The mount is here.... now what?

Finally the mount i ordered came before yesterday [Sunday], also with one very cheap scope that is more known as a guide scope but i will use it as a main scope starter for learning until i upgrade to a better scope as recommended.

Now, i need to polar align my mount, still don't know how, but what is after alignment the mount?

I don't have any mono or dedicated camera, so my only go is with my DSLR or mirrorless Sony, not sure if those can give me good time until i updating my current gear, not sure what accessories i need so i can use my DSLR/ML beside that T ring and adapter mount.

I am hoping to get PI sooner or later, but for now i think i have to depend on DSS for a while, the learning game will begin very soon once i setup my gear, i really don't know what i need to get started in this long exciting journey for first time [I won't consider shooting the moon or stars without tracking as serious AP].

Congrats on the mount. What did you buy?

The idea behind "polar" alignment is that as the Earth spins west to east, the mount will spin east to west and at the exact same rate. If the rotation axis of the mount is exactly parallel to the rotation axis of Earth, then the two rotations cancel each other out and your section of sky is held precisely in view without drifting. This only works if you have an "equatorial" type mount (sometimes called a "polar" mount).

These mounts often have various aids to help you polar align and should come with instructions. Sometimes there's a polar scope (aka "bore scope" if it's inserted in the bore that runs through the center of the right ascension axis).

The higher of the celestial pole above the horizon will always be equal to YOUR latitude on Earth. E.g. if you're at 30º north latitude then that means the celestial pole is 30º above the northern horizon. If you're at the north pole then the celestial pole is 90º above you (directly over your head). You get the idea.

You'll start by adjusting that altitude adjustment scale to match your latitude. Precision counts when imaging but to just get things set up you only need to be close (don't worry about being precise ... yet).

Orient the mount so that it points north and make sure it's level.

If your mount has a polar alignment scope then you can use that. Polaris is the north star but it's actually about 2/3rds of a degree away from the true north pole. So it's close but it's not close enough to ensure that you don't get smearing on long images. The polar alignment scopes usually have something that helps you determine the correct offset. There are several variations on how these polar alignment scopes work.

Some computerized go-to mounts also have a polar alignment assist feature. Basically you start with a rough alignment. It'll walk you through finding a few bright stars which you will center and align on. When the scope initially does the "go to" it will likely miss the stars (hopefully not by too much) and you use the electronic handbox to center the star and tell the computer when you've done that. The computer monitors how much of a correction you had to perform. It then goes to the next star and you center and align on that one as well. Usually the computer makes you do this for at least 3 stars (but it could be more). It will then move to a position in the sky where a star WOULD be located IF your mount had a "perfect" polar alignment. You put the keypad down (no electronics at this point) and it will instruct you to use the mechanical adjustments on the mount to center that star. Having done this, you should have a fairly close and fairly accurate polar alignment.

There are LOTS of ways to refine polar alignment accuracy. I use a somewhat new gadget (new in the last year or two) called a PoleMaster -- which seems to be able to get the most accurate polar alignment of any methods I've used to date (it's a special alignment camera that comes with software.)

Just because the mount is aligned still doesn't mean you won't get any drift or smearing of stars. Lots of things can cause that (imbalance, flexure, vibrations, stiction, periodic error in the worm, and the list goes on and on). To correct for this, you can use an auto-guider (and that's a whole new thread). But if you keep your focal lengths low then you should be able to shoot without an auto-guider (by "low" i mean under a few hundred millimeters.) I've done 8 minute exposures with a tracking head (not even a real telescope mount) at 135mm and had no noticeable star drift even on very close inspection of the image. I've also done 8 minutes unguided at 540mm (wide-field apochromatic telescope) ... but on a beefier high-quality mount and also had extremely good performance. But when you get into longer focal lengths (e.g. 1000mm... 2000mm or above) you'll definitely have to use an auto-guider for long exposure images. The guider is a separate camera that takes more frequent images and tracks the position of a single star in the frame to determine if it appears to be drifting. If it is drifting then it sends a correction to the mount to keep the mount tracking accurately.

Your DSLR cameras are fine -- I wouldn't worry about those. Picking up the reds in any deep-space emission nebulae will be more difficult with a normal camera (but still possible). Dedicated or modified astrophotography cameras do a better job at that. But there's loads that you'll be able to image even with a typical unmodified DSLR.

I would start with DSS.

I use PI but should warn you that it does have a steep learning curve. There are a number of tutorials that are useful for PI (see the website IP4AP.com). It's sometimes difficult to watch a video without also following along. So having the same sample data helps. But I've also found that I can search for YouTube videos of someone walking through the same object that I shot (so now I have data) so I can make sense of the steps... this really helped. But part of the PI learning curve isn't just the process... it's the interface. They wrote their own UI and it's not entirely intuitive. But it is the identical UI regardless of platform (how it works on Windows, Mac, & Linux looks the same.)

When you capture data... typically you'll want a minimum of 1 hours worth of data on any object. I try to capture a minimum of 2 hours. Other astrophotographers I know have shown me the difference between the quality of having 2 hours worth of data vs. 4 or even 6 hours worth of data (and it's a huge improvement.)

Software such as "Backyard EOS" can be useful to help control your camera's image-acquisition runs.

You'll need lots of normal exposures of your subject... these are typically exposures lasting several minutes and you grab as many of them as you can in the hours that you have.

For however many "lights" (normal exposures) that you shot, grab about half as many "darks". These are identical exposures to the "lights" except you cap the camera (but the lens cap on or the telescope cover on, etc.) But shoot identical exposures (same ISO, same shutter speed, etc.) and also very important that these be shot in the same temperature conditions (which is why you should do them at the same time). This is because the amount of "noise" in your background will vary based on temperature. So however much "noise" is present in your "lights" should be the same as your "darks". The computer will work that out and help cancel out the noise.

You can also capture "bias" frames -- but this doesn't have to happen at the same time. These are basically the shortest possible exposures the camera can take.

DSS (or PI) will use the "dark" and "bias" frames to create a master dark and master bias... and it will use those frames to "calibrate" each of your "light" frames. This helps subtract unwanted noise from your images (it cleans things up -- but only a little. They won't be perfect.) You now have a new set of frames which are "calibrated lights" but they are not aligned (aka "registered" to each other.)

The software will then use the star positions to "align" each frame so they all match up (otherwise you might notice tiny differences from frame to frame.) This is called "registration" of the frames. You now have a set of frames that are "calibrated + registered" light frames. These frames are finally ready to stack.

The software will ultimately stack these frames using an algorithm to create a master image which is better than any of the sub images.

If you had random noise in a frame and you "averaged" that frame with another frame that did not have a noisy pixel at the same position, then the noise will get "averaged" and now be only half as bright... but it's still there. But if you use statistical analysis (sigma clipping) to integrate the frames, then when 9 out of 10 frames don't have a noise pixel at that position but just 1 of the 10 frames does have noise at that position, the algorithm can safely determine that it a statistical outlier and can completely eliminate it (it's magic). You get a cleaner integration with these statistical methods then you do from the "average" methods (but you have to get it an adequate volume of data or it won't work well.)

This "master" image is now ready for all the rest of the processing you choose to do (and that's where you'll need to get into the tutorials on how to process the data.)

Some useful resources include:

http://photographingsp​ace.com
http://dslr-astrophotography.com
http://www.ip4ap.com (this is for PixInsight tutorials)

Clear Skies,
Tim

Thank you very much, Tim!

Very long post and too many steps to follow, i feel i will give up very late now as i am not good in those software hardware work, it may take me very long time to do them as suggested by you, and the summer is almost here, so i hope i can handle the heat and my gear too.

Thank you very much also for the links down bottom of the post, i will look at them and read/watch, i will try very hard to learn as much as i can, i don't want to give it up as i didn't start yet.

By the way, I bought Sky-Watcher AZ-EQ6 mount and a starter scope which is SW StarTravel 80mm OTA [ST80 is very good as a guide scope as you know but i will start with it as a main until i get another scope then make this ST80 as a guide scope]m someone recommended me to get another scope which is newtonian because i asked about a visual/observation not imaging scope rather than ST80 and i got so many complicated answers until someone started a challenge with me as he started in AP as well who recommended me a scope that is a tid better than his newt scope and it is not expensive and he said it is good enough for visual and it can do imaging as good too and way better than ST80, i decided i will go with his suggestion and may get that scope soon in few months without interfering with my current gear learning, visual is different than imaging anyway and not that so complicated with learning curve.

Tareq , I might take it from your post above that your situation with perhaps funding is keeping you from a better scope . Don't feel bad , we all have been there at some point . Form the scope you mentioned above I will admit that's a scope that isn't desireable for AP but until your fundings can improve you can at least learn your equipment you have now and do some visual observing . It would really help you learning the deep sky and what to expect but just observing is the greatest experience to see a deep sky objects with your own eyes and not just a picture ! Observing is awesome !!

Meanwhile if your saving for a better scope I don't know the other one that you may have a goal on but as I was looking at the one you mentioned online I see they have the same size 80mm but with ED glass which is a lot better and I have seen some very nice images taken using a scope with ED glass . They have one that is higher cost but looks like it can be in your funding range in the future and be a good scope for you to obseve with also when not imaging . Imaging is only part of the fun but if you never observe your not using your scope to full potential and I highly recommend that you do take advantage of using your scope to full advantage .

http://www.telescopes-direct.com …-refractor-telescope.html

I haven't replied to you yet because I was waiting to see if you give a little more info on exactly what your goals are and what you want . Fundings are the biggest factors in amateur astronomer and one doesn't realize how big funding can get until they are deeply hooked !! I would advise you to take it slow , don't try to absord a lot of info too quick cause it can cause you to loose interest fast by getting confused with all the info loaded on you too quick . Worst thing is when you know very little to start with and you try to learn too much too quickly at one time you'll get frustrated and forget what you already know . So take it slow and easy , take time to absorb it . You want to have fun , not feel like your in a class room of science that's way beyond most average peoples brain and in the end you'll find out that most what you read is not needed .

Just remember , have fun and enjoy the hobby and most of all make real sure you are ready to spend a lot of money you might not have or want to spend . This hobby can get very expensive !! And if you get confused from heavy reading , sit back and give your brain a breather to either absorb or reject the info . GOOD LUCK !!

Celestron wrote in post #18338631
Tareq , I might take it from your post above that your situation with perhaps funding is keeping you from a better scope . Don't feel bad , we all have been there at some point . Form the scope you mentioned above I will admit that's a scope that isn't desireable for AP but until your fundings can improve you can at least learn your equipment you have now and do some visual observing . It would really help you learning the deep sky and what to expect but just observing is the greatest experience to see a deep sky objects with your own eyes and not just a picture ! Observing is awesome !!

Meanwhile if your saving for a better scope I don't know the other one that you may have a goal on but as I was looking at the one you mentioned online I see they have the same size 80mm but with ED glass which is a lot better and I have seen some very nice images taken using a scope with ED glass . They have one that is higher cost but looks like it can be in your funding range in the future and be a good scope for you to obseve with also when not imaging . Imaging is only part of the fun but if you never observe your not using your scope to full potential and I highly recommend that you do take advantage of using your scope to full advantage .

http://www.telescopes-direct.com …-refractor-telescope.html

I haven't replied to you yet because I was waiting to see if you give a little more info on exactly what your goals are and what you want . Fundings are the biggest factors in amateur astronomer and one doesn't realize how big funding can get until they are deeply hooked !! I would advise you to take it slow , don't try to absord a lot of info too quick cause it can cause you to loose interest fast by getting confused with all the info loaded on you too quick . Worst thing is when you know very little to start with and you try to learn too much too quickly at one time you'll get frustrated and forget what you already know . So take it slow and easy , take time to absorb it . You want to have fun , not feel like your in a class room of science that's way beyond most average peoples brain and in the end you'll find out that most what you read is not needed .

Just remember , have fun and enjoy the hobby and most of all make real sure you are ready to spend a lot of money you might not have or want to spend . This hobby can get very expensive !! And if you get confused from heavy reading , sit back and give your brain a breather to either absorb or reject the info . GOOD LUCK !!

This is exactly what i want to do, to enjoy and have fun, and taking my time, i am not in rush, and things will come slowly on time if i have a long life.

Well, i know my scope isn't good for AP, i just will use it to put my feet in first step, actually many members in astronomy sites advised or suggested me to use my DSLR + lens instead, i just bought this scope to give me idea about what is the scope and how to use it and most important what accessories to use for the scopes such as EPs, Barlow, filters,...etc.

The one that members advised or recommended me to get as the scope is SW Esprit 80ED Triplet APO, it is very expensive, but as long i afforded a mount that is almost same expensive as this scope then it won't be difficult for me, in fact i found a great site where i can get those gear at lowest price as i can get, so i found this scope at good price even expensive which i may afford in about 4-5 months if i seriously started to save.

But also someone who i started or he started a challenge with me told me or suggested that i should go with Newtonian now for observing and it can do imaging as i already have a cheap scope for imaging and no need to rush for expensive one, he also said that this scope he told me about is a step forward of that ST80, regardless it is a cheap one but it can do more than my ST80, so i like his idea. The scope he recommended me to get is SkyWatcher Explorer 200P-DS, he has 130P version, and i told him about 300PDS or 250P, he said that 200PDS is just the right one for weight and value and also quality, sure the others are great quality but the weight/load capacity might not help for my expensive mount, so i just better to listen to him and don't want to go so further with my own decision.

OTOH, i also look at filters and mono dedicated cameras, those also have own big budget, i don't want to start simple or weak, i may afford to a limit, but i try hard to not go very cheap as well, i bought a mount that they told me it is only intermediate and not yet top of the line, but that is my limit for a mount, and it will serve me well for long time until i get very serious and upgrade the mount when needed but not any soon yet, so i just need to get that scope which will live with me for long time as well, no necessary a very very expensive one, but definitely not this one of ST80, and as i said it will be a good scope as a guide scope.

Tareq wrote in post #18338864
This is exactly what i want to do, to enjoy and have fun, and taking my time, i am not in rush, and things will come slowly on time if i have a long life.

Well, i know my scope isn't good for AP, i just will use it to put my feet in first step, actually many members in astronomy sites advised or suggested me to use my DSLR + lens instead, i just bought this scope to give me idea about what is the scope and how to use it and most important what accessories to use for the scopes such as EPs, Barlow, filters,...etc.

The one that members advised or recommended me to get as the scope is SW Esprit 80ED Triplet APO, it is very expensive, but as long i afforded a mount that is almost same expensive as this scope then it won't be difficult for me, in fact i found a great site where i can get those gear at lowest price as i can get, so i found this scope at good price even expensive which i may afford in about 4-5 months if i seriously started to save.

But also someone who i started or he started a challenge with me told me or suggested that i should go with Newtonian now for observing and it can do imaging as i already have a cheap scope for imaging and no need to rush for expensive one, he also said that this scope he told me about is a step forward of that ST80, regardless it is a cheap one but it can do more than my ST80, so i like his idea. The scope he recommended me to get is SkyWatcher Explorer 200P-DS, he has 130P version, and i told him about 300PDS or 250P, he said that 200PDS is just the right one for weight and value and also quality, sure the others are great quality but the weight/load capacity might not help for my expensive mount, so i just better to listen to him and don't want to go so further with my own decision.

OTOH, i also look at filters and mono dedicated cameras, those also have own big budget, i don't want to start simple or weak, i may afford to a limit, but i try hard to not go very cheap as well, i bought a mount that they told me it is only intermediate and not yet top of the line, but that is my limit for a mount, and it will serve me well for long time until i get very serious and upgrade the mount when needed but not any soon yet, so i just need to get that scope which will live with me for long time as well, no necessary a very very expensive one, but definitely not this one of ST80, and as i said it will be a good scope as a guide scope.

I like how you are being smart . I like the fact you want to learn the observation looking through the scope and seeing objects in the sky with your own eyes . I don't know how much you have already observed but I have a feeling your really going to enjoy what you do . Have a great day and keep us updated on your progress !!

Celestron wrote in post #18338906
I like how you are being smart . I like the fact you want to learn the observation looking through the scope and seeing objects in the sky with your own eyes . I don't know how much you have already observed but I have a feeling your really going to enjoy what you do . Have a great day and keep us updated on your progress !!

I already have a binocular regardless it is not that much good [8x42], but the scope will do better for me than this binocular, and while i am at it i will observe one time and do little imaging another time so i can do both, and this way it will help me to explore the sky better and at the same time i learn about imaging.

I do have Stellarium on my phone, it is very handy, actually i know the location of objects from this app, Jupiter is very easy to find in the sky and it is almost everyday over my head, and the moon is brightest after the sun that i can see, hehehe, also the big dipper is over my head and i make it as my reference always, so i know where is the Polaris regardless i can't see it, but i will keep observing no matter what.

In fact i am more interested in imaging than observing, if i want observing then i will definitely buy another scope and maybe another mount, many recommended me to go with a Dob if i want extensively visual only or mostly, but i started in this field for imaging over observing, and i am not worry about observing, in fact 2 months ago i bought a telescope which is Celestron Astromaster 130EQ but i returned it back next day or 2 days maximum because many told me it is fine and good for visual only and not so for imaging, so if i wanted observing i could just keep it or buy it again.

Tareq , I checked out your galleries and gear list and Facebook links you have listed . I'm kinda of confused .... , I've mistaken your financial status . From your gear list you should be able to purchase some of the best scopes and all equipment needed for AP . You have more and better equip that a large majority of people on this forum including me . What is your interest in AP ?

Celestron wrote in post #18339060
Tareq , I checked out your galleries and gear list and Facebook links you have listed . I'm kinda of confused .... , I've mistaken your financial status . From your gear list you should be able to purchase some of the best scopes and all equipment needed for AP . You have more and better equip that a large majority of people on this forum including me . What is your interest in AP ?

Thanks, but not necessary!

In the past i was working and i did put most of my budget to photography only, but since about 3-4 years ago and i left my job and faced so bad situations my financial status isn't that much good, but i try to keep on track with my hobby, i still need to sell some of my old gear to upgrade something, and this AP is new line of investment which i am not yet much ready for it, but i did buy something after all.

In AP i simply interested in DSO, i told people on another sites that i am not into visual/observation, but few weeks ago when i saw that Jupiter just near/closer to the moon i got interested in watching planets only as well, so that i asked them about a scope for visual, but that caused big debating as they confused with me or misunderstanding me, they thought i want a scope for imaging planets next to visual, but i told them i want it only for visual, but if it can do imaging then why not, but my main first big interest in AP is DeepSpace no doubt.