I predict that a 500 f/5.6 or 600 f/5.6 will come out in next few years

buddy4344 wrote in post #18148969
I would love a theoretical weight/size comparison between a 600mm f/5.6 vs. the 600mm DO f/4.

..

600mm f/5.6 would weigh in at around 5-6 pounds.

For the DO, we need to make some assumptions based on the few examples of DO we have already been able to weigh.

The 400mm DO (@ 4.6 pounds) only saves about a pound or so vs. what a 400mm f/4 would normally weigh. (between 5.6-6.4 pounds. 5.6 being "new canon glass" weight, 6.4 being older mid 2000 gen Canon weight and current Nikon weight)

we'll stick with current Gen Canon weight of 5.6, to keep all else as equal as we can.

The lightest 600mm f/4 currently made is the Canon @ 8.6 pounds (Much lighter than the last version)

If we can only save 1 pound, then we are at over 7 pounds still.

If we go via percentage, 5.6 vs. 4.6 is a 17% decrease in weight, We are still at about 7.1 pounds for a 600mm f/4 DO.

buddy4344 wrote in post #18148969
...

http://www.canonrumors​.com …-arrive-in-late-2017-cr2/

...

In my usual fashion, I will bunk the CR article.

I don't imagine for a second that Canon is ready to start replacing it's current line up of super telephotos. They are very new designs and already far ahead of the competition in new lightweight design. (Nikon 600mm is over 11 pounds still compared to Canon 8 pounds)

The only ones I can see getting a refresh are the 200mm f/2 and 800mm, although even those do not seem in dire need of a refresh. The Canon 200mm is a pound lighter then the Nikon. The 800mm ushered in the "gen II" body design that gave us the weight savings even though it was not a Gen II lens in the sense that there was no Gen 1 for it to replace.

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18149017
600mm f/5.6 would weigh in at around 5-6 pounds.

For the DO, we need to make some assumptions based on the few examples of DO we have already been able to weigh.

The 400mm DO (@ 4.6 pounds) only saves about a pound or so vs. what a 400mm f/4 would normally weigh. (between 5.6-6.4 pounds. 5.6 being "new canon glass" weight, 5.6 being older mid 2000 gen Canon weight and current Nikon weight)

we'll stick with current Gen Canon weight of 5.6, to keep all else as equal as we can.

The lightest 600mm f/4 currently made is the Canon @ 8.6 pounds (Much lighter than the last version)

If we can only save 1 pound, then we are at over 7 pounds still.

If we go via percentage, 5.6 vs. 4.6 is a 17% decrease in weight, We are still at about 7.1 pounds for a 600mm f/4 DO.

Thanks for doing the math. from my friends in South Africa that shoot a lot of big glass, the comfortable limit for most is right at 7 pounds (the 500mm f/4 ver II). Some hand-hold the 200-400, but only for short periods or younger, stronger guys. That's 8 pounds. I don't really know of anyone that regularly handholds the current 600 and can truly be steady enough to get good shutter speeds.

This math further makes me think a 600mm, f/5.6 at around 5 to 6 pounds would be a hit.

Where I become a little less sure of my comments is actually with Canon's 100-400 ver II and thoughts of the recent newer Tamron and Sigma zooms that reach 600mm. The 1-4 V2 is really sharp with the 1.4x III T/C and f/8 and gives us 560mm equivalent. I never thought a zoom could be that sharp with a T/C. Is my dream lens a zoom?

I haven't seen field images with the newer Tamron, but, of course it is f/6.3. I don't know if the Tamron will autofocus with their T/C attached. The write-up says it is 1 stop, so I have some doubts. Conversely, I can't think today's Canon would come out with a lens of this family that wouldn't autofocus with their 1.4x T/C.

I'm rambling. I just want 600mm that fits in my bag and ways less than 7 pounds and is Canon 'new generation' sharp. A simple request.

One more point. It's not just the weight, but also a) the length of the lens and b) where the weight is centered. We are really talking leverage or torque ( T = F * r * sin(theta)) when it comes to holding a lens and shooting. Obviously, if all of the weight was right at the camera, it would be a heck of a lot easier to handhold than when it's 30 inches out front.

I had the 400 DO for years and must say it was relatively light feeling even thought it weighed a lot because it was short.

Right now the closest you will come is the 400mm DO with 1.4x T-Con at about 5 pounds, f/5.6 560mm. But of course, you know this better than I do.

With a 1Dx2 or 5D4 that will also allow all AF points with a 2X @ 800mm f/8

But yeah, it would be nice to start with a bare lens.

Because I know that Jake (a.k.a. CDS) loves Canon Rumors:

http://www.canonrumors​.com …-with-eos-6d-mark-ii-cr1/

buddy4344 wrote in post #18149994
Because I know that Jake (a.k.a. CDS) loves Canon Rumors:

http://www.canonrumors​.com …-with-eos-6d-mark-ii-cr1/

They're going to come out with a 200-600mm lens that competes well with the sigma/tamron lenses...that would mean it would have to be priced near them...who would buy the 100-400II then

buddy4344 wrote in post #18000347
Okay, I don't know where this post should go. I have heard no rumors, so I'm starting one. With the 1Dx MkII being so much better on higher ISO in combination with the 100-400 ver 2 being so sharp, the value of the 200-400 has plummeted as has the re-sale on the Ver 1 Canon 400mm DO. This tells me that with ISO flexibility and sharper glass and focusing many could easily live with f/5.6 at 400mm.

If this is the case, I would argue the 500 f/5.6 or 600mm f/5.6 would be quickly accepted as it would be significantly lighter than the f/4 options and with the ability to push iso, it could allow adequate shutter speed in most situations (since the 1-4 v2 obviously does).

Just a thought on a Sunday night.

Two years ago, I predicted that with the higher ISO settings we would see 500 f/5.6 and maybe 600 f/5.6 and, of course, this would be a much lighter lens. Nikon has just announced this.

https://photographylif​e.com …5-6e-pf-lens-announcement

I guess I'm saying 'I told you so'. Now, Canon wake up. Bring us a 'better than Sony' mirrorless and a light weight 600mm f/5.6!

"– Nikon’s announcement of a new 500mm f/5.6E PF lens with a phase-fresnel element, selling for $3600"

"phase-fresnel" = Canon's "Difractive Optics" nomenclature.

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1499529
$3,600.00!!
Nice price!

Looks like Cyber wants to join the Darkside

It's the lenses that will pull me. I was lusting for the 200-500mm already.
A similar f/5.6 in 600mm would push me for sure.

Jump to the darkside Cyber........ the water is warm

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18691878
"– Nikon’s announcement of a new 500mm f/5.6E PF lens with a phase-fresnel element, selling for $3600"

"phase-fresnel" = Canon's "Difractive Optics" nomenclature.

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1499529
$3,600.00!!

Nice price!

Yes, very attractive price.
I would like to try this lens with the D500 for air shows.

Currently, D850 is superior to Canon Choices
D500 blows away 7d my II
Sony a7 and a9 has set the mirrorless std.
Nikon 500 f/5.6 looks killer
Cano late to full frame mirrorless race
Etc.

I keep thinking we are due for a best in class. I’m patient because I’m heavily gear invested but ...

I like my 7D2, and for wildlife action still end yp shooting it more than my favorite 5D4, but when i compare the 7DII to D500,. and imagine it outfitted with that new 500mm prime or the 200-500mm zoom, I get very jealous.

Sure we can put a 150-600mm SIGMA on our Canon's, but it never shines the way the native Canon 100-400mm does,. whereas I think the VERY affordable Nikon 200-500mm does really well.