Canon and Sony body owners

Charlie wrote in post #18604905
oh my sony is so big with this friggin 600mm lens on there, I cant handle it

Funny you mention it. With a combination like that, a camera starts to look like a computer "CPU" stuck on the back by comparison !!

SO

I made my decision.

Im going to get the 5D4 to compliment the 1Dx2

Reasons

1-Just too familiar with the Canon line up and its 2nd nature to me. I Know canon in/out and I Like the way it works. I dont have to 2nd guess or try to figure out how to get it to work. I know it too well

2- Sony really requires use of native glass to get full benefits of systems. Tried it and I can definitely tell the difference with a couple lens. Especially the 24-70. It was slower on the Sony than the 5D4 and 1Dx2....not a lot- but enough for me to tell the difference- Would it make a difference at a shoot ? probably Not. But I was not willing to take the chance.

3- I just dont see substantial ISO differences BT the 2 bodies. I looked at 12800 in camera on both bodies. Its just wasnt there. Sorry to burst any bubbles....12800 ISO and I think we are splitting hairs. Maybe at 25000 the sony would have the advantage but I think I have shot 3-4 images at 25000 ISO in 2 yrs. Im setting up my cameras so I dont exceed 12800 and again at 12800.....I dont see it as enough to make a difference. Both Sony and canon are outstanding. This is a foolish argument anymore. All the sensors are great.

4- I hate the feel & smallness of the Sony. I just like a bigger camera in my hands. I need a grip and that would probably nullify and battery life concern.

5- I hate the menu lay outs and the body itself feels cheap compared to the canon. I have read it scratches easily.

6- I LOVE to Facial recognition and tracking abilities of the Sony AF. Its excellent. However, I could not test it in a low light environment like a dark wedding reception and I have read issues with Non Native Glass about ability of AF to lock and keep up from wedding photographers. For this reason alone, Sony is a Non starter for my consideration. I just cant afford to switch out to Native glass with 20K plus invested in Canon Glass.....this was the deal breaker for me

7- I think if your willing to jump ALL IN the Sony is a dam fine camera. I would think its also more suited for techie type photographers who like to mess with things and set things up more custom with the camera and for guys using captures 0ne possibly some advantages there as well. Canon shooters are easy. Shoot, imports into LR and your set. I Dont use capture one

8- Was not impressed at all with colors and skin tones Probably because I have been on Canons systems for 40 yrs however they are very acceptable

9- Last but not least. I stand by my statements last year. All of the cameras are great. You cant buy a bad camera anymore. However, the MFG's are going to lock you into a line up with how well the glass you use is going to behave with the cameras that you are using.......This is very evident with Sony. The Adapters are great, but the performance is just not there with them in my opinion for other MFG glass. My 24-70 and 300F/2.0, 70-200F4 and 50L are instant locks when focus is acquired on a canon body....Not so much on the adapters....

I really wanted to fall in love with the Sony line up and use of an adapter but I just did not. At least Not Enough for me to make a change.

umphotography wrote in post #18619542
SO

I made my decision.

Im going to get the 5D4 to compliment the 1Dx2

Reasons

1-Just too familiar with the Canon line up and its 2nd nature to me. I Know canon in/out and I Like the way it works. I dont have to 2nd guess or try to figure out how to get it to work. I know it too well

2- Sony really requires use of native glass to get full benefits of systems. Tried it and I can definitely tell the difference with a couple lens. Especially the 24-70. It was slower on the Sony than the 5D4 and 1Dx2....not a lot- but enough for me to tell the difference- Would it make a difference at a shoot ? probably Not. But I was not willing to take the chance.

3- I just dont see substantial ISO differences BT the 2 bodies. I looked at 12800 in camera on both bodies. Its just wasnt there. Sorry to burst any bubbles....12800 ISO and I think we are splitting hairs. Maybe at 25000 the sony would have the advantage but I think I have shot 3-4 images at 25000 ISO in 2 yrs. Im setting up my cameras so I dont exceed 12800 and again at 12800.....I dont see it as enough to make a difference. Both Sony and canon are outstanding. This is a foolish argument anymore. All the sensors are great.

4- I hate the feel & smallness of the Sony. I just like a bigger camera in my hands. I need a grip and that would probably nullify and battery life concern.

5- I hate the menu lay outs and the body itself feels cheap compared to the canon. I have read it scratches easily.

6- I LOVE to Facial recognition and tracking abilities of the Sony AF. Its excellent. However, I could not test it in a low light environment like a dark wedding reception and I have read issues with Non Native Glass about ability of AF to lock and keep up from wedding photographers. For this reason alone, Sony is a Non starter for my consideration. I just cant afford to switch out to Native glass with 20K plus invested in Canon Glass.....this was the deal breaker for me

7- I think if your willing to jump ALL IN the Sony is a dam fine camera. I would think its also more suited for techie type photographers who like to mess with things and set things up more custom with the camera and for guys using captures 0ne possibly some advantages there as well. Canon shooters are easy. Shoot, imports into LR and your set. I Dont use capture one

8- Was not impressed at all with colors and skin tones Probably because I have been on Canons systems for 40 yrs however they are very acceptable

9- Last but not least. I stand by my statements last year. All of the cameras are great. You cant buy a bad camera anymore. However, the MFG's are going to lock you into a line up with how well the glass you use is going to behave with the cameras that you are using.......This is very evident with Sony. The Adapters are great, but the performance is just not there with them in my opinion for other MFG glass. My 24-70 and 300F/2.0, 70-200F4 and 50L are instant locks when focus is acquired on a canon body....Not so much on the adapters....

I really wanted to fall in love with the Sony line up and use of an adapter but I just did not. At least Not Enough for me to make a change.

Mike,

I think for your preference I think it was a wise choice to stick with Canon.

I'm really liking the functionality of Sony. Not so fond of the extra work in post processing.

If you're relying on AF I think Canon is a no brainer for speed in good light and dreadful. The red focus assist just compliments the mirrored system giving you rock solid performance.

I would NOT feel confident using adapted glass to Sony. In most cases I appreciate the adapted canon glass but I've made my sony my second (or 3rd) system and Canon is my Primary.

In all honesty- It was a much harder decision that I thought it would be. But there are some things I just could not get past. Glad I made the effort to check it out.

Im really liking the touch screen on the 5D4. Wish the iDx2 had it. ISO performance of the 5D4 is excellent. For weddings and portraits is a great body. Not excited about the 30mb files. 1Dx2 files are just perfect in size

Would never say anything negative for people that switch out to Sony. Its a great body. Glass is toooooo expensive in my opinion as compared to Canons L's and Im not sure the quality is there as compared to Canon and Nikons counterparts. Might be.

Rumor has it that Canon is developing a mirrorless. That will be interesting.

umphotography wrote in post #18619931
In all honesty- It was a much harder decision that I thought it would be. But there are some things I just could not get past. Glad I made the effort to check it out.

Im really liking the touch screen on the 5D4. Wish the iDx2 had it. ISO performance of the 5D4 is excellent. For weddings and portraits is a great body. Not excited about the 30mb files. 1Dx2 files are just perfect in size

Would never say anything negative for people that switch out to Sony. Its a great body. Glass is toooooo expensive in my opinion as compared to Canons L's and Im not sure the quality is there as compared to Canon and Nikons counterparts. Might be.

Rumor has it that Canon is developing a mirrorless. That will be interesting.

Yesterday I shot a wedding and combination of a 100 day Chinese baby celebration. I lugged my A73 with Sigma MC-11 as a companion to my Canon gear.

The A73 was unusable to me. I had difficulty landing split second shots in a the pathetically lighted Chinese Restaurant/ reception. The Canon with red focus assist just hammered every single shot (literally every shot) and worked like a charm. The Sony just fell on it's face with the style that I shoot using a godox 860ii lithium powered speedlight.

The simple use of xrite passport landed perfect skin tones and the reds were spot on.

I truly and genuinely tried but the Sony just didn't jive with my style. I think I've decided to just buy the Batis 25mm, cheap 85 f1.8 and the very likely the 16-35 f/4 UWA (maybe the GM version). I feel the Sony will not be able to meet my "tool application" for wedding/events photography.

The camera wake up time just wasn't split second like the Canon. I felt this was a major shock to me when the camera took some time waking up. The A73 I put on my hip using the spider holster and when I wanted to use it with the Canon 24Lmk2 the camera did great when it was awake but not when it was sleeping.

The Sony to me is a camera system that I really enjoy and it's a step above my Fuji when it comes to low light photography. I still feel I will keep the Sony system as a wonderful tool. I will probably say it's definitely not going to be my run/gun setup for events work. I'll eventually pick up another 5dmk4 or just stick with the 5d3 (second body).

Only issue I find is that the 5dmk4 sucks for battery life. My 5dmk3 last much longer than the 5dmk4 even with regular still photography use.

Yesterday was a real eye opener for me and now I'm probably just going to buy a Canon 16-35 f/2.8mk3 as this is a lens that compliments my style. I've been holding off the purchase as I was looking at the $$$$$$$$$ Sony GM 16-35 to use as tool for events work.

My Fuji 10-24mm just doesn't cut it for events work as it's too slow both in aperture speed and propagation delay when I hit the shutter button and actually take the shot. Canon just works for me as it's instant as I grab the camera and hit the shutter button. Sony wake up time is terrible unless I force the camera on 100% (not sure if I can do that) but it'll eat batteries. I guess I can buy spare batteries if I seriously consider sony for hired work.

So basically my Canon can virtually do everything I need as at tool for photography but it's heavy.

1) Fuji has very good high iso, small form factor but lacks the AF I demand, files are easy to make eye candy and colours are pleasant. Post processing workflow is a wonderful experience. Lens selection is good and they are now gouging trying to ramp up the price compared to 2yrs ago.

2)Sony has fantastic high iso capabilities. Images are brutally honest and no cartoonish/painterly look. Colours are vivid and in some cases intense to me. When the camera is awake it's a beast in blazing fast AF compared to Fuji. The shadow slider in LR seems less responsive compared to canon and fuji. If you have dual cards in the camera and take one out the camera will tell you a card is missing and it will not let you take anymore photos until you correct the "designation" of use of the slot...WTF???? Fuji or Canon you just fire away with no issue when you pull out a 2nd card.

Now that I literally have tried the Sony for real critical use I just feel the lack of red focus assist will just not work for me in low lit fast pace environments. Most Chinese restaurant venues just lack good lighting and the mixed lighting is so typical too.

I'll absorb my experience from yesterday but I'll still push my efforts in using Sony.

Alan. I'm surprised at your 5D4 battery life comments. My initial thought was that your unit is new but I know from your posts it has probably already see quit a bit of use. With all of my 5D4 bodies I noticed that the battery life was unexpectedly short at first but it improved dramatically after some initial use. You'll notice similar comments mentioned fairly often around the net. I regularly shoot 1000+ shots in a day and still have juice when I plug in for a recharge. Usually AI servo but I never use wifi or GPS. It is at least on par with my other Canon bodies.

Do you have wireless and gps on? Both shorten battery life substantially.

AlanU wrote in post #18620613
1) Fuji has very good high iso, small form factor but lacks the AF I demand, files are easy to make eye candy and colours are pleasant. Post processing workflow is a wonderful experience. Lens selection is good and they are now gouging trying to ramp up the price compared to 2yrs ago.

Actually Fuji have introduced f/2 35, 50 & 23mm lenses that are less expensive than the 1.4 versions as well as focusing faster and offering great WR sealing, (the 1.4 ones are not WR lenses). More for less there. If you are talking about the one camera that is €200 more expensive than a similar camera in their lineup (the X-H1 & X-T2)? You'd just have to look at the build, thicker materials and paint, the introduction of things like IBIS etc.. to see where the price increases are, also the grip is actually cheaper for the X-H1 and you get two 's' type batteries included with it. So hardly the 'gouging' you profess now is it.

I shoot a lot of weddings and events with my Fuji and can't say I've experienced any of the AF issues you constantly and at every opportunity complain about, sure if you were shooting fast sports I'd understand if you saw some frustration but weddings and functions are far from fast paced - least that's been my experience anyway. Your opinion and your experience I guess is very different to mine on this.

AlanU wrote in post #18620613
Yesterday I shot a wedding and combination of a 100 day Chinese baby celebration. I lugged my A73 with Sigma MC-11 as a companion to my Canon gear.

The A73 was unusable to me. I had difficulty landing split second shots in a the pathetically lighted Chinese Restaurant/ reception. The Canon with red focus assist just hammered every single shot (literally every shot) and worked like a charm. The Sony just fell on it's face with the style that I shoot using a godox 860ii lithium powered speedlight.

The simple use of xrite passport landed perfect skin tones and the reds were spot on.

I truly and genuinely tried but the Sony just didn't jive with my style. I think I've decided to just buy the Batis 25mm, cheap 85 f1.8 and the very likely the 16-35 f/4 UWA (maybe the GM version). I feel the Sony will not be able to meet my "tool application" for wedding/events photography.

The camera wake up time just wasn't split second like the Canon. I felt this was a major shock to me when the camera took some time waking up. The A73 I put on my hip using the spider holster and when I wanted to use it with the Canon 24Lmk2 the camera did great when it was awake but not when it was sleeping.

The Sony to me is a camera system that I really enjoy and it's a step above my Fuji when it comes to low light photography. I still feel I will keep the Sony system as a wonderful tool. I will probably say it's definitely not going to be my run/gun setup for events work. I'll eventually pick up another 5dmk4 or just stick with the 5d3 (second body).

Only issue I find is that the 5dmk4 sucks for battery life. My 5dmk3 last much longer than the 5dmk4 even with regular still photography use.

Yesterday was a real eye opener for me and now I'm probably just going to buy a Canon 16-35 f/2.8mk3 as this is a lens that compliments my style. I've been holding off the purchase as I was looking at the $$$$$$$$$ Sony GM 16-35 to use as tool for events work.

My Fuji 10-24mm just doesn't cut it for events work as it's too slow both in aperture speed and propagation delay when I hit the shutter button and actually take the shot. Canon just works for me as it's instant as I grab the camera and hit the shutter button. Sony wake up time is terrible unless I force the camera on 100% (not sure if I can do that) but it'll eat batteries. I guess I can buy spare batteries if I seriously consider sony for hired work.

So basically my Canon can virtually do everything I need as at tool for photography but it's heavy.

1) Fuji has very good high iso, small form factor but lacks the AF I demand, files are easy to make eye candy and colours are pleasant. Post processing workflow is a wonderful experience. Lens selection is good and they are now gouging trying to ramp up the price compared to 2yrs ago.

2)Sony has fantastic high iso capabilities. Images are brutally honest and no cartoonish/painterly look. Colours are vivid and in some cases intense to me. When the camera is awake it's a beast in blazing fast AF compared to Fuji. The shadow slider in LR seems less responsive compared to canon and fuji. If you have dual cards in the camera and take one out the camera will tell you a card is missing and it will not let you take anymore photos until you correct the "designation" of use of the slot...WTF???? Fuji or Canon you just fire away with no issue when you pull out a 2nd card.

Now that I literally have tried the Sony for real critical use I just feel the lack of red focus assist will just not work for me in low lit fast pace environments. Most Chinese restaurant venues just lack good lighting and the mixed lighting is so typical too.

I'll absorb my experience from yesterday but I'll still push my efforts in using Sony.

Much appreciated with this post Alan

This was indeed my biggest concern and there was no way for me to test this as all my lighting is Canon. I would of had to buy a Sony Godox trigger and rent then find out. I read a couple other posts with same conclusions on the net

I too am in extremely dark rooms for a lot of my receptions. Not uncommon for me to be at 6400 at F/2.5 @ 1/125 with a flash to get images. Thats pretty dark. I just could not take the chance based on what you wrote. I heard this from more than 1 source.

Adapted lenses don't perform as well in low light as adapted lenses are limited to PDAF only and there's a big hit to af sensitivity.

I have no issues shooting dark dance floors during wedding receptions with native glass though. No need for af assist beam because CDAF focuses with the image on the sensor and benefits from pushing the iso to see in the dark. Focusing st iso12,800 is very much doable

umphotography wrote in post #18620795
Much appreciated with this post Alan

This was indeed my biggest concern and there was no way for me to test this as all my lighting is Canon. I would of had to buy a Sony Godox trigger and rent then find out. I read a couple other posts with same conclusions on the net

I too am in extremely dark rooms for a lot of my receptions. Not uncommon for me to be at 6400 at F/2.5 @ 1/125 with a flash to get images. Thats pretty dark. I just could not take the chance based on what you wrote. I heard this from more than 1 source.

I am using adapted Canon glass so this is what I'm assuming you'll attempt to try "IF" you experiment with Sony.

I'm not sure if many here shoot alot of asian wedding's but it's very common to have each table cheer with their glasses. Jamming a good 200+ people in a shoe box with very little room to navigate. I find my Canon focus point does not jump around from the center. My Fuji seems to stay put in the center. For some odd reason my Sony was jumping off center some how and I do not know why. I think it happens as my camera sits on my spider holster and I'm touching something. When I shoot I am thinking WTF??? where's my focus point??????



When I have my A73 on my hip sitting on the spider holster it'll sleep. I grab the camera to take a shot and it feels like eternity waking up the camera.....then I take a shot. Please note this is the first time i've put the Sony to a serious test with adapted Glass. It's interesting that I know Sony shooters still finding Sony native glass not on par with their previous Canon L glass on Canon bodies. However they compromise some things to gain others.

I'll admit adapted glass is not as good as it should. I took the Sony out with a 24-70L f/2.8mk2 at a playground. Bright backlit environments (sunny background) the 24-70Lmk2 would not acquire focus. Not complaining as I know it's not native glass.I think a hired photog using adapted glass is CRAZY!!!!! LOL!!! I would not be caught dead using adapted glass with a Sony for hired events.

I like sony as it becomes childs play with eye AF when shooting single subject humans Even adapted glass just lands the shots with ease.

I analyze the pros and cons and for events photography I do find I want certain things. Instant photos when I push the shutter button regardless of light conditions. No hunting with red focus assist. High iso performance, great dynamic range. As you can see the Sony meets most of the criteria. However eye AF is absolutely useless to me during fast paced insane events photography when group shots are involved or when I am selecting specific people when shooting fast glass. Face detection is also never used as I want 100% full control in what I want in focus. These things I discuss is nothing that drastically different to other photogs. I will focus/recompose and use the joystick depending on the situation.

I still need to buy native glass. My comments on sleeping is just one of the things I find "different" to my Canon gear. I am willing to change up my gear but one thing I will say is that if I'm going full on GM pro glass I'm not taking a drastic weight savings to my Canon gear vs Sony gear with pro glass.

I'm sticking with Sony as I have better high iso images compared to my Fuji. Sony has extremely responsive actuations while it's awake I can deal with crappy performance from non native glass. Godox is dirt cheap an it works as a flash but it's a severe shame the latest firmware doesn't even emit a spit or red focus assist from the 860ii flash. My other cheap TT685f at least shoots a red focus assist beam that sorta helps out my Fuji system in low light.

If someone can use a camera system and deliver..... that's all that counts. I need to spent at least $15,000 CDN to make my A73 usable for any hired work "if" it performs identical to my Canon. However a friend of mine that has owned the latest Nikon and Canon system says his Sony A9 still has hiccups with native glass. Just think he's being truthful in his own experience but with native glass. I will need to determine this myself but I guess I'll need to spend $15,000 for a Sony trinity of zooms and selected niche primes.

For now I'm slowly building my Sony system.

nqjudo wrote in post #18620619
Alan. I'm surprised at your 5D4 battery life comments. My initial thought was that your unit is new but I know from your posts it has probably already see quit a bit of use. With all of my 5D4 bodies I noticed that the battery life was unexpectedly short at first but it improved dramatically after some initial use. You'll notice similar comments mentioned fairly often around the net. I regularly shoot 1000+ shots in a day and still have juice when I plug in for a recharge. Usually AI servo but I never use wifi or GPS. It is at least on par with my other Canon bodies.

I'm gonna dig in my menu system. I do find the 5d4 draining juice fast.

hmmmmmm

Otherwise so far I love the image quality that the 5d4 produces. I can see a difference between my 5d3 and 5dmk4.

Really appreciate everyones comments in this thread. I think its one of the better ones here at POTN. Lots of great information and real world shooting experiences

way to go everyone

With regards to the wake-up time. There is a huge improvement in this regard with the new a7/a9 bodies, and it was such an issue with the a7rII that I rushed out and bought an a9 when it first hit the market because it was such a detriment to wedding/event shooting as it often meant missing a shot because the camera wasn't ready. It's not an issue now because the newer cameras boots up relatively quickly, BUT you really need to make a habit of half pressing the shutter as soon as you grab it to bring it up to shoot. That way by the time you get it to eye level, the camera is ready to shoot.

FYI to canon shooters

I ordered a new 5D4 yesterday from B&H-comes with a lot of free goodies- Grip, battery, 64 gb card and a lowepro backpack....$3099.00

Canon has a new warranty

Drop break and free repairs for 2 or 3 yrs that you can add to the camera. When you buy a 5D4 right now it automatically comes with a free 13 month drop break extended warranty for 13 months

However if you get the 3 yrs extended warranty the 13 month is added to the contract. Thats 4 yrs of worry free warranty on the camera through CPS. Great deal

Im calling CPS today to see how the warranties work together. I need CPS for my other gear but not sure how they work together

Great time to get your 5D4's if your on the fence