Optimum Sharpening for 5DsR

What have people found to be their best practice for PRINTING with 5DsR files, either from Lightroom (LR) or photoshop (Ps)

I am looking for ways to experiment to get highest acutance (assuming that's the right term). I.e. detail is all well and good but I also want the overall impression of sharpness, high acutance, without crunchiness, when looking at a print

Print sharpening is a very individual choice, based on the actual image and personal preference. I don't think it's one of those areas where one glove fits all. Indeed, I am far from convinced that looking sharper is always better for the very same reasons.

If you are looking for a starting point though you could always grab the free Nik collection that includes sharpeners. https://www.google.com​/nikcollection/

If detail is good but you are still missing the impression of (clean) sharpness, perhaps you need some added clarity.

Topaz Clarity gives you a lot of control and good results without artifacts.

http://www.topazlabs.c​om/clarity

ashleykaryl wrote in post #18304460
Print sharpening is a very individual choice, based on the actual image and personal preference. I don't think it's one of those areas where one glove fits all. Indeed, I am far from convinced that looking sharper is always better for the very same reasons.

If you are looking for a starting point though you could always grab the free Nik collection that includes sharpeners. https://www.google.com​/nikcollection/

I use Nik already but Im looking for more options. Indeed it is very individual and of course not a one glove fits all scenario which is why Im trying to explore more options and techniques.

Really Im hoping more for techniques rather than just plug-in recommendations as I expect Ive tried most of them, e.g. high pass settings coupled with USM settings

agedbriar wrote in post #18304481
If detail is good but you are still missing the impression of (clean) sharpness, perhaps you need some added clarity.

Topaz Clarity gives you a lot of control and good results without artifacts.

http://www.topazlabs.c​om/clarity

I usually run. 'local contrast' action and a midtone contouring action applied with masks selectively, after playing with clarity, detail, Nik color Efex pro, etc. to see if I can pull any more out of it without losing subtlety or clipping etc


I'll do a try amount of presahrening then later some selective sharpening but thats always hard to gauge

I run Nik sharpener just before printing and don't get me wrong, results are good, but Im toking to find if I can increase the perception of acuity over and above simplesahrpening.

Im thinking perhaps along the lines of a high pass run then some USM but not tried it yet -wondered what voter's workflows were for this sort of thing

Much depends on the subject, but don't underestimate lighting. You haven't given us any examples of images, but the way a subject is lit can obviously transform the initial impression of sharpness. There is also good old fashioned technique like using a tripod and lens hood.

I'm not intending to dissuade you from finding alternative techniques in post-production, but merely to point out that the process starts at the picture taking stage. Custom camera profiling can also create the impression of more sharpness, simply by lifting and separating certain colours more effectively.

What lens are you using, OP?

You might also try printing with Qimage, which incorporates a print-oriented sharpening tool. You only control the sharpening Amount, but the results are good nonetheless.

Not sure what you are looking for other than a listing of what sharpening packages are out there. Nor can I tell how big you are trying to print. I've had excellent results (to me and others that have seen my prints) using LR sharpening with a careful application of a mask with images from my 5DSr with the 11-24 and a Canon imagePROGRAF PRO-2000 going 20"x30". From my experience there are a ton of "things" that can mess up the impression of sharpness like the "wrong" contrast, clarity, etc as well as too much or too little sharpening. Now, maybe my prints would not be sharp enough for you but to me if you look at the print and the impression (I agree this is key) is that it is sharp and clean (not crunchy) then I am happy.

And, of course the execution of actually taking the photo has to be done right -- I've ruined a number of photos cause I did not anticipate just how much very little movement / vibration impacts those 51 megapixels

Adding to what others have mentioned, I've found through the years, both as a shooter and in IT for publishing, that it's always best to deal with issues of sharpness and clarity when processing for the final image size and purpose.

Just reducing in size the same file that produced that wonderful big art print hanging on the wall will, for example, not likely produce an optimal 720 pixel wide image for the web or even the best possible 5 by 7 for printing.

ashleykaryl wrote in post #18304553
Much depends on the subject, but don't underestimate lighting. You haven't given us any examples of images, but the way a subject is lit can obviously transform the initial impression of sharpness. There is also good old fashioned technique like using a tripod and lens hood.

I'm not intending to dissuade you from finding alternative techniques in post-production, but merely to point out that the process starts at the picture taking stage.

of course -goes without saying

ashleykaryl wrote in post #18304553
Custom camera profiling can also create the impression of more sharpness, simply by lifting and separating certain colours more effectively.

Can you explain how to custom camera profile please?

agedbriar wrote in post #18304807
You might also try printing with Qimage, which incorporates a print-oriented sharpening tool. You only control the sharpening Amount, but the results are good nonetheless.

I use IMAGEPRINT so not keen on using a different RIP but thanks for the suggestion

mikeearly wrote in post #18305336
Not sure what you are looking for other than a listing of what sharpening packages are out there. Nor can I tell how big you are trying to print. I've had excellent results (to me and others that have seen my prints) using LR sharpening with a careful application of a mask with images from my 5DSr with the 11-24 and a Canon imagePROGRAF PRO-2000 going 20"x30". From my experience there are a ton of "things" that can mess up the impression of sharpness like the "wrong" contrast, clarity, etc as well as too much or too little sharpening. Now, maybe my prints would not be sharp enough for you but to me if you look at the print and the impression (I agree this is key) is that it is sharp and clean (not crunchy) then I am happy.

I agree that processing does impact hugely on printing sharpness, and that ultimately it is all about the impression to the viewer. I am certainly after subtle processing and not using a sledgehammer to crack eggs !



I think probably what I am looking for is another technique in photoshop (rather than plug-in) similar perhaps to the sort of midtone contouring advocated by the likes of Vincent Versace and George Dewolfe crossed with a. a high pass setting used subtly, to use at the very last stage before final sharpening or maybe even just after final sharpening (done for size of print and subject matter and masked for sky, darks etc)

I think what I need to do is dig out the Sharpening book again by Bruce Fraser and Jeff Schewe, experiment a bit and make myself an adaptable action for photoshop. I suppose I hoped someone had already been down that road

mikeearly wrote in post #18305336
And, of course the execution of actually taking the photo has to be done right -- I've ruined a number of photos cause I did not anticipate just how much very little movement / vibration impacts those 51 megapixels

of course!

AZGeorge wrote in post #18307140
Adding to what others have mentioned, I've found through the years, both as a shooter and in IT for publishing, that it's always best to deal with issues of sharpness and clarity when processing for the final image size and purpose.

of course

AZGeorge wrote in post #18307140
Just reducing in size the same file that produced that wonderful big art print hanging on the wall will, for example, not likely produce an optimal 720 pixel wide image for the web or even the best possible 5 by 7 for printing

yes indeed

Thanks for all your thoughts

I Simonius wrote in post #18308576
of course -goes without saying


Can you explain how to custom camera profile please?

You need to create custom profiles for your camera based on the lighting conditions. To do this, shoot a well exposed image of a ColorChecker chart and then use profiling software like ColorChecker Passport to create the profile for your camera, which only takes a minute.

When you are using a processing app like Lightroom, simply apply that profile whenever you have an image shot with similar lighting and you will generally see a much improved result.

EDIT: Just a clarification that this impacts the colour rather than the sharpness as such, however greater separation of tones can give the impression of better sharpness. Imagine an image of a parrot with yellow and orange feathers. If you can see every nuance in tone very clearly it will look sharper than an image with a standard camera profile where the colours are less well defined.

ashleykaryl wrote in post #18309642
You need to create custom profiles for your camera based on the lighting conditions. To do this, shoot a well exposed image of a ColorChecker chart and then use profiling software like ColorChecker Passport to create the profile for your camera, which only takes a minute.

When you are using a processing app like Lightroom, simply apply that profile whenever you have an image shot with similar lighting and you will generally see a much improved result.

EDIT: Just a clarification that this impacts the colour rather than the sharpness as such, however greater separation of tones can give the impression of better sharpness. Imagine an image of a parrot with yellow and orange feathers. If you can see every nuance in tone very clearly it will look sharper than an image with a standard camera profile where the colours are less well defined.

thanks - you know what, I did buy colour checker passport but what with one thing and another I never got round to using it, thanks for the reminder and prompt - I really must get round to doing it.


So the idea is to do it for different lighting situations? i.e. Bright full sunlight (we should ever be so lucky here) , overcast etc?

In the testing I have done you are basically good with one daylight profile, but you would then create profiles for other kinds of lighting you might use like tungsten or flash etc. At that point I only need to create a profile in unique mixed lighting conditions that might be something like a room with a mixture of daylight, tungsten and halogen for example. If you have more than one camera you'll want to create different profiles.

Just remember you still need to set an accurate white balance, but that is a separate issue.

X-Rite have just published an article I wrote that may help you with understanding the ColorChecker Passport Photo.

http://blog.xritephoto​.com …/colorchecker-passport-2/

many thanks