DPP 4 exports in sRGB (only)?

Hey folks - I am tidying up my workflow and in checking my profiles source space in PS (after export from editing in DPP 4) it says sRGB v1.131 (canon). Now, in the preferences I am set to wide gamut. I have tried convert and save as TIFF. Still ends up in sRGB. is there a way to exports without clipping colors by ending up in the sRGB work space? Seems silly to shoot in RAW and then export into sRGB.

Welcome to the forum!

I don't want to you to take this the wrong way, but from my perspective it seems silly to export in anything but sRGB.

sRGB rules the consumer device world. Phones, tablets, monitors . . . all sRGB. In exporting photos they are usually being shared and viewed digitally on consumer devices. There isn't much point in exporting in a wide gamut colour space when the devices the photos will be viewed on don't support it. The photos won't look correct. Optimizing photographs for an sRGB world is what makes sense to me.

In the event things change in the future, and consumer devices support a wide gamut colour space, you can always revisit some of your RAW files and reprocess them to be viewed on the new devices.

The caveat would be for printing: where you have your own closed and calibrated colour system that supports a wide gamut, or you're using a professional printer who wants files in something other than sRGB.

I know that totally doesn't answer the question you asked (and I can't answer your actual question as I don't use DPP), but hopefully it makes you feel a little better about sRGB files.

I also agree that I would be very dubious about exporting from DPP in anything other than sRGB, especially if it were a wide gamut colourspace, if it were not also in 16 bit per channel.

Alan

neacail wrote in post #17983580
Welcome to the forum!

I don't want to you to take this the wrong way, but from my perspective it seems silly to export in anything but sRGB.......

The caveat would be for printing: where you have your own closed and calibrated colour system that supports a wide gamut, or you're using a professional printer who wants files in something other than sRGB.

Not taking it the wrong way at all, and I appreciate your input. Albeit, yup, bingo, that's the caveat .

This for printing on a pro level printer with I presume at least an Adobe RGB color gamut. Certainly more then sRGB. I know that for sure because I just converted a file I had to sRGB and printed it compared to the same photo from it's original ProPhoto color space and color intensity was lacking in the sRGB print. Particularly in the blues and greens where you'd expect it too.

Once I standardize my workflow I will for sure covert to sRGB for all my other outputs, sans the printing . For that I'd like to start with as wide as gamut as I can.

I realize I can use LR to convert but I'd prefer to use Canon software to decode and convert Canon RAW files. maybe it's not even possible. I know there are workarounds, but i just wanted to make sure I'm not missing something in DPP 4.

IPTAK wrote in post #17983643
This for printing on a pro level printer with I presume at least an Adobe RGB color gamut. Certainly more then sRGB. I know that for sure because I just converted a file I had to sRGB and printed it compared to the same photo from it's original ProPhoto color space and color intensity was lacking in the sRGB print. Particularly in the blues and greens where you'd expect it too.

Are you doing the printing, or are you outsourcing it? If you are outsourcing it, have you asked the printer what colour space your files should be in? Have you requested the ICC profile from the printer?

There was an interesting thread about this recently. I'll see if I can dig it up. I think there were only three known printers who request AdobeRGB. I'll see if I can dig up the thread.

If you're doing the printing, what printer is being used?

In DPP 3 that I use (DPP 4 won't run under Windows XP), you have to set the default color space, restart DPP, and the set CS will be applied as desired on new images that hadn't been edited before.

Anyway, you can always choose a different CS on a per-image basis through Adjustment > Work color space.

I use the latter method when an image contains colors beyond sRGB (my default CS) and I want to save it to a wider CS to later selectively desaturate the problem areas before converting to sRGB, in order to preserve detail.

First off, you can use DPP to "render" a Raw file into your chosen color space, whether you are sending to PhotoShop as a TIFF or saving as a jpeg. I don't have DPP on the (laptop) PC I'm at right now, but there is a tool to do this on and image-by-image basis, or as a batch, or in Tools I believe you can set the default working color space to whatever (sRGB, aRGB, wide gamut, etc).

A couple considerations: First, it's important to keep an image in the 16-bit rendering if you are going to do color-space "dickering" in, say, PhotoShop, because the 16-bit image will keep the "breadth" of your color/tonal info so converting the image will not be "messy" compared to an 8-bit image. This can be done with TIFF. With jpeg, you'd use 8-bits, not as good. The choice does have a "cost", though, in that a 16-bit image will have a relatively large file size which needs to be saved (the "original" file) in the process of working in PhotoShop...

Then, another consideration is that PhotoShop itself has ways of working with color spaces, some that you set as the "default" for when you bring in an image, or you can adjust things "on the fly". For example, for images destined for an aRGB process/print, you can set PhotoShop to either use the aRGB color space, or you can set it to accept and work with an aRGB image "as is" without having to convert it to aRGB. Then, of course, for those destined to be used for the Web (or email/sharing with the "public"), you may want to set Photoshop to either use sRGB as its working space and convert non-conforming images, or to ask you when it opens such an image, or else you will need to specifically convert your image when preparing to save an 8-bit sRGB jpeg.

At any rate, you set up PhotoShop specifics for this in the Image/Color Preferences dialog.

IPTAK wrote in post #17983546
Hey folks - I am tidying up my workflow and in checking my profiles source space in PS (after export from editing in DPP 4) it says sRGB v1.131 (canon). Now, in the preferences I am set to wide gamut. I have tried convert and save as TIFF. Still ends up in sRGB. is there a way to exports without clipping colors by ending up in the sRGB work space? Seems silly to shoot in RAW and then export into sRGB.

You might want to check your default work color space setting. DPP uses the default setting when converting files. If you transfer to Photoshop for editing, it embeds the ICC profile (so again, transfers the file with the default work color space embedded), unless, of course, you changed the work color space on an individual file.

In DPP 4 /Preferences

neacail wrote in post #17983647
Are you doing the printing, or are you outsourcing it? If you are outsourcing it, have you asked the printer what colour space your files should be in? Have you requested the ICC profile from the printer?

There was an interesting thread about this recently. I'll see if I can dig it up. I think there were only three known printers who request AdobeRGB. I'll see if I can dig up the thread.

If you're doing the printing, what printer is being used?

That link would be great - If I choose to go up too 24 inches wide I'd outsource to a pro lab. If they requested my file in an sRGB space or tell me they would be printing it that way I would rapidly find another printer .

I'm using an Epson 4000 Pro. A snipet from a quick Google search regarding printing with an 4000 pro:

"Off (No Color Adjustment) is the correct choice when you're printing from Photoshop or any other application that gives you full control over color management. Selecting Off ensures that your printer receives only one set of color instructions. sRGB works well when you're printing JPEG files directly from a digital camera and no correction is needed. Because sRGB is a smaller color space than Adobe RGB, it isn't the optimal setting for photographs but does ensure that the printer and the camera are using the same set of color values when printing with no other color management support.

Thanks everyone - seems like it was the "re start the program" part I was missing . I selected "use shooting workspace" under preferences, re-started, and voila, I am now in Wide RGB after I export to PS. I also found the method in the adjustments menu I was unaware of as well.

If you haven't seen this I thought it was pretty good: https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=n0bxSD-Xx-Q. His thought is even Adobe RGB is too small. I used his test file and printed one in Pro Color and one in sRGB from my printer keeping all other color management the same. The difference was quite clear. The kicker is I knew this, but for some reason I never thought to check what DPP was sending to PS for me. I was pretty surprised when I saw it was sRGB. I really just wasn't paying attention because I have been doing a lot of web work lately and not printing. Let my good habits go by the way side - live and learn.

Anyway, back on track now thanks for the help - cheers.

Th

Reservoir Dog wrote in post #17983775
In DPP 4 /Preferences

Hosted photo: posted by Reservoir Dog in
./showthread.php?p=179​83775&i=i35421026
forum: RAW, Post Processing & Printing

Yup, got it. Thank you.

IPTAK wrote in post #17983879
Thanks everyone - seems like it was the "re start the program" part I was missing . I selected "use shooting workspace" under preferences, re-started, and voila, I am now in Wide RGB after I export to PS. I also found the method in the adjustments menu I was unaware of as well.

<snip>

Anyway, back on track now thanks for the help - cheers.

What camera are you using that it offers Wide RGB as an option? The 'Use shooting workspace' setting does exactly what it says. It uses the color space that you select in-camera.

IPTAK wrote in post #17983823
............ If they requested my file in an sRGB space or tell me they would be printing it that way I would rapidly find another printer . ...............

Good luck with that, as there are very few that request anything other than sRGB or who accept anything outside sRGB. This is applicable for bulk production labs, not necessarily true for niche inkjet glicee type set-ups

I'm using an Epson 4000 Pro. A snipet from a quick Google search regarding printing with an 4000 pro:

"Off (No Color Adjustment) is the correct choice when you're printing from Photoshop or any other application that gives you full control over color management. Selecting Off ensures that your printer receives only one set of color instructions. sRGB works well when you're printing JPEG files directly from a digital camera and no correction is needed. Because sRGB is a smaller color space than Adobe RGB, it isn't the optimal setting for photographs but does ensure that the printer and the camera are using the same set of color values when printing with no other color management support.

You need to be a bit careful believing everything you read or watch on the internet. The above statement is not correct and/or misleading in many respects & appears to be extracted from Epson's literature.

It is pointless working in a colourspace that greatly exceeds the colour gamut of the scene captured. It limits the graduations available. There are a relatively few colour ranges that exist in nature that exceed sRGB. Please Note I said relatively few, of course there are but these are handled fairly well by rendering intents. There are exceptions of course, some flora colours, some rare deep blues etc.

Pro photo RGB also exceeds the visible spectrum by about 10%, good luck seeing those. In fact, good luck seeing anything on screen or print that gets anywhere near the most saturated greens of Pro Photo RGB.

That's curious isn't it? I went back and check some things. For this particular instance it was from a 7D Mark ii. I shoot RAW always, and have my in camera color space set to Adobe RGB. So I looked back at DPP 4. In the preferences I originally choose Wide RGB. When I choose the "use camera setting" it grayed out all the other options but it still left the Wide RGB checked...even though it was grayed out.

PS image of screen shots from both applications on my laptop - not my primary editing workstation. PS was after images was sent to PS from DPP and I went to the "convert" dialog to see what color space I was starting with.