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FORUMS General Gear Talk Camera Vs. Camera 
Thread started 17 May 2018 (Thursday) 11:08
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1DX II or A9?

 
dallas.balla
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May 17, 2018 11:08 |  #1

I've been using Canon gear for about 10 years now but am thinking about switching to Sony.
It's getting time for me to upgrade from the 5Diii and I am looking at either the 1DX II or the A9.
80% of my work consists of concerts, mainly electronic music, both video and photo.
The 4k 60fps on the 1DX II really appealed to me but I am looking for some other opinions since the A9 is about $1000 less.

Any help is greatly appreciated before I spend a bunch of money. Thanks!


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ptcanon3ti
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May 17, 2018 11:16 |  #2

You'll probably spend that $1000 on lenses and batteries very quickly. So unless there is something you specifically don't like about Canon, you should probably just stay with them.


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Charlie
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May 17, 2018 11:57 |  #3

I'de pick up an A7iii and save thousands. You dont need A9 caliber AF or fps for what you shoot. The A7iii has what I consider a better video feature set, stills will likely be a wash. 10 vs 14 fps probably wont matter much for concerts.

why better video?

IBIS

Size, the massive 1Dx will be heavy on a crane/gimbal if you shoot that.

Tilt screen, simply a necessity for video, an external monitor makes your rig even bigger, no thanks.

4K with 1.1 crop or 1.5 crop gives a lot of flexibility, more than 60fps IMO, but that option is certainly nice.


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umphotography
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May 17, 2018 13:40 |  #4

are you prepared to invest in sony native glass

As 1Dx2 owner I dont think there is anything thats going to touch a 1Dx2 for AF performance

I tested the Sony. Came close. Ultimately decided i was better served to stay canon. But I was considering 5D4 v/s Sony A7iii.

Weight of the 1Dx2 does not bother me at all. When you spend this kind of $$$ on a body its all about performance. I still feel the 1Dx2 and the Nikon D5 are far superior choices at this level, especially IF you are already invested in the line up. Starting out maybe consider Sony. Dont let anyone kid you. The adapter does not let your L lens perform as well as Sony Glass will perform of their bodies.

read the other thread all the way through. Great info in this thread

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1493298


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Ah-keong
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May 18, 2018 03:26 |  #5

I will stick with the Canon solution,

unless you are alright with an adaptor on to use Canon lens system.
for action, low light, think DSLR still has an edge over DSLM  :p


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May 18, 2018 05:13 |  #6

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Left ­ Handed ­ Brisket
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May 18, 2018 05:42 |  #7

Charlie wrote in post #18627311 (external link)
I'de pick up an A7iii and save thousands. You dont need A9 caliber AF or fps for what you shoot.

Seems one of the remaining differences between Canon and Sony is low light focusing with Canon still comfortably leading. In my experience, concerts can often require fast and accurate low light focusing.


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umphotography
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May 18, 2018 09:00 |  #8

Great find Teamspeed


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Charlie
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May 18, 2018 09:07 |  #9

Left Handed Brisket wrote in post #18627755 (external link)
Seems one of the remaining differences between Canon and Sony is low light focusing with Canon still comfortably leading. In my experience, concerts can often require fast and accurate low light focusing.

-3 EV

I'de suggest you read up on how low light that is, and what the 1Dxii is capable of. I'm not going to get caught up on the photo aspects, as I think the 1Dx mark 1, 1Dx mark 2, 5Div, 6Dii, A7riii, A7iii, A9 make easy work of the situation. In worst case, use the illuminating light. All these bodies do -3ev. BTW, Michael the Maven has the A9 beating out the 1Dxii in a low light shooting contest by a hair, and the A9 seems to beat out the D5 by a larger margin in Max Yurev's test.

When it comes to video, you can arguably get by with 2 lenses, Batis 25, and Sony FE 85.

This combined rig would be considerably lighter, smaller, and easier to handle than the equivalent Canon, which there really is none.

With The batis 25, you can toggle between 25 and 1.5 crop, giving you close to 35mm. For most of your video A roll footage, that's you're natural shooting Scenario. 85mm can toggle to 135, which would be most of your B roll footage. Canon offers nothing like that, which is huge for video shooters.

Video is where there will be MASSIVE differences between the systems, given that TS is interested in it, the video aspects arent straight forward as photography.


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Left ­ Handed ­ Brisket
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May 18, 2018 12:08 |  #10

Charlie wrote in post #18627822 (external link)
-3 EV

I'de suggest you read up on how low light that is, and what the 1Dxii is capable of. I'm not going to get caught up on the photo aspects, as I think the 1Dx mark 1, 1Dx mark 2, 5Div, 6Dii, A7riii, A7iii, A9 make easy work of the situation. In worst case, use the illuminating light.

Uh, yeah, sure.

The thread UM posted above really is one of the best discussions I've seen on comparisons between ANY two cameras. Definitely worth a read. Time and time again it came up that the 5DIV bests the Sony in, as I said above, "fast and accurate low light focusing". The people in that thread who had experience with both also point to the Sony slow wake up time. In my experience with the rapidly changing environment of many concerts, those are very important factors to consider.


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Charlie
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May 18, 2018 13:07 |  #11

Left Handed Brisket wrote in post #18627935 (external link)
Uh, yeah, sure.

The thread UM posted above really is one of the best discussions I've seen on comparisons between ANY two cameras. Definitely worth a read. Time and time again it came up that the 5DIV bests the Sony in, as I said above, "fast and accurate low light focusing". The people in that thread who had experience with both also point to the Sony slow wake up time. In my experience with the rapidly changing environment of many concerts, those are very important factors to consider.

Low light test was measurably faster on the sony in Michael the Maven's test, and that was BEFORE the firmware updates for the zoom AF issue. In the worst case scenario, turn on the illumination lamp, older canon's use to have this feature.

startup time from sleep is about a second, it's a super easy workaround. Simply half press as soon as you touch your camera, by the time you raise it up to eye level, it's already on.... if that bothers you too much, simply leave the camera on the whole time, and force it not to sleep. Battery life can go for hours. What's the workaround for carrying a 1Dx on a gimbal for video? What about zebras? What about handholding without IBIS? tilt screen? 1x + 1.5x crop.... how does a videographer deal with that?


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May 18, 2018 13:34 |  #12

Gotta do your homework when you start investing 5-6K in a body. No easy answers. But for most people buying these bodies, MOST, are going to be working pros heavily invested in the MFG line up with lighting and additional equipment. Lens are probably the least on the consideration factors... So way more to consider for guys like me when thinking about a move to another brand.

Really Hard to sell off and reinvest when you have been doing this for 10+ years especially when all the top bodies perform so close to each other.

Lastly, there is no such thing as a bad camera anymore. Just better options for the needs you have as a pro- Its really that simple.


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nqjudo
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May 18, 2018 14:04 |  #13

Charlie wrote in post #18627967 (external link)
Low light test was measurably faster on the sony in Michael the Maven's test, and that was BEFORE the firmware updates for the zoom AF issue. In the worst case scenario, turn on the illumination lamp, older canon's use to have this feature.

startup time from sleep is about a second, it's a super easy workaround. Simply half press as soon as you touch your camera, by the time you raise it up to eye level, it's already on.... if that bothers you too much, simply leave the camera on the whole time, and force it not to sleep. Battery life can go for hours. What's the workaround for carrying a 1Dx on a gimbal for video? What about zebras? What about handholding without IBIS? tilt screen? 1x + 1.5x crop.... how does a videographer deal with that?

Bah. I don't know. It's too easy to promote one system over the other by cherry picking features. I strongly agree with Mike that there are no more bad cameras. It is just a matter of which suits you better. I used the a9 against the 1DXii, 5D4 and the 7D2 this past winter and for my purpose the a9 was often bested by the 7D2. That says nothing other than Canon is the better choice for me. I can't speak to anyone else's use. New features like IBIS, eye detection, etc. are good but it is an unfortunate when their promotion implies that all of the spectacular images that came before were nothing but good luck. There are people on forums who have such loathing for one company that they can't help but inject some kind of negativity toward them with every post even when it is completely unnecessary. I mean, we're talking about a pile of consumer electronics here. One has to wonder in the case of some individuals if they own their possessions or their possessions own them. People on forums tend to be biased toward their own choices and who really knows what's behind reviews? At the end of the day the only reasonable thing to do when deciding on a system is to ignore forums and reviews and try the gear yourself. There's no sense squabbling about which camera is better. The point of diminishing returns is long past.

Meanwhile, this is a nice vid:

https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=HJYaQJa6Qck (external link)


No photographer is as good as the simplest camera. - Edward Steichen.

  
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Charlie
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May 18, 2018 14:32 |  #14

nqjudo wrote in post #18627991 (external link)
Bah. I don't know. It's too easy to promote one system over the other by cherry picking features. I strongly agree with Mike that there are no more bad cameras. It is just a matter of which suits you better. I used the a9 against the 1DXii, 5D4 and the 7D2 this past winter and for my purpose the a9 was often bested by the 7D2. That says nothing other than Canon is the better choice for me. I can't speak to anyone else's use. New features like IBIS, eye detection, etc. are good but it is an unfortunate when their promotion implies that all of the spectacular images that came before were nothing but good luck. There are people on forums who have such loathing for one company that they can't help but inject some kind of negativity toward them with every post even when it is completely unnecessary. I mean, we're talking about a pile of consumer electronics here. One has to wonder in the case of some individuals if they own their possessions or their possessions own them. People on forums tend to be biased toward their own choices and who really knows what's behind reviews? At the end of the day the only reasonable thing to do when deciding on a system is to ignore forums and reviews and try the gear yourself. There's no sense squabbling about which camera is better. The point of diminishing returns is long past.

Meanwhile, this is a nice vid:

https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=HJYaQJa6Qck (external link)

Have you tried using videos with both canon and Sony?

difference is night and day. I can capture any type of photo you throw at me with either system


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nqjudo
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May 18, 2018 15:02 |  #15

Charlie wrote in post #18628001 (external link)
Have you tried using videos with both canon and Sony?

difference is night and day. I can capture any type of photo you throw at me with either system

Yes. I have tried video. Advantages and pitfalls for both. There is an abundance of excellent video available from both systems which speaks volumes to their capabilities. It isn't particularly difficult to use either system for video but as I mentioned in my last post the user experience is highly subjective. Your results or ease of use vs mine means nothing to the next individual.

I'm glad you can produce photos competently with either system. It certainly gives weight to the fact that the camera means a lot less than many people make of it. My experience with Sony wasn't as good as Canon but I wouldn't be unhappy with Sony if there was no other choice. I think we're living in a time of very good choices. The real difficulty is in wading through all the mud to find what works best for us. Personally I have to try before I buy.


No photographer is as good as the simplest camera. - Edward Steichen.

  
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