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FORUMS Sony Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Sony Cameras 
Thread started 19 Apr 2017 (Wednesday) 10:51
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Sony A9 Announced

 
Tom ­ Reichner
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Post edited over 2 years ago by Tom Reichner.
     
Apr 22, 2017 11:47 |  #121

rxjohn wrote in post #18334788 (external link)
10 fps refers to with an A-mount lens and an adapter. I don't believe that is the case with e-mount lenses...

What about using EF mount lenses with an adaptor? Will we get the full 20 FPS when we use our Canon supertelephotos with the A9?

rxjohn wrote in post #18334788 (external link)
Also, my understanding is RAW shoots at 12 fps.

Well then RAW shooters might as well just stick with their 1D series Canons and equivalent Nikons, if speed is what matters. But I though that 20 FPS and a huge buffer was the whole point of this A9.

I just don't get it - it's like there is this "shocking announcement" about 20 FPS and a few hundred shots in a burst . . . . . but there seem to be so many exceptions to those figures that in real-world usage it won't deliver those specs to those who need them the most.

.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
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Apr 22, 2017 12:02 |  #122

Scrumhalf wrote in post #18334801 (external link)
I'm don't think I'm about to jump into the Sony world anytime soon, but I was doing some thought experiments.

Right now, I shoot a 6D with a 24-70 II, 70-200II, 100/2.8L, etc. for family, portrait or landscape/scenic shots.

I am also a birder and I use a pair of 7D2s on a 100-400 II and a 500/4 II.

I can see incorporating the A7RII or A9 into the first group, either with the Canon lenses with an adapter, or go to a native Sony ecosystem. But for the birding application where focusing speed and performance is very important, I think that staying with the 7D2-based system would be the best.

Any thoughts?

when doing tests with the 6D vs A7r, I thought I missfocused slightly with the 6D, but it was stopped down to f8 on tripod....... Same with 6D vs A7rii + 135L (which I still own). I still have the 24-70ii as well, use for the occasional video, and it's sharp as heck for landscapes, but I havent used it a lot in that scenario, but that may change in the future. Either way, it doesnt hurt owning it, so I keep it around. The AF is fine, and I dont even use metabones for that particular combo.


Sony A7riii/A9 - FE 12-24/4 - FE 24-240 - SY 24/2.8 - FE 28/2 - FE 35/2.8 - FE 50/1.8 - FE 85/1.8 - EF 135/1.8 Art - F 600/5.6 - CZ 100-300 - Astro Rok 14/2.8 - Tamron 17-28/2.8 - 28-75/2.8 RXD, 70-200/2.8 VC

  
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rxjohn
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Apr 22, 2017 12:16 |  #123

Tom Reichner wrote in post #18334815 (external link)
What about using EF mount lenses with an adaptor? Will we get the full 20 FPS when we use our Canon supertelephotos with the A9?

Why are you asking me? Do Canon's own EF-S lenses work on 1DX? Sony is not responsible for accommodating Canon Lenses.


Well then RAW shooters might as well just stick with their 1D series Canons and equivalent Nikons, if speed is what matters. But I though that 20 FPS and a huge buffer was the whole point of this A9.

That's if shooting RAW. What about no mirror lock - Blackout using the e-VF?? I think that's fantastic for tracking motion. A9 isn't just about 20 FPS. Yes it does 20 FPS. Do Canon 1DXII and Nikon D5 shoot 20 FPS in any condition? So, wouldn't you say this is a progress?

I just don't get it - it's like there is this "shocking announcement" about 20 FPS and a few hundred shots in a burst . . . . . but there seem to be so many exceptions to those figures that in real-world usage it won't deliver those specs to those who need them the most.

.

Again, 20 FPS isn't the only aspect of A9 that's appealing. So far, there's only 1 exception that pertains to 20 FPS. And that is, it's 12 fps RAW. F11 refers to AF tracking.

Can you itemize "so many exceptions" you're referring to?




  
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Wilt
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Post edited over 2 years ago by Wilt. (8 edits in all)
     
Apr 22, 2017 12:20 |  #124

Hogloff wrote in post #18334680 (external link)
Wilt you speaking from experience here? My Sony travel kit is roughly 40% lighter than my Canon 5d2 travel kit with same lens range coverage...yet the Sony camera/lens combination produces much better quality images.

You can cherry pick lenses like the big heavy GM lenses to make your point, but if you really want to be truthful, you would look a bit deeper yourself into the full range of lenses and you would see for yourself that you can create a much lighter kit if you really want.

I did not cherry pick lenses to compare 'kit weight'. I started my list of what was 'in the kit' by going to the Sony web site and choosing lenses in the Sony line-up that I knew had directly equivalent choice of f/stop and FL in the Canon line. I wrote the Sony lens length and weights. THEN I went to the Canon web site to get the same information for the equivalent Canon. I did not make any effort to find 'lowest number of lenses to span a given range of FL', which might give either vendor an advantage by elimination of number of lenses in the bag. It was merely 'carry a bag with a given number of lenses inside', where fixed FL might be chosen for compact shooting and best max aperture in some shooting situations, whereas zoom might be chosen for fast flexibile FL change in other shooting situations. In fact, I might have deliberated tried to bias the results in favor of the Sony, with the assumption that some of the fixed FL lenses might have been deliberately sized by Sony to be lighter and more compact to complement the smaller and lighter body (as reported in the media)... Favoritism tried to go for Sony, here!
Once the list was compiled I eliminated zero lenses from the list. Zero 'cherry picking' in the comparison. I do not know how 'more fair' of a comparison could be done for a purely objective selection list with ZERO brand loyalty on my part in doing the kit weight comparison for determining amount of weight savings as posted in post 73!


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Tom ­ Reichner
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Apr 22, 2017 12:26 |  #125

rxjohn wrote in post #18334841 (external link)
Why are you asking me?

I wasn't asking you - I was, and still am - asking the forum at large.

Just because I quote a comment you made does not mean that everything I write after that is directed at you. I quoted you so that the forum at large would have the proper context for the question that I posed.

.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"They're", "their", and "there" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"Fare" and "fair" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one. The proper expression is "moot point", NOT "mute point".

  
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Apr 22, 2017 12:29 |  #126
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Tom Reichner wrote in post #18334779 (external link)
.
It's starting to seem like it isn't really a 20 FPS camera . . . at least not when you really need it to shoot at 20 FPS.

I thought this camera was specifically geared toward to action sports and wildlife/bird market segment, because they are the people needing super-fast frame rates and a super-huge buffer size. But these are also the people who shoot almost exclusively with AF tracking engaged. And these things I have been reading make it seem like it only shoots at 10 FPS when using AF tracking.

That is strange - if your subject isn't in rapid motion and you don't need AF tracking, then you don't need fast frame rates, either. So the only times you really need 20 FPS is exactly when it will not operate at 20 FPS . . . . is this really the case?

.

10fps with adapted glass

20fps with native glass

just give it few months, and metabones and sigma will update their adapters and be able to push 20fps on adapted glass too.


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CyberDyneSystems
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Post edited over 2 years ago by CyberDyneSystems. (4 edits in all)
     
Apr 22, 2017 12:31 |  #127

OK, I am getting a lot of complaints.

THIS IS the forum for SONY Cameras.

The non SONY shooters need to stop in this thread unless you can stop nitpicking this release.

Camera brands are separated into their own forums specifically to limit this sort of bickering.
Abide by that.

There is a forum for comparing specs,
https://photography-on-the.net/forum/forumdis​play.php?f=144

Move your point counterpoint to your own thread in the proper forum.


This is not a suggestion


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Apr 22, 2017 12:38 |  #128

rxjohn wrote in post #18334788 (external link)
And I don't imagine many will be shooting at f11 with high shutter speed.


...well, at ISO 16000 and 1/8000 with f/11, it would indeed be possible to do so well within the operating limits of the A9 (or even lesser cameras)


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Apr 22, 2017 12:38 |  #129

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18334857 (external link)
OK, I am getting a lot of complaints.

THIS IS the forum for SONY Cameras.

The non SONY shooters need to stop in this thread unless you can stop nitpicking this release.

Camera brands are separated into their own forums specifically to limit this sort of bickering.
Abide by that.

There is a forum for comparing specs,
https://photography-on-the.net/forum/forumdis​play.php?f=144

Move your point counterpoint to your own thread in the proper forum.


This is not a suggestion

Thank you!




  
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Apr 22, 2017 12:39 |  #130

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18334857 (external link)
OK, I am getting a lot of complaints.

You're actually getting complaints? Sorry you have to deal with that Jake, seems a little silly. If we don't want to deal with the thread, we can just step out.


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Post edited over 2 years ago by idkdc. (3 edits in all)
     
Apr 22, 2017 12:51 |  #131

I started a thread in camera vs camera: https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1479752


Nikon Z7 / D850 | Canon C200 / 1DXII | Fujifilm XT2

  
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Apr 22, 2017 13:00 |  #132

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #18334857 (external link)
OK, I am getting a lot of complaints.

THIS IS the forum for SONY Cameras.

The non SONY shooters need to stop in this thread unless you can stop nitpicking this release.

Camera brands are separated into their own forums specifically to limit this sort of bickering.
Abide by that.

There is a forum for comparing specs,
https://photography-on-the.net/forum/forumdis​play.php?f=144

Move your point counterpoint to your own thread in the proper forum.


This is not a suggestion

That's a pity. I am a (bit of a) photographer first and a Canon shooter second. I can see a lot of axe grinding going on (from devotees of both Canon and Sony) but I felt that I was a learning a lot more about the A9 (its capabilities and its limitations, both ... everything ever made has limitations, trying to understand them is not nit-picking).

I thought it was a good, lively and informative thread despite a few OTT posts that were easy enough to discount. Anyway, no matter. So be it.


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Apr 22, 2017 13:16 |  #133

Wilt wrote in post #18334844 (external link)
I did not cherry pick lenses to compare 'kit weight'. I started my list of what was 'in the kit' by going to the Sony web site and choosing lenses in the Sony line-up that I knew had directly equivalent choice of f/stop and FL in the Canon line. I wrote the Sony lens length and weights. THEN I went to the Canon web site to get the same information for the equivalent Canon. I did not make any effort to find 'lowest number of lenses to span a given range of FL', which might give either vendor an advantage by elimination of number of lenses in the bag. It was merely 'carry a bag with a given number of lenses inside', where fixed FL might be chosen for compact shooting and best max aperture in some shooting situations, whereas zoom might be chosen for fast flexibile FL change in other shooting situations. In fact, I might have deliberated tried to bias the results in favor of the Sony, with the assumption that some of the fixed FL lenses might have been deliberately sized by Sony to be lighter and more compact to complement the smaller and lighter body (as reported in the media)... Favoritism tried to go for Sony, here!
Once the list was compiled I eliminated zero lenses from the list. Zero 'cherry picking' in the comparison. I do not know how 'more fair' of a comparison could be done for a purely objective selection list with ZERO brand loyalty on my part in doing the kit weight comparison for determining amount of weight savings as posted in post 73!

Thing is, Sony and Zeiss didn't make--and didn't feel the need to make--the FE mount lenses to be stacked up directly next to Canon's line of lenses.

Instead of a 100 2.8 Macro, Sony has a 90 2.8 Macro (and it is incredible).

The FE 55 1.8, FE 28 f2, Batis 18mm and Batis 25mm lenses also have no peer in the Canon universe.

All of the above lenses are of very manageable size and weight--and will give a nice size/weight savings to the Sony shooter while producing some of the best IQ south of Medium Format. This is bound to be attractive to a great deal of photographers, and certainly, there are many on this Sony forum who enjoy lenses like these a great deal.


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Apr 22, 2017 14:08 |  #134

https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=_ZXFI-eIXk8 (external link)

I don't know how to embed , embed link doesn't work ..

but that's a 10 second clip to the no black out shooting ,, pretty Impressive !

you wouldn't even know it was shooting if it wasn't for the edges letting you know



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Apr 22, 2017 14:59 |  #135

rantercsr wrote in post #18334962 (external link)
https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=_ZXFI-eIXk8 (external link)

I don't know how to embed , embed link doesn't work ..

but that's a 10 second clip to the no black out shooting ,, pretty Impressive !

you wouldn't even know it was shooting if it wasn't for the edges letting you know

I find it funny that I have trouble shooting too much on the Fujifilm XT2 in silent mode in high frame rate vs. the mechanical shutter with high frame rate on the 1DXII. The lack of sound is great but sound and blackout also give me an idea of my burst lengths.


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