Sold a lens need help?

swartz wrote in post #18690837
I actually have her word in writing that she got the lens to work but it sounds like it might not be working. What kind of evidence is that of a lens not working properly?

There's nothing stopping her from turning around and saying she thought it didn't work but is now sure it doesn't. Someone savvy will probably put the bug in her ear. Anyway, It seems like you have your mind made up about how this is going to go down. Not sure why you are looking for suggestions. Go about it however you want and if the results offer from what most people are trying to express let us know. Maybe we can learn something.

Sorry but this is the chance you take when you accept paypal payment. Buyer can keep and use your lens for three weeks and cry
foul and your screwed. As many others have told you just bite the bullet issue a refund and hope its returned in the same condition it
was in when you shipped it. Paypal won't actually issue the refund until you have received the item back.

Just ask the buyer to send the lens back to you. You WON'T win. Period.

If you are not so sure about the lens performance before posting for sale, take it to the local shop to have them take a look. If you think the lens is poorly perform then don't sell it, but if you want to sell it then CLEARLY stated on your Ad... Honest will save you a lot of trouble down the road.

Refund then move on... You will only lost $25 of the shipping cost. Paypal will refund the 3% fees back to you.

swartz wrote in post #18690783
I'm not trying to hide behind it. As I said I noticed in the original post. I say it was on Facebook because I know EBay has an added layer of protection for buyers. I'm not trying to screw anyone. The person doesn't know how to use the lens and now I have a Paypal dispute. Doesn't seem right. I never realized how screwed up PayPal and buyers can be. And if it somehow has an issue once you mail it back the original insurance is voided.

So why not contact USPS and let them know that the buyer is claiming the lens was somehow damaged and does not work. Doesn't seem like rocket science.

If as you claim the lens is fine then no loss, but at least you will have the claim filed in case you actually do have to send it for repair. How have you contacted this person? Have you actually spoken to them? (though given your attitude here I am not sure that would be a great idea) I do find it easier to actually talk to the person and find out what the problem is, maybe what the settings are, what they are trying to accomplish, etc. last thing you want to do is accuse someone of being stupid or trying to get one over on you.

USPS doesn't work that way, you will get nowhere with a presumed shipping issue, especially at this point in the sale.

Swartz you have no choice but to accept a return of the lens no matter what she said. Paypal is holding your $850 in your account, you might as well say goodbye to it and concentrate on getting your lens back and accept the money loss of fees. With my experiences with Paypal the buyer always wins.

I have been in similar situations where the buyer just didn't like the item or had a change of mind even after weeks of use. She could of lied and said the lens just does not work ......I have had that said many a time when I have had items returned with nothing wrong with them.

I have just recently sold a laptop advertised as NOT WORKING/BROKEN/NEEDS REPAIRING only to have the buyer tell me that they don't want it as it is too expensive to repair. A Case was raised the money was held and I had no choice but to accept a return.

You were unlucky this time and just need to accept that. Just make sure the lens is sent back to you in the same manner you sent it to her ....insured and well packaged and tracked.

swartz wrote in post #18690504
She asked for a refund immediately and I told her I'm not willing to loose $50 ($25 PayPal fee + $25 shipping/insurance) because she feels the lens doesn't focus right.

Then you should have done an in-person cash sale.

swartz wrote in post #18690504
After checking my original fs post i never stated once that the lens even worked and she never asked.

The fact that you would even type that in a post here is a huge red flag about your honesty. "Does it work" isn't a question a buyer should have to ask for an $850 PayPal transaction. That's YOUR responsibility.

And it's apparently a good thing that PayPal has an added layer of protection too. Depending on how they funded the payment, they may have credit card protection also.

PayPal will make the buyer pay to ship it back. And they'll refund your fee (except for 30 cents). So you'll be out $25 for the original shipping.

Jethr0 wrote in post #18690790
... people seem to like to treat these kind of transactions like they bought from walmart/bestbuy/whatev​er retailer. ...

That's me. And why not? If it doesn't work when I receive it, I should be able to return it for a full refund. Otherwise, it's a rip off.

It could be the way you've presented your case here, but what you're saying is coming across as less than honorable and trustworthy.

Give her the benefit of the doubt (I've had quirky equipment), make it right, put it behind you, move on.

Check serial number when it's returned. A friend loaned the same lens as you have, got it back a couple days later . He just put it back and NEVER looked at it. Took it out a couple weeks later and it wouldn't focus. He checked serial number and it was a different lens... not his lens..

When you decide to enter into the selling market, one should really consider what that means.
Reading the posts here, it seems that is not the case.

Imagine if you bought something from an onl9ine retailer, and upon arrival you felt it did not live up to your expectations. If you tell B&H that the focus does not work, how do you expect them to respond?

Right, they will (almost always) refund your money or replace the failed product without any hassle.

You chose to position yourself as an alternative to a retailer by offering to sell the lens.
Anyone doing so should stand by their product, and behave accordingly.

Heck, you may be right about the lens and the buyer, but you don't know you are, so you may just be completely in the wrong not to be trying to handle this with a return.

As for the loss of $25ish due to shipping, and paypal fees won't enter into it on a return. Again, these are services you chose to use, to make your life easier, so yes, you have to pay for that.

In any of these cases the only thing you can do is offer a refund upon receipt of the returned item.

Well said, but a private seller is not a multi million dollar company who can prob return item to manufacturer or has insurance for such instances. B&H has a name and reputation and I don't. I know you'll prob say I do but I sell 1 lens every 5 yrs. $850 is 1.5 weeks pay. It's my families summer vacation. This is actually a big deal for a family who's income is less then $75k a year. So I can't offer the same luxuries as Adorama and that's why u pay $1400 and buy a new lens with a warranty. You are insinuating a used lens has the same warranty as a new one.

swartz wrote in post #18693447
Well said, but a private seller is not a multi million dollar company who can prob return item to manufacturer or has insurance for such instances. B&H has a name and reputation and I don't. I know you'll prob say I do but I sell 1 lens every 5 yrs. $850 is 1.5 weeks pay. It's my families summer vacation. This is actually a big deal for a family who's income is less then $75k a year. So I can't offer the same luxuries as Adorama and that's why u pay $1400 and buy a new lens with a warranty. You are insinuating a used lens has the same warranty as a new one.

I can't speak for Jake but I don't see an insinuation that a used lens has the same warranty as a new one as much as I see your desire to benefit from a double standard as a private seller vs a corporation. Simply put PayPal's rules don't discriminate between big companies and private sellers. The buyer has every right to expect that the product will perform as advertised no matter who the seller is. One shouldn't have the expectation that a buyer protection mechanism will treat a private seller any differently than it would a corporation and you accepted this when you entered into a contract with the buyer. One could easily respond that if 850.00$ is so vital to your bottom line you shouldn't be touching online sales at all. Even the most novice of sellers knows that the whole system is fraught with pitfalls and the buyer is heavily favoured when there is a dispute. I make about 9 of 10 sales in person now. I advertise locally, meet with a person where they inspect the product, hand me a wad of cash and I walk away without any further thought. If the funds from a used lens are that important I think you should consider doing the same.

I'm not a lawyer so cannot state verbatum, but in Texas, the laws are such that a reasonable buyer has reasonable expectations. Unless the seller explicitly states, "AS IS" (with full disclosure), or some such, then it better work within reasonable expectations.

If it doesn't, in some cases, the buyer can sue for up to 3x the amount of the sale.

This may, at first, seem off topic, but the point is, a buyer has expectations regardless of who the seller is AND laws understand and recognize this.

Cold, hard, fact - Most buyers don't care about your personal conditions, financial or otherwise. They want a product that works as reasonably expected. Period.

swartz wrote in post #18693447
Well said, but a private seller is not a multi million dollar company who can prob return item to manufacturer or has insurance for such instances. B&H has a name and reputation and I don't. I know you'll prob say I do but I sell 1 lens every 5 yrs. $850 is 1.5 weeks pay. It's my families summer vacation. This is actually a big deal for a family who's income is less then $75k a year. So I can't offer the same luxuries as Adorama and that's why u pay $1400 and buy a new lens with a warranty. You are insinuating a used lens has the same warranty as a new one.

Your financial situation, or what you planned to do with the profit from the sale, have nothing to do with this. You entered into a contract with the buyer, and the buyer has certain rights under that contract. If you were not prepared to honor those rights, you shouldn't be selling used lenses online. And to state you never said the lens worked is absolutely ridiculous. Selling a product for a price consistent with the market for that item implies that it is in good working order, unless you explicitly stated that the item was not functioning properly.

Instead of looking for a way to justify keeping this person's money, you should do the honest and proper thing and have her ship back the lens and then issue a refund. It's the right thing to do, and if you are an honorable person you should know that.

I agree the OP’s financials have absolutely zero to do with this. As a buyer, if you sold me something that did not work, I’d invest the time and energy for a return/refund. However, if I had buyers remorse, that’s my problem, not the sellers. But, as has been said, at this point only the buyer knows which is which. Only when the OP gets the lens back when PP decides in favor of the buyer, will they know.

I disagree about the comment regarding reputation though. If the OP is selling something here. A potential buyer doing proper due diligence will find this thread (and the duplicated thread in the business of photography section), and take it in as part of their decision making process.