7D upgrade or 100-400 upgrade for wildlife photography

Hi all, I currently have the 7d with a 100-400 which I use as my primary gear for African safari trips - end up doing one every two years.

Would like to get better low light shots and was looking at upgrades since my gear is many years old now.

The 100-400 ii seems to be an awesome lens with better IS.

The 7d2 seems to offer better focus esp in low light and also ISO.

What would you recommend?

A new lens would provide better detail and IS.

A new camera would yield slightly better detail, a better AF system, and better high ISO.

kram wrote in post #18894414
Hi all, I currently have the 7d with a 100-400 which I use as my primary gear for African safari trips - end up doing one every two years.

Would like to get better low light shots and was looking at upgrades since my gear is many years old now.

The 100-400 ii seems to be an awesome lens with better IS.

The 7d2 seems to offer better focus esp in low light and also ISO.

What would you recommend?

You could explore the options of something like a Sony A7S series for low light as they're more affordable now and would net you a lot more range in low light performance, adapter will allow you to use your lens still.

Otherwise, it's all budget, and if you want to maximize your low light performance it will come from a camera sensor being better. You could try to use the better image stabilization in the camera lens, but I would not rely on IS in a once-per-two-year situation for low light when a better camera sensor will net you 1.5~2+ stops of high ISO performance in the first place over an older 7D sensor. Sure the 7D2 has a little better ISO performance. But a larger sensor and newer one will do even better. A used 1DX comes to mind if it's in the cards.

Really though, for a trip like this, once per 2 years, you could really just rent a body right? Why let it sit for 2 years for this? You could rent a top shelf body for the trip and continue enjoying your current setup minus the huge depreciation after buying it and waiting 2 years at a time.

Very best,

I had a 7d and a 100-400 V1 for birding.
I upgraded them together to a 7D2 and Sigma 150-600C.

I suspect the lens upgrade was the most impactful although I am very happy with the body upgrade too.

The Sigma may be something to consider as it gives a big bang for the buck and makes it potentially feasible to upgrade lens and body at the same time. Granted, it is not in the same class as the 100-400VII, but an interesting alternative.

kram wrote in post #18894414
Hi all, I currently have the 7d with a 100-400 which I use as my primary gear for African safari trips - end up doing one every two years.

Would like to get better low light shots and was looking at upgrades since my gear is many years old now.

The 100-400 ii seems to be an awesome lens with better IS.

The 7d2 seems to offer better focus esp in low light and also ISO.

What would you recommend?

What kind of light are you looking for the most improvement in? The lens probably is probably more helpful with well-exposed lower ISOs, where the noise is not terribly different between the two 7D models (the 7D seemed to AF well at f/5.6 in good light), but if you're shooting at high ISOs or pull up low ISO shadows, the 7D2 has an edge in noise character, and the 7D2 AF can see in lower light.

Either choice has its compromises, with different IS ability, AF speed, etc. The best answer is one you didn't ask for; 7D2 and 100-400 II! Maybe get the lens now, and then wait for 7D2 prices to drop when (if) its successor is released.

MalVeauX wrote in post #18902764
You could explore the options of something like a Sony A7S series for low light as they're more affordable now and would net you a lot more range in low light performance, adapter will allow you to use your lens still.

That's a major downgrade in pixels-on-subject; to 26% of the 7D!

39% the pixels-on-subject; what telephoto is often about.

MalVeauX wrote in post #18902764
Really though, for a trip like this, once per 2 years, you could really just rent a body right? Why let it sit for 2 years for this? You could rent a top shelf body for the trip and continue enjoying your current setup minus the huge depreciation after buying it and waiting 2 years at a time.

. .
I'm not sure where you got the impression that the OP only uses his camera gear during his once-every-two-years Africa trips. . Perhaps you misread his post? . . When looking at his website, it is apparent that he photographs a lot of other things and places besides African wildlife.

. .

Well well, didn't realize I was being pulled over by the POTN opinion police squad. I'll return to lurking.

Very best,

MalVeauX wrote in post #18902812
Well well, didn't realize I was being pulled over by the POTN opinion police squad.

I'm not the POTN opinion police. . I don't correct people on their opinions. . My remark had nothing to do with an opinion of yours. . It had to do with an assumption that you seem to have made in error, not your opinion. . If I see that someone is misguided on a point, I will usually point that out to them. . When my thinking is misguided, I appreciate it when folks point it out, because I want to think correctly.

I saw that you made a recommendation about renting a camera body instead of buying one, because the OP would only be using it once every two years. . I thought you may want to change that recommendation if you realized that he is using his camera gear on a regular basis.
.

MalVeauX wrote in post #18902812
I'll return to lurking.

Very best,

I like it when you are active here - the things you write about and share with us are interesting and very worthwhile - especially things like your thread about photographing the sun, and your backyard bird setup. . That is great stuff! . It would be a shame if you just lurk.

.

Thanks everyone for your inputs.

- I am not very conversant with the Sony range and that's going to mean a decent bit of time for research But will do some quick check if that's a path I want to pursue
- Yes, my camera usage is limited otherwise but I am trying to get back to more. For the most part, I think a body or lens upgrade will suit me than trying to rent. Especially because I am based in SG and not in the US
- Saw the Sigma 150-600 at a camera shop recently. Will look into that option as well
- As of now, still torn between camera first or lens first...pls keep your recommendations flowing

kram wrote in post #18903585
- As of now, still torn between camera first or lens first...pls keep your recommendations flowing

Perhaps looking at the relative costs involved would help you make the decision between a camera upgrade or a lens upgrade. . How much are you looking to spend? . Perhaps the overall cost is lower than you expected, and you would even be able to swing both upgrades!

Based on used prices here in the U.S., upgrading from a 7D to a used 7D2, you would incur a net cost of approximately $500. . This is based on being able to get $300 for your 7D, and being able to find a used 7D2 for $800, shipping included.

Also going by used prices in the U.S., upgrading from a 100-400 v1 to a 100-400 v2, you would incur a net cost of approximately $800. . This is based on being able to get $600 for your 100-400 v1, and being able to find a used 100-400 v2 for $1400, shipping included.

I realize that you are not located in the U.S., but I am only able to use U.S. prices, because those are the only ones I am familiar with.

My numbers may be off a little, but I do look at the asking and selling prices on the Fred Miranda classified ads regularly, as well as the classifieds here on this forum ..... so I'm not too far off. . This forum is generally better for selling gear, because members here tend to be willing to pay more for stuff, while Fred Miranda is generally more favorable to buyers, because members there don't ask as much for their gear when they go to sell it.

.

Hello!
I have gone down this same path. I had a 7D and a 100-400. I then tried the Tamron 150-600, both G1 and G2 models. I upgraded my camera to the 7DII and added a 5DIV. When I finally upgraded to the 100-400VII, and added the 1.4EXIII teleconverter, I found the setup that I thought fit me the best.

The 100-400 V II is a great lens. I like the image quality better than either of the Tamrons. The V II works very well with the 1.4EXIII, and the results are very good.

If I went back in time to my old self before any of these upgrades, I would recommend to me that I try the 100-400 V II upgrade first. That has had the biggest impact on my images (mostly birds and wildlife)...

And I might recommend you combine this with MalVeaux' idea. Get the lens now - they hold value more and tend to provide a great bang for the buck at this level... then rent a newer body and see what you think. You may decide you want to upgrade both over time - then you can use Tom's idea of selling your gear to help fund the newer equipment.

Whichever path you choose, I hope you keep taking pics and enjoying your photography!

Upgrade path is always going to be expensive. In this particular case I'd probably look into a new lens. Upgrading from 7D to 7Dmk2 is a good jump in IQ, MP and overall setup up.

I guess a key question would be budget?

I am not familiar with Safari's but if a person does not swap lenses I'd imagine there would be no issues of dust introduction into the camera. What is the duration of this trip? 1 week+ ??

The world of photography gear is so different now. If wildlife was my scope of photography I'd look into Sony mirrorless at this moment in time. I never ever considered Sony but it's seriously option "rich" now. If I used a new 200-600 f/5.6-6.3 this would provide great reach and it's not a super heavy lens. Specs wise the A7R4 will have the AF of a flagship sports camera Sony A9 as well as 61 MP. If you use sony FF mirrorless you can customize a button and put it in crop mode (1.5x) so your 600mm will be 900mm. The megapixels in crop mode will still be around 26MP!!! Low light will still surpass a 7dmk2 by a large margin. The Current A7R3 will still provide 18MP in crop mode while being a 42MP camera. Similar AF as the sony A73 which is no slouch.

I've been looking at examples of the Sony 200-600 and it's a very impressive lens that is cheaper than the Canon 100-400mk2.

I still feel more confident with Canon weatherproof seals but my point is that there are alternatives.

I personally would go for the lens first and wait to see what Canon announces at the end of this month, if the new Canon APS-C DSLR is a big upgrade then the prices on older used cameras will fall some more.

Canonuser123 wrote in post #18910155
I personally would go for the lens first and wait to see what Canon announces at the end of this month, if the new Canon APS-C DSLR is a big upgrade then the prices on older used cameras will fall some more.

It's understood that the 80D canon sensor is probably one of Canon's better aps-c sensors as far as dynamic range.

I'm doubtful Canon can match Sony's aps-c sensor. I'm hopeful they can match on their next version.

Mirrorless will not disappear. This is where Canon really has to improve to retain customers. I'd take the build of a 7dmk2 over a newer mirrorless Sony A6400 but the performance of the A6400 would surpass the 7dmk2.

This is really crazy times as far as hardware evolution is concerned.