I assume you will be shooting sometimes at Willow Springs, you can get good shots at Willow with a 300mm, a used 70-300mm USM I.S. or a 70-200 f4L with a TC will work well.
I would suggest trying some place like KEH.com and look for a used Canon 50D or possibly a 7D if you can get a good price. With used gear you can get something decent for $800. The 70-200 f4L will focus faster than the cheaper 70-300 USM I.S.




  
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Canonuser123
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Mar 24, 2016 15:24 |  #4

Grand Dad wrote in post #17947152 (external link)
6. For panning shooting, set ISO to 100, shoot in Tv/S and start with 1/125 – 1/160. As you become more practiced, drop the shutter speed to 1/80 – 1/100. Focus on a specific spot on the car throughout the pan. The best success will be with the car’s direction perpendicular to your shot. ¾ views are more difficult and will result in part of the car being more out of focus the slower the shutter speed (physics is not always our friend).

For someone starting out I think they would be better off starting at 1/250th or even 1/320th so as not to get discouraged with a bunch of bad shots, as they get comfortable with panning dropping the speed will be easier. Learning to hold a camera properly is very important for someone new and watching Youtube videos will help with proper technique that will come in handy when they move up to longer lenses.




  
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STIC
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Mar 25, 2016 02:32 |  #5
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I've done this (as well as feature shooting and writing) for a living and also use a 7DII (only just got it though, used to do most of mine with a 40D, then 7D) and 100-400 (the old pump action one).

A 7D will be a good option, older so cheaper, but 8fps is nothing to sneeze at...

Most of my motorsport shots were in speed priority, ISO100 and between 1/60th and approx 1/250th sec...if I remember correctly...

Probably the most important thing to get right is a smooth pan...once you nail that, everything else (except getting access to the infield) should be OK... :p

Practice panning until you can lift the camera to your face and get this:

IMAGE: https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2570/4206734089_f9b1b316f0_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/7pJB​u6  (external link) Trackday (external link) by Flickr Sure Sucks (external link), on Flickr


IMAGE: https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4046/4206757373_8f9e322d85_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/7pJJ​px  (external link) Fast four (external link) by Flickr Sure Sucks (external link), on Flickr


IMAGE: https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8508/8520853562_d257eff64b_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/dYXA​Uj  (external link) Torque'n Dirty 2 (external link) by Flickr Sucks (external link), on Flickr


IMAGE: https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8388/8521156224_52cf6e911a_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/dYZ9​SC  (external link) Torque'n Dirty 18 (external link) by Flickr Sucks (external link), on Flickr

50-60% of the time...

7D MarkII l 50 1.8 STM l15-85 IS USM l 100-400 IS L l 2x converter l 580EX II l Wireless remote l A computer l Some software l A vehicle to get me around...;)

  
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Bicknell55
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Mar 25, 2016 09:10 |  #6

As noted previously KEH and B&H offer decent used products. I've purchased from KEH and wouldn't hesitate to do so again. Bodies depreciate quite quickly so you should be able to find something used for a decent price. About the only risk is the shutter mechanism eventually reaching the end of it's life but they are replaceable for ~$200-$300 if my memory serves me correctly.


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RussellJ
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Mar 25, 2016 18:37 |  #7

Looks like your out of San Diego, great place for sure to get into alot of shooting types, I shoot Motocross and Off Road Racing and live in SD. Finding a package for 800 will be a rough one for sure, Canon 7D is a great place to start, bit old but still works just fine. Lens you can rent to start off for the most part till you know you really want to buy.


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Grand ­ Dad
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Mar 25, 2016 20:06 |  #8

Bicknell55 wrote in post #17948022 (external link)
As noted previously KEH and B&H offer decent used products. I've purchased from KEH and wouldn't hesitate to do so again. Bodies depreciate quite quickly so you should be able to find something used for a decent price. About the only risk is the shutter mechanism eventually reaching the end of it's life but they are replaceable for ~$200-$300 if my memory serves me correctly.

I agree that buying used equipment from B&H or other reputable places is a better option than eBay. However, I just took a look at B&H and KEH for a used Canon 7D and the prices ranges from $500 - $700. I still own my 7D, in addition to my 7D Mk II, and I agree it’s a great start for a motorsports camera. I had the shutter replaced after 250,000 shots and it cost $215 with my CPS discount. However, that $500 - $700 body would not leave the OP much money to purchase a better lens or two. B&H and KEH used lenses from any reasonable manufacturer seem to be $250 + for anything other than the kit lens that would come on the camera in a new package. His $800 limit is quite restrictive and, in my opinion, makes a used market package little better than a new entry level kit. But he does have options. He could rent, but that gets costly very quickly. Oh well, my $0.02 worth.


Larry

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Canonuser123
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Mar 25, 2016 20:06 |  #9

RussellJ wrote in post #17948670 (external link)
Looks like your out of San Diego, great place for sure to get into alot of shooting types, I shoot Motocross and Off Road Racing and live in SD. Finding a package for 800 will be a rough one for sure, Canon 7D is a great place to start, bit old but still works just fine. Lens you can rent to start off for the most part till you know you really want to buy.

That is why I recommended used, a 50D can be had for about $350 and a 70-200 f4L can be had for about $450.
https://www.keh.com …slr-camera-body-only.html (external link)
https://www.keh.com …-telephoto-zoom-lens.html (external link)

Throw in a 1.4x Teleconverter from Kenko and you have a nice starter setup, I use a Tamron SP 1.4x TC with my 70-200 f4L I.S. and it works great. The Tamron I believe is the same as the Kenko.
You might find better deals somewhere else other than KEH.




  
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Canonuser123
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Mar 25, 2016 20:09 |  #10

Grand Dad wrote in post #17948772 (external link)
He could rent, but that gets costly very quickly. Oh well, my $0.02 worth.

Yes renting will add up fast when you are learning and need a lot of practice.




  
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Mar 25, 2016 20:26 |  #11

Blakes72x wrote in post #17946773 (external link)
p.s. any awesome guides i should read for learning the basics? or tips on lighting etc. to get some awesome car shots?

Look at the links in my Sig, and...

Panning


FrankC - 20D, RAW, Manual everything...
Classic Carz, Racing, Air Show, Flowers.
Find the light... A few Car Lighting Tips, and MOVE YOUR FEET!
Have you thought about making your own book? // Need an exposure crutch?
New Image Size Limits: Image must not exceed 1600 pixels on any side.

  
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STIC
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Mar 25, 2016 20:53 |  #12
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Grand Dad wrote in post #17948772 (external link)
I agree that buying used equipment from B&H or other reputable places is a better option than eBay. However, I just took a look at B&H and KEH for a used Canon 7D and the prices ranges from $500 - $700. I still own my 7D, in addition to my 7D Mk II, and I agree it’s a great start for a motorsports camera. I had the shutter replaced after 250,000 shots and it cost $215 with my CPS discount. However, that $500 - $700 body would not leave the OP much money to purchase a better lens or two. B&H and KEH used lenses from any reasonable manufacturer seem to be $250 + for anything other than the kit lens that would come on the camera in a new package. His $800 limit is quite restrictive and, in my opinion, makes a used market package little better than a new entry level kit. But he does have options. He could rent, but that gets costly very quickly. Oh well, my $0.02 worth.

Unfortunately, the ONLY way to look at this is to say that you can have gear fit for the job, or, you can have gear that costs $800...you CAN'T have both...

While I shot Drift (and the odd track day) with a 40D (the 7D was much better), it was the expensive (at least when I brought it new) 100-400L that was the more important bit of kit...

A used 7D and a used 100-400 should get the job done....but you probably won't score this for $800....

Decisions, decisions...


7D MarkII l 50 1.8 STM l15-85 IS USM l 100-400 IS L l 2x converter l 580EX II l Wireless remote l A computer l Some software l A vehicle to get me around...;)

  
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Canonuser123
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Mar 25, 2016 22:21 |  #13

STIC wrote in post #17948822 (external link)
Unfortunately, the ONLY way to look at this is to say that you can have gear fit for the job, or, you can have gear that costs $800...you CAN'T have both...


You can shoot with far less than a 7D and a 100-400mm, not one of the shots you posted was shot at even close to 400mm, in fact the longest focal length of any of the shots you posted was 220mm. Two of the shots you posted were taken with your 40D.

Lots of great photos were taken in the film days where if you were to just let it rip with a 10 fps burst rate, you would be changing your roll of film every 3.5 seconds.




  
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STIC
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Mar 26, 2016 04:36 |  #14
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Canonuser123 wrote in post #17948932 (external link)
You can shoot with far less than a 7D and a 100-400mm, not one of the shots you posted was shot at even close to 400mm, in fact the longest focal length of any of the shots you posted was 220mm. Two of the shots you posted were taken with your 40D.

Lots of great photos were taken in the film days where if you were to just let it rip with a 10 fps burst rate, you would be changing your roll of film every 3.5 seconds.

Yes...all true, but...

Just because you CAN tie one hand behind your back, why would you WANT to...

I say 7D and 100-400 because...

A) I've used them, and know they're quite handy for the intended purpose.
B) They are both older models of gear and are getting cheap now, used.

C) I think I DID mention I used a 40D and 7D...

D) Just because I didn't take EVERY shot @ 400mm, does not negate the 100-400 as a good recommendation...


7D MarkII l 50 1.8 STM l15-85 IS USM l 100-400 IS L l 2x converter l 580EX II l Wireless remote l A computer l Some software l A vehicle to get me around...;)

  
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Mar 26, 2016 06:16 |  #15

STIC wrote in post #17949147 (external link)
Yes...all true, but...

Just because you CAN tie one hand behind your back, why would you WANT to...

I say 7D and 100-400 because...

D) Just because I didn't take EVERY shot @ 400mm, does not negate the 100-400 as a good recommendation...

The O.P. has a budget of $800, you recommended a 7D and a 100-400 which would be way over their budget, that is why it was a bad recommendation.
As for your "tie one hand behind your back" comment, give me a break. With that attitude, why not just give up if you can't shoot with a 1DX mark II?

You don't need to learn on the best equipment, you do need to be able to afford something to even try.




  
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