Who has gone mirrorless?

Charlie wrote in post #18897322
I realize that Sony doesn't match the bitrate and compression, and at the same time they don't compete with Fuji as much as they compete with Nikon and Canon. Nikon doesn't have AF squared away, Canon doesn't shoot full frame video.

I'm not following Fuji's reasoning behind models, XT's vs XH's don't seem to have a clear video distinction, while Sony has a clear cut video camera, the distinction is clear in that regard. Different philosophies.

It does seem that bigger sensors have a harder time with video, all manufacturers have one issue or another, even Panasonic can only do 4K 60 in crop mode. R's have binning in FF mode. I suspect the gfx does 4K pixel binning, uses a cousin sensor to the R4.

I personally view the bitrate, color space, and compression a bit too extreme in video features, deviating into the pro video market, you keep increasing all of that, and you're in external recorder territory, and once there, you start considering the black magics, cine cameras, all have a ton more video features. 400mb just seems so extreme, I struggle with file management of 100mb, even drop down to 1080 30p at times to save on size

Bitrate doesn't translate to better IQ proportionally, so I tend to try and then see what I'm comfortable with, it's a spec that I need to test with eyes before concluding.

4 minutes in, 400mbit vs 100mbit




On the extreme side of things, sigma FP will have a 12 bit Dng Cinema raw. Clear cut best IQ on paper, but the camera doesn't have phase detect AF.

It may have the best video specs in terms of IQ, not necessarily the best video camera, especially if it can't AF well.

How I would rate video features: It needs reliable AF. Needs to capture the full sensor. You can't do those two, can't be considered.

After that, the compelling features

Framerates, ability for slow motion is huge.
Crop/zoom ability, this is just huge.
Color space, this has got to be a distant third place. Important but has no bearing on how well composed your video is.
Bitrate and compression. H265 is the best, and has no bearing on how you craft your video. Like Sony's photo compression vs no compressions, little material difference however H265 can save space with no penalty. Also not compatible with many systems, like USB-C, a little ahead of the times.

The 100 vs 400 Mbps comparison actually shocked me. I thought there would have been a big difference but it appears it wasn’t. Thanks for sharing that video.

AlanU wrote in post #18897437
The 100 vs 400 Mbps comparison actually shocked me. I thought there would have been a big difference but it appears it wasn’t. Thanks for sharing that video.

Video is not very straight forward like when you compare photography crop VS FF. Consider your output for 1080p is a measly 20mbps is considered good, in the old days, I'de output to 12mbps to save space!!! Of course output isn't same as input since you need some video flexibility, but still, I think 100 is pretty decent.

I'm actually OK with APS-C video only, like the EOS-R. Hands down biggest problem is when you're limited in lenses or switch between video and photo, you're stuck with different focal lengths..........

I'm ok shooting purely APS-C video, but I definitely prefer FF photography. At the same time, I don't want to carry an APS-C kit AND FF kit.

It's difficult to find good balance, but I think I'm getting really close.

I may try the Sony 10-18 f4 and Tamron 17-28 f2.8. Heavily favoring the Tamron at this point, it's double the weight, less standard focal range, but more range when cropped. Either way, on the lens front, I think I'm in excellent shape. Recently on travel, I felt I had too many lenses and sent some back with my mom who was helping me with the kids

I also have the 12-24..... should use more often, may be even better than both alternative lenses, but I find it a bit heavy..... I should probably suck it up.....

Charlie wrote in post #18897477
Video is not very straight forward like when you compare photography crop VS FF. Consider your output for 1080p is a measly 20mbps is considered good, in the old days, I'de output to 12mbps to save space!!! Of course output isn't same as input since you need some video flexibility, but still, I think 100 is pretty decent.

I'm actually OK with APS-C video only, like the EOS-R. Hands down biggest problem is when you're limited in lenses or switch between video and photo, you're stuck with different focal lengths..........

I'm ok shooting purely APS-C video, but I definitely prefer FF photography. At the same time, I don't want to carry an APS-C kit AND FF kit.

It's difficult to find good balance, but I think I'm getting really close.

I may try the Sony 10-18 f4 and Tamron 17-28 f2.8. Heavily favoring the Tamron at this point, it's double the weight, less standard focal range, but more range when cropped. Either way, on the lens front, I think I'm in excellent shape. Recently on travel, I felt I had too many lenses and sent some back with my mom who was helping me with the kids

I also have the 12-24..... should use more often, may be even better than both alternative lenses, but I find it a bit heavy..... I should probably suck it up.....

I do enjoy your video's you've posted on POTN.

As you can see Kim and myself have friendly butting heads moments. He's a former 5dmk3 user and now is a devout, loyal Fuji follower now.

I still shoot and own Canon gear so my game plan is to buy the next Canon EOS R (dual card, non 5dmk4 sensor) body and natively adapt all of my Canon L glass with a OEM Canon adapter. This will be an interim solution for "fun". Planning to give my 5dmk3 away and replace it with a pro version EOS R and keep my 5dmk4 for now. Perhaps things will change when I buy an A7r4 or A9

I'm more comfortable with my post work with Sony files now. Just yesterday I almost bought a new A7R3. The discussion of a7r4 / 61MP is even making my local camera shop curious the draw to such high megapixels. I'm on hold with Sony gear as I'm either going to pick up an A9 or see what kind of sensor will be produced for the A74. Hoping to see a 30-36mp sensor (max) for a higher res sweet spot. Still considering A7r3 or 4 for higher res needs/wants for a pseudo Medium format look with fast primes.

Video wise you are over my head in specs and discussion. Video is the furthest from my usage in gear. In my scope of photography I do prefer FF when I demand bokeh, high iso challenging light situations and dynamic range.

Mundane images of fruit at a fruit stand in Granville Island Vancouver, BC. This image was taken with the budget Tamron 28-75mm which still shocks me in IQ. This was one reason where crop aps-c is fantastic in many ways but if your shooting f/2 aps-c prime lenses you might as well use f/2.8 zooms on a full frame in adequate lighting getting same dof. Still photography aspect I feel there are compromises and preferences that everyone has as a photog.

Video wise....I'll let video guys discuss specs and all

Here's my story of why I went mirrorless. In 2013 I bought a Canon 6D. It was my first FF camera and I bought it specifically for landscapes and a trip I took to New Zealand. I always loved the image quality of that camera even though it had limited auto focus capabilities. I got some great photos from that camera over the years.

Fast forward to this year and since I bought the 6D I've been married and adopted a (then) 10 year old boy who is now 15. He's into all kinds of action sports and I take a lot of photos of him and his friends on mountain bikes, trampolines, cliff jumping etc. While the 6D is still as good as it ever was on a tripod taking a landscape photo I found I was missing a lot of shots when I took photos of my son.

For $900 I picked up a Sony A6400 (I know I paid around $2000 for the 6D) and the difference in AF is astounding. The 11 FPS is a HUGE improvement. The 6D has been handed down to my son (and still works perfectly) and he is loving it. So far for this hobbiest photographer it has been a big win going mirrorless.