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FORUMS General Gear Talk Changing Camera Brands 
Thread started 10 Aug 2017 (Thursday) 09:41
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Moving to Fuji

 
welshwizard1971
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Mar 07, 2018 12:37 |  #211

I suppose this reminds me of when digital came out, I was a late convert as the quality wasn't there, yes is was convenient, no film, it versatile, but as a whole package, it took a while, but when it did become the real deal, I threw my lot in with it, 20D being my first.. The same as mirrorless, yes it's smaller, yes it's lighter, in the main cheaper, and the IQ can be great, but the range isn't there, the lenses aren't there, it's not quite the whole package, yet. And that's my point, people should stop going on about them like they;re the best things in the world, they're not, they might be in the future, but they're not now, so please could mirrorless users stop behaving all superior and snobby and behaving like they are, any by the same token, could DSLR users stop looking down their noses as what is obviously an interesting and fast developing quality product. Back to my original point, which I'm obviously struggling to make, nobody likes fanboys............


5DIII, 40D, 16-35L 35 ART 50 ART 100L macro, 24-70 L Mk2, 135L 200L 70-200L f4 IS
Hype chimping - The act of looking at your screen after every shot, then wildly behaving like it's the best picture in the world, to try and impress other photographers around you.

  
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Two ­ Hot ­ Shoes
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Mar 07, 2018 13:32 |  #212

Mirrorless lenses don't have the range yet, range for what? Are you talking the super telephoto range cause it's the only one I can see mirrorless missing at this point in time.
For what I shoot they have more than the range. Nothing snobby in stating the facts, especially when you are able back them up. Fanboys or not has nothing to do with it. Simply I've found Fuji mirrorless a great fit for my work. Like others, I'll give my opinion and offer up help and advice when asked, if you don't like that, well...

The world loves a trier, so I'm sure if you keep pushing you point someone will placate your needs. The rest of us will hopefully steer clear of name calling, I'd imagine. :love:


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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welshwizard1971
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Mar 07, 2018 13:42 |  #213

And that sums up my point perfectly, your argument is full of caveats or limitations because mirrorless are not the 'full package', despite the baffling ongoing claims by people that they are.

Of course they have the range of lenses! ( Well, not super tele obviously, but apart from that they've got everything )

For what I shoot they have more than enough range ( what about everybody else then? )

Nothing snobby in stating facts when you can back them up ( picking one or two sports/nature photographers who use Fuji from 10,000 worldwide pro's isn't backing up your facts )

It suits your needs, great, good for you, but mirrorless are clearly are not 'there' for everyone, so could people stop stating that they are, when they are demonstrably, not.


5DIII, 40D, 16-35L 35 ART 50 ART 100L macro, 24-70 L Mk2, 135L 200L 70-200L f4 IS
Hype chimping - The act of looking at your screen after every shot, then wildly behaving like it's the best picture in the world, to try and impress other photographers around you.

  
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welshwizard1971
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Mar 07, 2018 13:48 |  #214

Two Hot Shoes wrote in post #18579244 (external link)
Well now in fairness you made it out that those photographers were paid stooges, touting 'the good word'. Being paid an appearance fee to speak at an event is entirely different.
X-Photographers don't review cameras journalists do. An X-photographer might help develop a camera, that is a different thing altogether.

You are the only one going on about them surpassing DSLR's for sports photography, you brought it up. No one else here has mentioned that.

Some of them are using them for sports, some of which have a relationship with Fuji. Do you really think they'd be using them for their paid gigs, for clients if the cameras weren't up for the job? I think not. There is no restriction placed using gear, an X-Photogrpaher is free to use whatever cameras they like for what ever reason.

Paid is paid, they put it all on their tax returns.

I was quoting an X photographer who said he was paid to go to Japan to review a prototype camera for Fuji, and the feedback was given to the engineers, so it's not just journalists who review cameras.

They're using them for paid gigs when it plays to the strengths of the camera, not a a problem with that, I'm not seeing any used for extreme sports or lion spotting for example, so I'm less convinced by the argument that they can be used for this, despite one or two sports shots from close to medium range, or wildlife shots from a moderate distance in good light......


5DIII, 40D, 16-35L 35 ART 50 ART 100L macro, 24-70 L Mk2, 135L 200L 70-200L f4 IS
Hype chimping - The act of looking at your screen after every shot, then wildly behaving like it's the best picture in the world, to try and impress other photographers around you.

  
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nqjudo
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Post edited 3 months ago by nqjudo with reason 'spelling.'.
     
Mar 07, 2018 14:45 |  #215

Wow. I cannot believe this thread. The only thing that anyone has managed to say is that they have made a good choice for themselves. It is impossible to say what choice is good or bad beyond your own subjective needs. I can't understand the time and energy that some of you have spent to state nothing more than the simple truth that people rely on different solutions because everyone has different requirements. I'd hate to see a world bereft of choice so I consider the availability of different systems a positive thing. Even if I think some of them are ill suited for my use.

I'm amazed at cyclical nature of these mirrorless debates, the fanaticism with which they are pursued and how they often involve the same members. If the camera does the job I need it to do does it really matter which brand name is displayed on the front or whether it has a mirror? It doesn't to me because I make my choices based upon my criteria and the same goes for you. Where's the problem? The undertone of superiority, sarcasm and contempt (if not loathing) that many of these post contain simply because someone chooses a different path is disconcerting. With all due respect you guys have to give it a rest. I know members who don't come around that much anymore because of this stuff. It went beyond a sensible or healthy debate long ago.


No photographer is as good as the simplest camera. - Edward Steichen.

  
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AlanU
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Mar 07, 2018 14:50 |  #216

05Xrunner wrote in post #18579565 (external link)
it was ok back in the day but things have changed. New comers are making cameras and throwing everything in them even high end features for much less money. Nikon even stepped in and is giving much more into all of their bodies not caring it seems if it overlaps with upper end ones. Canon is still here making sure users do not get anything that might overlap anything from a higher end body. They are behind the times and its showing with the pathetic attempts at mirrorless and the lacking of any decent mirrorless lens lineup. Oh and them releasing a new camera that is basically a T4i and acting like they are doing people a favor by making it cheap.
I am out and not really a brand loyal as i am interested in Sony and Olympus but I do feel I am done with ever purchasing a DSLR again.

That's Canon for you!!! They've always been like that since the beginning!!!

I still love using my Canon gear. Heavy as it is I am able to get 100% of the results I want with only a weight penalty. Fuji on the other hand still isn't giving me some clean files I want in low light. This is just one of my demands on gear where in some cases I know I will like my new A7iii as it appears it'll be cleaner than my 5dmk4 in low light.

Since I'm a static/slow moving shooter and need some decent video capabilities I love Fuji for what I can do with it. I have zero interest in Oly or Panny now as the sensor limitation just cannot get dramatically better.

In a month's time the real world hands on experience with the A7iii will be interesting. The price to performance ratio is an incredible deal. X-H1will be accepted for Fuji shooters wanting a bigger grip while the A7iii is disrupting G.A.S decisions for Canon/Nikon users. Non Fuji shooters will probably have a harder choice in selecting mirrorless now because the A7iii is an ideal bridge for Canon dslr users. If I love the A7iii I will be considering on buying an A7Rmkiii......still can't let my Canon go just yet.


5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 24LmkII | 35mm f/2 IS | 85 mkII L | 100L | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
Fuji X-T2 w/battery booster | 16mm f/1.4 | 56 f/1.2 | 10-24 f/4.0 | 50-140 | TT685
Sony A7iii w/ Sigma MC-11 adapter | Godox V860iiS

  
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05Xrunner
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Post edited 3 months ago by 05Xrunner. (2 edits in all)
     
Mar 07, 2018 15:20 |  #217

I really like that a7III but my one big draw against sony is that I feel going mirrorless you should be saving size and weight. Sony bodies are just a tiny bit smaller than like the 7D but the lenses are no difference in size to a regular DSLR. My final straw of how I feel about the systems was a month or so ago I was at the zoo with my 7DII, 70-200,150-600,35IS,100f2 and my shoulders were killing me at the end of the day because of my bag.
I made the choice that day i am going mirrorless and now I got a decent little shooting kit with my Fuji when we head to Disney at the end of April I can carry ALL my gear in my small ThinkTank 25i that ONLY fits the Tamron 70-200. The 3 lenses and the XT1 weigh close to the same as just the 70-200. I am into more enjoyable shooting and not dragging myself down like I use to with tons of heavy gear on my back
Just a quick visual. All 3 lenses and body in the bag takes up same space as the 70-200


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Two ­ Hot ­ Shoes
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Post edited 3 months ago by Two Hot Shoes. (4 edits in all)
     
Mar 07, 2018 15:26 |  #218

welshwizard1971 wrote in post #18579767 (external link)
And that sums up my point perfectly, your argument is full of caveats or limitations because mirrorless are not the 'full package', despite the baffling ongoing claims by people that they are.

Of course they have the range of lenses! ( Well, not super tele obviously, but apart from that they've got everything )

For what I shoot they have more than enough range ( what about everybody else then? )

Nothing snobby in stating facts when you can back them up ( picking one or two sports/nature photographers who use Fuji from 10,000 worldwide pro's isn't backing up your facts )

It suits your needs, great, good for you, but mirrorless are clearly are not 'there' for everyone, so could people stop stating that they are, when they are demonstrably, not.

What is the full package? a 2000mm or a 4mm?? Really what is it?

I have no idea what you need to shoot or anyone else for that matter, I can only say that the range offered with mirrorless is full for my needs. 10mm to 400mm. YMMV

Demonstrating that Fuji can be used for sports/wildlife by showing examples of the cameras being used (and the photos) is being snobby - Riiiiight... :rolleyes: One person says they can't be used that way, another person points out four photographers that create great imagery with the system. Somehow that is not providing any proof. OK then, I guess those photos where shot on a sound stage in Hollywood so. It's like saying that of the 10,000s of 21ft boats, none can sail non stop around the world. Well go ask Alessandro Di Benedetto about it and see what he says. You see proof it happened.

No one here is saying 'mirrorless are clearly 'there' for everyone'. People are offering their experience and opinions. I think that many here have demonstrably proven they are very capable - did you even read through the thread - lots of demonstrably proven posts on there. If they are not for you then fine, no one is going to care all that much, shoot what ever you want.


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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Two ­ Hot ­ Shoes
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Mar 07, 2018 15:44 |  #219

welshwizard1971 wrote in post #18579772 (external link)
Paid is paid, they put it all on their tax returns.

I was quoting an X photographer who said he was paid to go to Japan to review a prototype camera for Fuji, and the feedback was given to the engineers, so it's not just journalists who review cameras.

They're using them for paid gigs when it plays to the strengths of the camera, not a a problem with that, I'm not seeing any used for extreme sports or lion spotting for example, so I'm less convinced by the argument that they can be used for this, despite one or two sports shots from close to medium range, or wildlife shots from a moderate distance in good light......


Would you go and offer your experience and expertise for free to a company that was using it to make a product they charged for or would you like to get paid to all the hard work and practice you did in getting to the top of your field? Yeaaaaa, and you point? No professional will use a bit of gear for paid work if they believe it won't or can't to the job.

Lion spotting, did you even bother to look at Peter Delaney's work? He seams to manage to to it. What makes you different?


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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Charlie
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Mar 07, 2018 16:01 |  #220

05Xrunner wrote in post #18579835 (external link)
I really like that a7III but my one big draw against sony is that I feel going mirrorless you should be saving size and weight. Sony bodies are just a tiny bit smaller than like the 7D but the lenses are no difference in size to a regular DSLR. My final straw of how I feel about the systems was a month or so ago I was at the zoo with my 7DII, 70-200,150-600,35IS,100f2 and my shoulders were killing me at the end of the day because of my bag.
I made the choice that day i am going mirrorless and now I got a decent little shooting kit with my Fuji when we head to Disney at the end of April I can carry ALL my gear in my small ThinkTank 25i that ONLY fits the Tamron 70-200. The 3 lenses and the XT1 weigh close to the same as just the 70-200. I am into more enjoyable shooting and not dragging myself down like I use to with tons of heavy gear on my back
Just a quick visual. All 3 lenses and body in the bag takes up same space as the 70-200
thumbnail
Hosted photo: posted by 05Xrunner in
./showthread.php?p=185​79835&i=i180693807
forum: Changing Camera Brands

not really true about large sony lenses, there are plenty of options. The flexibility shouldnt be confused with inherently large. I hate carrying 70-200 f2.8, but I have one either way. My 135A is big, 600 prime is massive.

Doesnt really mean that the system is inherently big.

12-24 is tiny for what it is
28 f2
voigtlander 35 f1.7
35 f2.8
50 f1.8
85 f1.8

these arent big lenses and I have them next to a 70-200 f2.8 for size ref. I never carry all these lenses at once, they just offer flexibility for different shooting scenarios.

My daily carry a7 body + 35 f2.8, under 800g total


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Sony A7rii/A7riii - FE 12-24/4 - FE 24-240 - FE 28/2 - FE 35/2.8 - FE 50/1.8 - FE 85/1.8 - EF 135/1.8 Art - F 600/5.6 - CZ 35-70, 100-300 - Astro Rok 14/2.8, 24/1.4 - Tamron 28-75 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8 VC

  
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05Xrunner
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Mar 07, 2018 16:35 |  #221

I was looking and the lenses that interested me was the 24-105, 50 1.8, 85 1.8 and would get the sigma mc11 for my 150-600 and Tamron 70-200. But I doubt that would happen anytime soon. More interested in upgrading to the xt2


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Two ­ Hot ­ Shoes
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Mar 07, 2018 16:59 |  #222

By brother shoots M 4/3 for his video stuff, the lenses are really tiny alright.

For me (and as a disclaimer to those you are demanding in that way) for what I need out of a camera system as a working professional, there are the pros in whatever order they pop into my head.

1. Size and weight - lighter and smaller than most DSLRs, much better for travelling and working long days with.
2. Fast shutter - being able to shoot 1/32000 shutter speed is great on bright days with wide open apertures.
3. Totally silent operation - well almost silent, great in churches so the camera doesn't take away from the mood.
4. Price - Fuji not the cheapest out there but in comparison and balance to what I owner on Canon it's a bargain.
5. Control - Subjective I know, I like the controls on the Fuji, that aperture ring :love:.
6. Kaizen - Fujis continual updating the cameras to improve and add new features, for free.
7. EVF - seeing the shot real time and shooting in the dark is great because of the new EVF.
8. JPEG output - Man, those Fuji JPEG colours are lovely
9. Fuji listen to their photographers/customer​s and act towards those suggestions.
10. The GFX - DMF at that price :eek:
11. The lenses - Fuji designed lenses for Hasselblad H series & have amazing broadcast (tv) lenses, their X series lenses are really good for the most part. More are added each year.
12. How easy it is to manual focus - truly enjoyable for me.

The list of cons is probably as big, there are always things to improve on like eye AF, and AF speed in general, internal buffer & ISO performance as it is with all the brands. With Fuji at least I know that most of the improvements will make their way to my camera via firmware updates as they improve it over the years. I wont be forced to buy a whole camera just to get a new feature (that is software based).

Your needs might be different, these are my views is all. My reasons in moving to Fuji mirrorless.


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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AlanU
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Mar 08, 2018 09:31 as a reply to  @ 05Xrunner's post |  #223

Knowing that the XH1 is a more responsive body I think it’s a great step in upgrade path if your style and preferences want overall upgrade. Can’t get over Fuji not using Gfx battery in the bulky grip of the XH1.

For the money .....features wise and “better” universal use I would take the XH1.

I careless of the looks of retro but wanted performance of a capable camera. This is why I got the Fuji. The new XH1 is more of a workhorse imo due to ibis feature that can be beneficial to hobbyists and pros.

People can say they do not need ibis but once you use those capabilities it’s just adding improvement that truly will help in cases. Blurry images due to hand shake just isn’t cool when your in some lighting situations that can be prevented with ibis when you are already pushing high iso.


5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 24LmkII | 35mm f/2 IS | 85 mkII L | 100L | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
Fuji X-T2 w/battery booster | 16mm f/1.4 | 56 f/1.2 | 10-24 f/4.0 | 50-140 | TT685
Sony A7iii w/ Sigma MC-11 adapter | Godox V860iiS

  
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EverydayGetaway
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Mar 08, 2018 10:11 |  #224

AlanU wrote in post #18580327 (external link)
Knowing that the XH1 is a more responsive body I think it’s a great step in upgrade path if your style and preferences want overall upgrade. Can’t get over Fuji not using Gfx battery in the bulky grip of the XH1.

For the money .....features wise and “better” universal use I would take the XH1.

I careless of the looks of retro but wanted performance of a capable camera. This is why I got the Fuji. The new XH1 is more of a workhorse imo due to ibis feature that can be beneficial to hobbyists and pros.

People can say they do not need ibis but once you use those capabilities it’s just adding improvement that truly will help in cases. Blurry images due to hand shake just isn’t cool when your in some lighting situations that can be prevented with ibis when you are already pushing high iso.

Interesting coming from someone who has yet to own a camera with IBIS yet it's been out for years...

Also, go ahead and quote one person in this thread who said anything about shooting Fuji for its "retro looks"... I'll wait.

The a6500 was out before the X-T2, I'm kind of baffled why you didn't buy one of those instead if the only thing that brought you to Fuji was "performance". It has pretty equal performance and has IBIS and Sony's eye detection AF... interesting.


Fuji X-Pro2 // Fuji X-T1 // Fuji X-100T // XF 18mm f2 // XF 35mm f1.4 // XF 60mm f2.4 // Rokinon 12mm f2 // Rokinon 21mm f1.4 // XF 18-55mm f/2.8-4 // XF 55-200mm f3.5-4.8 // Rokinon 85mm f1.4 // Zhonghi Lensturbo ii // Various adapted MF lenses
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scorpio_e
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Post edited 3 months ago by scorpio_e.
     
Mar 08, 2018 20:04 |  #225

Photographers argue about everything ... Did I mentions Sony *LOL* NOPE..

I started the thread with this:)

The release of the 6DMKII was the last straw.. No 4K..No dual slot..old sensor tech.. After 10 years.. Goodbye Canon and hello Fuji !!!!! I am looking for lens recommendations for weddings and events. Also anyone one out there shooting sports with the Xt2?


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Moving to Fuji
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