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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 18 Jun 2017 (Sunday) 12:10
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Help a newb with flash setup please

 
Islandphoneman
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Jun 18, 2017 12:10 |  #1

Hello all, I've been reading here for a little while and thanks to all of your knowledge, am wanting to get setup with a new speedlite for off camera portraitrature, mainly of my kids, indoors and out. I am using a Canon 70D and would like to add to/upgrade to more speedlites/strobes. My indoor area to work with is 11'Wide x 20' Long x8' Tall. My budget is 200.00~ For the initial flash purchase and thought I'd start out with 1 speedlight, 1 controller, a stand, reflector, and a modifier? To help me learn, then add another speedlite or two and or strobe? As I go along...am I headed in the right direction? Any suggestions on which route to go with as far as the actual setup/brands, etc. thank you for any help,
Travis




  
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Wilt
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Post edited over 6 years ago by Wilt.
     
Jun 18, 2017 12:20 |  #2

You do not mention what flash you already own, so we have no idea of its remote feature compatability. If you own a flash which is fully Canon wireless flash compatible (not all flash units are 'Canon wireless compatible', many are radio remote compatible only with their own brand of remote transmitter/receiver) just get yourself another Canon-wireless compatible flash unit.


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Islandphoneman
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Jun 18, 2017 12:23 |  #3

No current flash.




  
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MalVeauX
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Post edited over 6 years ago by MalVeauX. (3 edits in all)
     
Jun 18, 2017 12:41 |  #4

Heya,

With $200, I would go with a single good light. Speedlites are great, portable, and run outside with you. You don't need much to get them working. If you plan the day and use them in early morning or late evening light, they can be powerful enough to handle those situations (but they're limited in full sun except at extremely close proximity to subject).

Before you get into speedlites, I would suggest you do a little reading on your 70D though; it's known to have an issue with ETTL bounce exposure specifically, and that's going to be quite similar to off-camera lighting work. You may want to research this and test it before getting into something (specific to ETTL and bouncing off a surface, not direct flash). If you're shooting manual, it won't matter. Just something to know about.

Stand:

I would get a good stand, with a boom arm. Sometimes you want your light above the subject, but not in the FOV from your perspective. Booms do that. Don't skimp on your primary stand. You need a good, stable, strong stand to put your light where you want it. It's going to be close to the subject, so you'll want a boom to be able to move it around and position it, closely, without having to dodge the center column in your FOV.

Suggest: This stand (external link) ($89) - This is cheap for what it does.

Speedlite Mount & Modifier Mount:

There are cheap things out there that hold a flash. But I'd suggest you go with something strong, holds the flash well and safely, doesn't stress the shoe, and has two modifier mounts (bowens and umbrella) so that it can be adaptable for you. S-Brackets do this.

Suggest: Godox S-Bracket (external link) ($20)

Modifier:

Starting out, I'd go with a simple umbrella or a brolly box (umbrella style softbox). They're inexpensive and very good. Light weight. An umbrella will spill more light around it. A softbox will control spill a little more. Just depends on what you're going for and how much control you want. I'd get something in the 43~48" range. Bigger is softer relative to the subject, so a big source near your subject produces soft light. Also, a bigger modifier will allow you to light up more than one person from a distance without it being too harsh of light.

Suggest: Westscott 43" Umbrella (external link) ($20) | or 47" Brolly Box (external link) ($35)

Speedlite:

Picking a light is more than just the light, you want to pay attention to the communication system too, since you're going off camera. You want a communication system that is broad and works with lots of things and doesn't block out potential lights in the future from use, then you end up rebuying stuff. The R2 system is pretty great and very all-encompassing. You can't go wrong with it. That way you can grow your fleet of lights in the future and doesn't matter if it's a speedlite, strobe or whatever, the R2 system will command them all. Also you want a light that has a built in wifi receiver if possible; less batteries, less stuff to get, the newer systems have these, so go for that for sure. That means getting a single transmitter (R2 system) to talk to everything from the camera, so you'll be getting just one. From there, you could go with manual lights. Or you could go ahead and get something with ETTL & HSS so that you have those options whether you use them or not. Outside, you'll probably want that HSS option. And sometimes you may want ETTL for when you cannot setup a shoot and just take spontaneous shots. It's better to have the option than not. I use all manual lights, but I always keep a single ETTL/HSS capable flash in there so that I can use it on-camera for spontaneous stuff that cannot be redone. Very useful with kids! I'd look at the Godox R2 system. You can get it under Flashpoint as a rebrand from Adorama.

Suggest: Flashpoint (Godox) TT685C (external link) ($120) & Flashpoint (Godox) X1T-C (external link) ($49)

$300 budget. But no cut corners. All good reliable stuff. Lots of room to grow.

Then, to grow the system, just add more R2 system flashes/strobes. This flash can be used in every way you can think of. On-camera. Off-camera. With ETTL/HSS, or just go manual. It will get you all the potential to learn. Even if you move on to bigger strobes later and go nuts, this flash will still be super useful on your camera for ETTL/HSS spontaneous shooting in the light with kids outside.

You can then add manual lights on the same system for an inexpensive cost, that have wifi receivers and work on the same system (R2): Flashpoint R2 TT600 (external link) ($69) a piece, so you can flesh it out to 2 or 3 lights as you wish. Or more.

+++++++++++++++

If you end up wanting to add a powerful strobe for outdoor HSS work, budget will need to increase significantly.

Strobes indoor, even cheap ones, can be great because you don't have to have batteries, etc, and can get powerful light for big modifiers on the cheap. But, they will be wired, no ETTL/HSS (not needed inside anyways really). They can be very useful though simply for lots and lots of shooting being wired instead of on batteries. So if you see yourself going this direction ever, or even now, this is another subject to expand upon.

+++++++++++++++

Example of why I stress a good boom stand for your speedlite for creative control:

IMAGE: https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/258/18314397900_f90f8a60fc_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/tUo5​r3  (external link) IMG_7882 (external link) by Martin Wise (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/428/18565690325_b935d65268_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/uhA1​V4  (external link) setupshot_cellphone_st​alker (external link) by Martin Wise (external link), on Flickr

Stopped down ambient with 4 stops of ND filter (I didn't have HSS, this is a basic manual speedlite). But, at very close range in a larger modifier, you can get soft light even in sun. Boom gets it out of the field of view and close to the subject, without an assistant.

IMAGE: https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/297/18315595959_1090fb251f_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/tUud​ze  (external link) IMG_4179 (external link) by Martin Wise (external link), on Flickr

+++++++++++++++

Or, basic on-camera use, with ETTL & HSS employed so that you can combat sun for fill flash without looking flashed (ETTL & HSS together is really, really awesome and allows you to do things with no 2nd chances):

IMAGE: https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3686/32795496880_a4c44bbe35_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/RY2u​Do  (external link) IMG_5208 (external link) by Martin Wise (external link), on Flickr

Very best,

My Flickr (external link) :: My Astrobin (external link)

  
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Islandphoneman
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Post edited over 6 years ago by Islandphoneman.
     
Jun 18, 2017 13:27 |  #5

Thank you for the comments and suggestions. I mainly use the 70D for video and am just now delving into the world of flash photography to mainly capture my children and occasional friend/family member who might want a photo taken. I don't really have the budget for another body for photo so I have to work with the 70D.
Thank you again for pointing me in the right direction. The setup you posted was close to what I was thinking about, minus the boom stand, but I see what you are saying about it.




  
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Islandphoneman
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Jun 18, 2017 21:50 |  #6

Is the 70D that bad? I have another 500 budgeted for a decent used old series 24-105 L lens. Should I not be worrying about that yet and use that money towards another body for photos? or go 80D? I currently have the 18-55 kit, 10-18 STM, 50 1.8, and 75-300 USM basic telephoto lenses. Getting off topic of flashes, maybe this should go in another thread?




  
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Jun 18, 2017 22:31 |  #7

Islandphoneman wrote in post #18381588 (external link)
Is the 70D that bad? I have another 500 budgeted for a decent used old series 24-105 L lens. Should I not be worrying about that yet and use that money towards another body for photos? or go 80D? I currently have the 18-55 kit, 10-18 STM, 50 1.8, and 75-300 USM basic telephoto lenses. Getting off topic of flashes, maybe this should go in another thread?

Yes, off topic, but why put a FF lens on a crop body? Check out

https://www.dpreview.c​om/forums/post/5331514​8 (external link)


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Islandphoneman
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Jun 18, 2017 22:46 |  #8

Archibald wrote in post #18381616 (external link)
Yes, off topic, but why put a FF lens on a crop body? Check out

https://www.dpreview.c​om/forums/post/5331514​8 (external link)

I do plan on also acquiring a FF in the future.




  
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Jun 18, 2017 22:52 |  #9

Islandphoneman wrote in post #18381623 (external link)
I do plan on also acquiring a FF in the future.

Then acquire the FF lens in the future. They are much cheaper in a kit.


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Islandphoneman
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Jun 18, 2017 23:10 |  #10

Archibald wrote in post #18381626 (external link)
Then acquire the FF lens in the future. They are much cheaper in a kit.

It would most likely be used and it looks like most are usually sold separately.




  
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Post edited over 6 years ago by Archibald.
     
Jun 19, 2017 00:39 |  #11

Islandphoneman wrote in post #18381638 (external link)
It would most likely be used and it looks like most are usually sold separately.

Is it because you want an L lens? The 24-105 isn't that good, and has no wide angle on a crop.


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MalVeauX
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Jun 19, 2017 07:10 |  #12

Stick with your APS-C and current lenses.

Lighting is more important.

You have a good selection of focal lengths to work with already. And they're fine.

Going full frame and adding a kit L lens aren't magic bullets, you can make awesome portraits with what you have already.

Very best,


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Jun 19, 2017 09:19 as a reply to  @ MalVeauX's post |  #13

I second MalVeaux. I shoot with the 70D for work, and it's plenty capable of taking great images. FF is great for people who need it, but if you're just shooting friends and families, FF would honestly be overkill. You're not going to be pasting your family on billboards, right? I recently watched a talk by photog Jason Lanier, and he said any time he considers a new gear purchase, he asks himself, "How is this equipment going to pay me back?" If you don't have a specific plan for making your investment back on a full-frame body, I wouldn't buy it. And if a cropped-sensor body can only pay you back by providing sufficient images of the people you love, why spend more on FF?

Regarding what to buy, I again concur with MalVeaux. $200 isn't much when building even a basic flash setup, so consider starting with the most essential pieces and expanding your budget as you're able.

I've had a good experience with flashes within the Godox family. (I use Cheetahstand lights, which are apparently made by Godox but branded differently.) Also, David Hobby of The Strobist (external link) recommends the LumoPro LP180 (external link). I've learned a lot from his blog, and even though I use something different than what he recommends, I'd be willing to bet his gear suggestions are solid. He apparently has a deal with Midwest Photo to sell some "Strobist kits" containing the LP180: https://mpex.com …stdeals-completepage.html (external link)

Best wishes as you embark on this new journey! I'm still learning myself, but off-camera flash has really taken my shooting to a different level. I'm certain that you're going to find a world of amazing creative possibilities as you explore and build your skills.


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Islandphoneman
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Jun 19, 2017 10:19 |  #14

Archibald wrote in post #18381671 (external link)
Is it because you want an L lens? The 24-105 isn't that good, and has no wide angle on a crop.

Sure it is, with everything I've read, I would think it would be more capable than my current "kit" lens as far as longer focal length overall, sharper image? and a constant apature would be nice also. Maybe I'm wrong in my thinking.




  
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Islandphoneman
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Jun 19, 2017 10:25 |  #15

MalVeauX wrote in post #18381789 (external link)
Stick with your APS-C and current lenses.

Lighting is more important.

You have a good selection of focal lengths to work with already. And they're fine.

Going full frame and adding a kit L lens aren't magic bullets, you can make awesome portraits with what you have already.

Very best,

I can appreciate that. I understand that a lens or a body is not the be all answer to produce the best image, I was just under the impression that I could benefit from having a "better" lens.
Maybe I should spend more on lighting and less on lenses for now.
Thank you for your input.




  
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